Crusader Kings 2 Redux

[PRC]

I don't like this DLC in particular because as Neil said it seems like this is content that should have been there to begin with.  But Crusader Kings has always been my favourite Paradox game and I think I will pre-order this.

[garbon]

I don't like this DLC in particular because as Neil said it seems like this is content that should have been there to begin with.  But Crusader Kings has always been my favourite Paradox game and I think I will pre-order this.

I think their line was that it was extra stuff that wasn't in the original budget and would have delayed release, cost extra money to the consumer to include in the main (not sure how that'd be more than $2/2euros..). I liked then when one poster pointed out that from just one family tree, there were 50 dead characters researched and implemented into the game - characters dead before 1066.  They weren't against the inclusion of the hundreds to thousands of dead characters included but thought it odd that such made it in but not the other.  Granted, of course, the latter is something that a great many more people could do - as compared to artwork.

[HVC]

did they re-research ancestors, or just use one from CK1? didn't those starting family tree go back aways too?

[garbon]

did they re-research ancestors, or just use one from CK1? didn't those starting family tree go back aways too?

How would I know? And yes for some yeah.

[HVC]

did they re-research ancestors, or just use one from CK1? didn't those starting family tree go back aways too?

How would I know? And yes for some yeah.

I was thinking you had moles in the beta test

[sbr]

Yeah, but I ain't gonna support that crap.  A historical simulator about dynastic politics that makes you pay extra to get the coat of arms of the families you'd be playing as? 

That is retarded anyway family's didn't have coats of arms.  The Plantagenet King of England's Coat of Arms was exactly the same as the Tudor one.  If a Habsburg is King of France I want the Coat of Arms to be that of France not some historical Habsburg Arms.  I do not understand this feature.

From what I can tell it looks like it'll be some additional way of keeping track of the various dynasties. If you are king of France, the nation's CoA is still that of France not of the Anjous.

Different note - p'dox has said there won't be expansion packs for CK2 - just DLCs.

For anyone interested in the new policy in their words

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/entry.php?1319-A-new-patching-and-expansion-policy-for-the-Internal-Development-Team

A new patching and expansion policy for the Internal Development Team

- How's it been in the past?

We've been making games for a long time, and for that entire time we've been very close to the consumer and worked hard on patching and expanding our games. One thing that we've always wanted to be better at is long-term support. We've usually budgeted part of a title's development on post-release support, a budget very much determined by how many people bought the game during the first month. However, eventually that budget will always run out, and even when we exceed that budget we don't always reach fan expectations on how the games should be.

The earlier solution was to make expansions and release a new one every year or so, with fixes and improvements added to the expansion, as well as new features. That solved a lot of things, but wasn't ideal.

- What's changing?

* Rewards!

People who pre-order a game or buy it on release day should be rewarded. A game at release should come with benefits that someone who waits will have to pay extra to get, and a handful that are entirely exclusive.

For example, we plan to have a certain sub-forum which only 'true fans' of our internal titles can access where we'll let those people have a larger input on what we'll focus on for further development during the earliest part of the game's life-cycle. Of course, there'll also be a special icon indicating that you're a true fan, as well as unique avatars.


* Communication!

We've always had a history of talking with our fans, but we aim to take this even further. We've started with a more direct communication about how patch development is going on for Sengoku. We want even more transparency about what we're doing and why. Besides having a lot of communication going on in various threads, we aim to to have a weekly update about patching progress and what we're working on.


* Stronger patching!

In the past we devoted ourselves utterly to a game's patches for about 3 to 12 man-months. Some games received an insane amount of work (like HoI3) and some needed less. However, patching isn't just about fixing bugs, it's also about improving a title and taking it to the next level of fun. We want to do everything we can to patch a game for longer, with monthly updates including bugfixes, sure, but also AI improvements, gamebalance, and even new features.

* Modular expansions!

This is the big one. In the past, we've released expansions that saw a loss of support for the base game, making for an "all or nothing" approach for the consumer, but supporting multiple executables just wasn't feasible for our small team and we needed to sell expansions to continue supporting the product. Hardly ideal for anyone who didn't want some of the features in an expansion. So, this is something we've thought a lot about in the last year, and have finally decided on a solution.

We've developed a new system to handle modular expansions so that you can buy the small packages that you want when they're released, and it will all be using the same executable, so whichever expansions you own your game will see continued support. There will be no problems with this in multiplayer, and if you have bought one expansion and your friend has bought another, you can still play together. You will have access to the features you bought and your friend the features he bought. Alternatively, if you'd prefer you'll be able to toggle any expansions "off" before the game starts.

