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Auschwitz / Poland / Anti Semitism

Started by alfred russel, March 22, 2011, 02:47:01 PM

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alfred russel

March 22, 2011, 02:47:01 PM
Over the weekend I visited Auschwitz. After the guide was telling me about the deaths of some Polish prisoners, I asked him why I see swastika graffitti in Poland.

He said, "I think it is just a misunderstanding. For example, I am a soccer fan. The two biggest teams in Krakow are rivals. The first team refers to the others' supporters as dogs. The second team refers to the others' supporters as jews. These people don't understand what they are saying - it is a misunderstanding."

Martinus, as these people are your countrymen, can you provide any insight for us?
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

There's a fine line between salvation and drinking poison in the jungle.

I'm embarrassed. I've been making the mistake of associating with you. It won't happen again. :)
-garbon, February 23, 2014

Josquius

#1
March 22, 2011, 02:48:54 PM
What's wrong with dogs? :(
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The Brain

#2
March 22, 2011, 02:49:37 PM
Quote from: alfred russel on March 22, 2011, 02:47:01 PM
Over the weekend I visited Auschwitz.

You call that migration period?  :mad:
Women want me. Men want to be with me.

alfred russel

#3
March 22, 2011, 02:51:47 PM
Quote from: The Brain on March 22, 2011, 02:49:37 PM
Quote from: alfred russel on March 22, 2011, 02:47:01 PM
Over the weekend I visited Auschwitz.

You call that migration period?  :mad:

I cheated on the migration period.  :(
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

There's a fine line between salvation and drinking poison in the jungle.

I'm embarrassed. I've been making the mistake of associating with you. It won't happen again. :)
-garbon, February 23, 2014

Habbaku

#4
March 22, 2011, 02:54:03 PM
That sort of thing happens in Italy, too.  There are pictures of the Lazio and Livorno (I think those are the two) teams waving Nazi and USSR flags, respectively, as part of their rivalry.
The medievals were only too right in taking nolo episcopari as the best reason a man could give to others for making him a bishop. Give me a king whose chief interest in life is stamps, railways, or race-horses; and who has the power to sack his Vizier (or whatever you care to call him) if he does not like the cut of his trousers.

Government is an abstract noun meaning the art and process of governing and it should be an offence to write it with a capital G or so as to refer to people.
-J. R. R. Tolkien

dps

#5
March 22, 2011, 02:59:47 PM
Quote from: Habbaku on March 22, 2011, 02:54:03 PM
That sort of thing happens in Italy, too.  There are pictures of the Lazio and Livorno (I think those are the two) teams waving Nazi and USSR flags, respectively, as part of their rivalry.

But do any of them wave flags with pictures of dogs on them?




:)

Sahib

#6
March 22, 2011, 03:04:12 PM Last Edit: March 22, 2011, 03:07:40 PM by Sahib
Quote from: Tyr on March 22, 2011, 02:48:54 PM
What's wrong with dogs? :(

In Polish:
dogs=pigs, ie Police

curiously enough, the team in question just bought an Israeli player and their fans have absolutely no problem with that, while still making antisemitic remarks towards their rivals.
Stonewall=Worst Mod ever

alfred russel

#7
March 22, 2011, 03:06:08 PM
Quote from: Habbaku on March 22, 2011, 02:54:03 PM
That sort of thing happens in Italy, too.  There are pictures of the Lazio and Livorno (I think those are the two) teams waving Nazi and USSR flags, respectively, as part of their rivalry.

It isn't the same sort of thing at all. Poles spraypainting swastikas in Warsaw isn't that much different than Jews doing the same. It isn't like a German, Italian, or Frenchman being a Nazi (even if that is ridiculous as well).

Also, the fan base of a (major?) european city using "jew" as an insult in 2011 is just messed up.
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

There's a fine line between salvation and drinking poison in the jungle.

I'm embarrassed. I've been making the mistake of associating with you. It won't happen again. :)
-garbon, February 23, 2014

Sahib

#8
March 22, 2011, 03:11:53 PM
Quote from: alfred russel on March 22, 2011, 03:06:08 PM
It isn't the same sort of thing at all. Poles spraypainting swastikas in Warsaw isn't that much different than Jews doing the same. It isn't like a German, Italian, or Frenchman being a Nazi (even if that is ridiculous as well).

Also, the fan base of a (major?) european city using "jew" as an insult in 2011 is just messed up.

