ISAT Opt Out - Good or bad idea?

[Valmy]

Texas always had these tests and they were super easy to pass.  I do not anticipate them being a big deal for my kids.

Ours is, last I checked, called the The Texas Assessment of Knowledge and Skills.  When I was a kid it was called the Texas Educational Assessment of Minimum Skills and then the Texas Assessment of Academic Skills when I was in HIgh School.

Same freaking test though.

[merithyn]

Texas always had these tests and they were super easy to pass.  I do not anticipate them being a big deal for my kids.

Ours is, last I checked, called the The Texas Assessment of Knowledge and Skills.  When I was a kid it was called the Texas Educational Assessment of Minimum Skills and then the Texas Assessment of Academic Skills when I was in HIgh School.

Same freaking test though.

My complaint has nothing to do with how easy or hard it is to pass. My complaint is that it's a waste of valuable educational time for a test that doesn't prove anything regarding how well a school teaches or a student learns..

[Admiral Yi]

Meri, do you think that the Illinois test has *zero* value in measuring the progress of the retards?

[merithyn]

Meri, do you think that the Illinois test has *zero* value in measuring the progress of the retards?

I think that there is value in doing a general assessment of the student population, but I disagree with how these tests are used and how they're applied. Remember, I grew up in Iowa where, like Texas, standardized testing was a way of life. But it was handled very differently than it is here.

When I was in school, you did schoolwork, and then one week a year, you did the Iowa Test of Basic Skills. There was no prep for it other than one or two practice runs so we knew how to actually take the test (as in what was allowed in the classroom, how to fill in the bubbles, what you could and could not do before, during and after the tests, etc.). Then, test days came, we took the test in the morning, did regular classwork in the afternoon, and it was no big deal. The tests were used by the teachers and school administrators to assess how well we did, what classes to put us in the next year, and what areas to concentrate on for the classrooms as a whole. Money was funneled into the schools that weren't doing well to add special help, and special programs were added at the schools doing exceptionally well to help challenge the gifted kids.

It's entirely different here (and now). The tests take up more than a month to prep with special vocabulary lists taken directly from previous ISATs (and having nothing to do with the coursework the kids are actually working on), revisiting fundamentals in math and science (which is great, but for a month??), test-taking methodology, and a whole lot of stress put on making sure the kids are there (but specifically the kids who do well). Not only that, but that's a month where the kids aren't doing regular school work, or are doing a very stunted version of it. And how well the kids do dictates how much money the school district will get in the next school year. Not that money will be funneled in to HELP the schools but rather that if they don't do well they'll be PUNISHED by money being taken away!

So, I guess, long story short, I see value in standardized testing but not in the way that it's being done today.

[Grinning_Colossus]

Do other countries have standardized college admissions tests?

They're pretty common in Europe and East Asia. The Chinese one is a killer, given the competition.

[Admiral Yi]

Meri: it sounds like your beef is with the Illinois Dept. of Education then, not NCLB.  The only people who should be cramming for it are the remedials and the ESLs.

[merithyn]

Meri: it sounds like your beef is with the Illinois Dept. of Education then, not NCLB.  The only people who should be cramming for it are the remedials and the ESLs.

No one should cram for it. It's a test to see where people actually are, not to see how much they can force into their little minds the week or two before the test.

And I have an issue with the NCLB because of the funding aspect.

[Admiral Yi]

And I have an issue with the NCLB because of the funding aspect.

You think the federal government shouldn't be shoveling money at schools to improve the performance of poor-performing students?

[derspiess]

NCLB needs to go, but bring on the tests.  Test early, test often, and actually use the individual test scores to move kids into the appropriate academic programs.

I'm still a bit resentful that they mixed dumb kids in with smart kids in my elementary school and some of my junior high/high school classes.  Can you tell? 

[Admiral Yi]

I'm still a bit resentful that they mixed dumb kids in with smart kids in my elementary school and some of my junior high/high school classes.  Can you tell?

You're going to get crucified for this line bubba.

[Valmy]

NCLB needs to go, but bring on the tests.  Test early, test often, and actually use the individual test scores to move kids into the appropriate academic programs.

I'm still a bit resentful that they mixed dumb kids in with smart kids in my elementary school and some of my junior high/high school classes.  Can you tell? 

Thank Hod for honors classes.

[garbon]

Thank Hod for honors classes.

Yeah that's how I felt when in my honors classes one student as where France was on a map and one student stated that they really didn't think racism was an issue anymore...

[Valmy]

Yeah that's how I felt when in my honors classes one student as where France was on a map and one student stated that they really didn't think racism was an issue anymore...

Honors classes may not have been elitist enough but they were better than nothing.  Hey racism may not have been an issue for them

[garbon]

Honors classes may not have been elitist enough but they were better than nothing.  Hey racism may not have been an issue for them

Not personally suffering from an issue does not mean it isn't occurring.

[DGuller]

I'm still a bit resentful that they mixed dumb kids in with smart kids in my elementary school and some of my junior high/high school classes.  Can you tell?

Why, did it make you feel inferior?