We also aim to release smaller expansions and more regularly, maybe once every second month, containing more focused features so that you can buy the ones you want, skip whatever you like and get the most for your money.

We want the process to be as painless and non-intrusive as possible. There will be an in-game store where you can browse all released material and buy them quickly, using for instance Steam or Paradox Connect. There will be no activation limits or the like, nor will you need to be online after purchasing, unless you upgrade or change computer in which case you'll need to log in again.


- How will this work?

Starting with Crusader Kings II and all titles going forward where we're planning DLC, we'll be working on this policy. We hope that you'll like this new development. Ideally, Crusader Kings II should be the only title you need to play for the next few years (...until we make a new grand strategy game).

TL,DR - Early adopters get more benefits, we'll be patching games for longer and expansions will be modular so your installation of the game will always see continued patching.

In that sense the new modular DLC plan seems like a good plan.  They do say that MP won't be affected, but we will have to see.

[Darth Wagtaros]

IT could be. Depends on how its released. Two bucks a piece for a bunch of crap wouldn't be a big deal. Two bucks a piece for fixes to make the game worth playing, that add up to half the game price would.

[sbr]

That's the thing, the DLC isn't supposed to fix the game anymore. 

[garbon]

That's the thing, the DLC isn't supposed to fix the game anymore. 

Which if that's the case - what point is there in buying a p'dox product?

[garbon]

did they re-research ancestors, or just use one from CK1? didn't those starting family tree go back aways too?

How would I know? And yes for some yeah.

I was thinking you had moles in the beta test

No, literally just what I read in 5 minutes on the CK2 forum.

[dps]

Yeah, but I ain't gonna support that crap.  A historical simulator about dynastic politics that makes you pay extra to get the coat of arms of the families you'd be playing as? 

That is retarded anyway family's didn't have coats of arms.  The Plantagenet King of England's Coat of Arms was exactly the same as the Tudor one.  If a Habsburg is King of France I want the Coat of Arms to be that of France not some historical Habsburg Arms.  I do not understand this feature.

From what I can tell it looks like it'll be some additional way of keeping track of the various dynasties. If you are king of France, the nation's CoA is still that of France not of the Anjous.

Different note - p'dox has said there won't be expansion packs for CK2 - just DLCs.

For anyone interested in the new policy in their words

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/entry.php?1319-A-new-patching-and-expansion-policy-for-the-Internal-Development-Team

A new patching and expansion policy for the Internal Development Team
<snip>

I was about to give in and buy the dang thing, but after reading that, screw it.

[sbr]

Yeah, but I ain't gonna support that crap.  A historical simulator about dynastic politics that makes you pay extra to get the coat of arms of the families you'd be playing as? 

That is retarded anyway family's didn't have coats of arms.  The Plantagenet King of England's Coat of Arms was exactly the same as the Tudor one.  If a Habsburg is King of France I want the Coat of Arms to be that of France not some historical Habsburg Arms.  I do not understand this feature.

From what I can tell it looks like it'll be some additional way of keeping track of the various dynasties. If you are king of France, the nation's CoA is still that of France not of the Anjous.

Different note - p'dox has said there won't be expansion packs for CK2 - just DLCs.

For anyone interested in the new policy in their words

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/entry.php?1319-A-new-patching-and-expansion-policy-for-the-Internal-Development-Team

A new patching and expansion policy for the Internal Development Team
<snip>

I was about to give in and buy the dang thing, but after reading that, screw it.

What about that changed your mind?

[dps]

In the old days, Paradox didn't talk about communicating with the customers and continuing to improve the games after release much--they just did it.  The more they've talked about it, the less they've done it.  As much as they're talking about it now, they ain't gonna do nothin' else.

[garbon]

In the old days, Paradox didn't talk about communicating with the customers and continuing to improve the games after release much--they just did it.  The more they've talked about it, the less they've done it.  As much as they're talking about it now, they ain't gonna do nothin' else.

It does seem like more effort has gone into their brand messaging than action.

[Drakken]

Johan has repeatedly said that gameplay improvements for CK2 would come through patches, not DLCs. DLCs are for things that are not necessary to the gameplay itself, like graphics, music, sprites, or quaint sets of events.

I don't give a damn about playing Republics, but I'd like to play the Turks. So I could pass a Republic-aimed DLC, but go for the Muslim one.