Soccer fans are largely sub-human scum.
Stonewall=Worst Mod ever

Martinus

#9
March 22, 2011, 04:22:55 PM
Quote from: alfred russel on March 22, 2011, 02:47:01 PM
Over the weekend I visited Auschwitz. After the guide was telling me about the deaths of some Polish prisoners, I asked him why I see swastika graffitti in Poland.

He said, "I think it is just a misunderstanding. For example, I am a soccer fan. The two biggest teams in Krakow are rivals. The first team refers to the others' supporters as dogs. The second team refers to the others' supporters as jews. These people don't understand what they are saying - it is a misunderstanding."

Martinus, as these people are your countrymen, can you provide any insight for us?

Welcome to Poland.

Incidentally, there is only one insult these people see to be worse than "Jew". Wanna wager what it is?

Martinus

#10
March 22, 2011, 04:25:22 PM
For the record, I went to a counter protest this year when the neonazis and nationalists tried to make their march in Warsaw on 11 November (the Polish Independence Day). We forced the fuckers to go through a different route.  :showoff:

alfred russel

#11
March 22, 2011, 04:26:15 PM
Quote from: Martinus on March 22, 2011, 04:22:55 PM
Quote from: alfred russel on March 22, 2011, 02:47:01 PM
Over the weekend I visited Auschwitz. After the guide was telling me about the deaths of some Polish prisoners, I asked him why I see swastika graffitti in Poland.

He said, "I think it is just a misunderstanding. For example, I am a soccer fan. The two biggest teams in Krakow are rivals. The first team refers to the others' supporters as dogs. The second team refers to the others' supporters as jews. These people don't understand what they are saying - it is a misunderstanding."

Martinus, as these people are your countrymen, can you provide any insight for us?

Welcome to Poland.

Incidentally, there is only one insult these people see to be worse than "Jew". Wanna wager what it is?

:console:
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

There's a fine line between salvation and drinking poison in the jungle.

I'm embarrassed. I've been making the mistake of associating with you. It won't happen again. :)
-garbon, February 23, 2014

Ed Anger

#12
March 22, 2011, 04:26:24 PM Last Edit: March 22, 2011, 04:40:13 PM by Ed Anger
Quote from: Martinus on March 22, 2011, 04:25:22 PM

Welcome to Poland.

Incidentally, there is only one insult these people see to be worse than "Jew". Wanna wager what it is?
:

FAG
Stay Alive...Let the Man Drive

alfred russel

#13
March 22, 2011, 04:28:07 PM
Quote from: Martinus on March 22, 2011, 04:25:22 PM
For the record, I went to a counter protest this year when the neonazis and nationalists tried to make their march in Warsaw on 11 November (the Polish Independence Day). We forced the fuckers to go through a different route.  :showoff:

You really have to explain--Polish nazis are a non sequitor. Does the ordinary pole realize that the real nazis had no use for them?
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

There's a fine line between salvation and drinking poison in the jungle.

I'm embarrassed. I've been making the mistake of associating with you. It won't happen again. :)
-garbon, February 23, 2014

Martinus

#14
March 22, 2011, 04:35:47 PM
Quote from: alfred russel on March 22, 2011, 04:28:07 PM
Quote from: Martinus on March 22, 2011, 04:25:22 PM
For the record, I went to a counter protest this year when the neonazis and nationalists tried to make their march in Warsaw on 11 November (the Polish Independence Day). We forced the fuckers to go through a different route.  :showoff:

You really have to explain--Polish nazis are a non sequitor. Does the ordinary pole realize that the real nazis had no use for them?

I don't get it either. But that thing being said, antisemitism in Poland has a long history. Many Poles were complicit in Holocaust, sometimes quite actively. Like a lot of Eastern European nations, we are quite a nasty bunch - and quite idiosyncratic in our hatred.

Only recently the idea that not all Poles were Jew-saving angels during WW2 (and the reality was quite the contrary) is starting to come through, thanks largely to a single guy (a half Polish half Jewish historian) who just released his third popular history book (about how Poles got rich on Holocaust by looting homes abandoned by Jews and Auschwitz graves - and worse). He is universally hated by the right wing scum (just yesterday a bunch of Polish nationalist youth burned him in effigy - quite chilling, considering what imagery this invokes) as being "anti-Polish slanderer".

This country is changing - being dragged kicking and screaming by the elites into what seems like the European mainstream but it will take at least a generation (assuming no nasty thing happens that fucks it up) before it will be a proper modern society. That's why I hate it (and the role of the Polish catholic church, which is like an avatar of all these nationalistic, anti-semitic phobias) so much.
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