Crusader Kings 2 Redux

[garbon]

I got bored enough and read a little bit of that. His style is really off-putting. That said, I would agree with general notion that p'dox has now done what they said they wanted to avoid when they restarted CK2. Too many different, arcane (and sometimes downright bizarre) mechanics which come about if you are putting together new, cool things as you go.  Oh well, it is still enjoyable.

[Valmy]

17. There have been more such changes and surprises concerning the direction of the game. For example, at release the game had a largely different de iure kingdom setup than now. As for empires, there were two: the HRE and BYZ. This represented a Europe-centric perspective with a Byzantine-centric perspective in the east. De iure Byzantine Empire included Palestine (k_Jerusalem) — the way it was seen by Byzantines of the day during the first crusade. And even by some in Catholic Europe. Around patch 1.05 Paradox comes out of the closet with fantasy kingdoms and fantasy empires, totally changing the de iure philosophy of the game after release.

Um there was a Shi'ite and Sunni Empire as well.  The point was these were supposed to be the secular rulers of the religions.

But yeah I always hated the fantasy empires.  Especially the one that is basically France.

[garbon]

I have never understood the hate on fantasy empires. I mean it is just another tier in this game and given the oddities that can go down, would be weird if people couldn't tap into that tier.

[Tamas]

I have never understood the hate on fantasy empires. I mean it is just another tier in this game and given the oddities that can go down, would be weird if people couldn't tap into that tier.

For some reason, Empires are the most stable level of government in the game. You have two kingdoms with different cultures and the game is very nicely simulating the troubles of keeping that together. Gain an emperor title however and it suddenly becomes stable. At least thats my memory

[Valmy]

I have never understood the hate on fantasy empires. I mean it is just another tier in this game and given the oddities that can go down, would be weird if people couldn't tap into that tier.

Because they are incredibly valuable titles.  Before you had to claim supremacy over everybody in your religious group, which I think fits the ideology around Empires at the time.  They were supposed to be the legitimate secular rulers of the entire world.

Now you just need to dominate the local neighborhood.  Sometimes absurdly easy to do depending on the neighborhood.

[Valmy]

I have never understood the hate on fantasy empires. I mean it is just another tier in this game and given the oddities that can go down, would be weird if people couldn't tap into that tier.

For some reason, Empires are the most stable level of government in the game. You have two kingdoms with different cultures and the game is very nicely simulating the troubles of keeping that together. Gain an emperor title however and it suddenly becomes stable. At least thats my memory

Well yeah you don't have to worry about inheritances splitting off your kingdom titles into independent states.

[garbon]

I have never understood the hate on fantasy empires. I mean it is just another tier in this game and given the oddities that can go down, would be weird if people couldn't tap into that tier.

For some reason, Empires are the most stable level of government in the game. You have two kingdoms with different cultures and the game is very nicely simulating the troubles of keeping that together. Gain an emperor title however and it suddenly becomes stable. At least thats my memory

That's a fair reason. There should be forced to tear apart fantasy empires.

[garbon]

I have never understood the hate on fantasy empires. I mean it is just another tier in this game and given the oddities that can go down, would be weird if people couldn't tap into that tier.

Because they are incredibly valuable titles.  Before you had to claim supremacy over everybody in your religious group, which I think fits the ideology around Empires at the time.  They were supposed to be the legitimate secular rulers of the entire world.

Now you just need to dominate the local neighborhood.  Sometimes absurdly easy to do depending on the neighborhood.

I don't know if that's really true given that the world in CK2 extends beyond just the Christian world. I agree though that it could stand for them to be harder to form.

[Valmy]

I don't know if that's really true given that the world in CK2 extends beyond just the Christian world. I agree though that it could stand for them to be harder to form.

It is certainly true in the case of the Caliphate.  Naturally once you move into central Asia and India things get more complicated.  But back then we mostly just had Christians and Muslims.

[Caliga]

Was playing my game as the Norse king of England a bit more tonight.  This is the one where I inherited Normandy from my daughter by throwing her into a crevasse in the earth to appease Satan, or something like that.

Anyway, the King of Italy holds Boulogne which irritates me, and I noticed that my new vassal the Count of Eu holds claim over it, so I attacked Italy.  I seized Boulogne rather quickly but in the middle of the war King Ofeig of England died from the slow fever (appropriate I guess, since he was Slow), his son King Hysing II is only 7, and almost immediately yet another peasant revolt in Cumberland happened, followed by a Scottish national revolt.  While that shit was distracting me I failed to notice an Italian army march overland thru France, which destroyed by army on the Continent.  Then, the Byzanteens joined the war on the side of Italy so I decided it was time to throw in the towel and managed a white peace.  Hysing's personal demesne is limited to London as his infant brothers Magnus and Anders inherited Jorvik and Normandy and the rest of Sussex, respectively.  Good times.

[Caliga]

Well, it's taken nearly 200 years, but Norse England finally has primogeniture succession.

Norse England also has all of Normandy save Evreux (damn French Theocracy stole it from me), about half of Brittany, all of England proper (finally gained Cornwall), Gascony, nearly all of Scotland, and half of Sardinia (  )

My next goal is to convert from Norse to Norman culture and then start spreading it to England proper.  About half of England is Norse, and the other half is Anglo-Saxon.  Mortain, Rennes, and Rouen are all Norman, as is Marsan/Roquefort, so I guess I need to move my capital to one of those and then pick the switch culture event, right?

[Crazy_Ivan80]

My next goal is to convert from Norse to Norman culture and then start spreading it to England proper.  About half of England is Norse, and the other half is Anglo-Saxon.  Mortain, Rennes, and Rouen are all Norman, as is Marsan/Roquefort, so I guess I need to move my capital to one of those and then pick the switch culture event, right?

iirc yes

[Josquius]

So does this new walk of life add on give much worthwhile ?
I'm tempted to play again but really do feel like I've completed the game with my 1066 start mega Norse empire

[Josquius]

Re: empires.
I think they make sense, I like them. It adds a bit extra to the otherwise game ruiningly strict hierarchy. Let's you be king of kings which is something that did occasionally happen- Scottish King becoming a vassal of the English King for a brief period

[Caliga]

So does this new walk of life

Great song.