82 percent of US schools may be labeled 'failing'

[grumbler]

No, I didn't imply that this was your position, but I may have mocked your simplistic approach to a complex problem.

What do you want-- a position paper?

Is that the false dilemma you are trying to sell today?  The choice between a simplistic approach to a complex problems and "a position paper?" Sorry, but no sale.

[The Brain]

Education is one case where I seriously wish we were more like Europe.

Elaborate.

[derspiess]

Education is one case where I seriously wish we were more like Europe.

Elaborate.

On a high level, it would be nice to spend less than what we spend now & get better results.  IIRC the US spends more $ per student than any Euro country besides Luxembourg, and we're way below Europe in terms of academic performance. 

A little more specifically (though I'm still sort of generalizing), from what I have gathered European educational systems tend to more proactively identify kids' abilities & aptitude, and route kids through the type of education that is better tailored to their abilities.  Seems to be a lot less political correctness built into the system than what we have in ours.

Over here in our public school system (and again I'm generalizing-- some states/districts are a lot better than others), people seem to be overly concerned with "inclusiveness" & self-esteem.  People screech in horror over testing kids early on and segmenting kids based upon aptitude because it "limits their potential", ignoring the facts that less intelligent kids' academic potential is already limited & that you're limiting the brighter kids' potential by lumping them & the less-bright kids into the same classes.

[dps]

You're also limiting the less-bright kids that way, too.  If they goal is to get every child the best possible education, then you need to identify each child's needs and aptitude, not try to push them all into the same mold.

[Valmy]

You're also limiting the less-bright kids that way, too.  If they goal is to get every child the best possible education, then you need to identify each child's needs and aptitude, not try to push them all into the same mold.

Yep.  The pressue kids who have neither the desire nor aptitude to go to college get to go to college is ridiculous.  So many schools rank their success solely on percentage who go on to college as if that is the only path for success in life.

[MadImmortalMan]

You're also limiting the less-bright kids that way, too.  If they goal is to get every child the best possible education, then you need to identify each child's needs and aptitude, not try to push them all into the same mold.

Exactly.

[The Brain]

Education is one case where I seriously wish we were more like Europe.

Elaborate.

On a high level, it would be nice to spend less than what we spend now & get better results.  IIRC the US spends more $ per student than any Euro country besides Luxembourg, and we're way below Europe in terms of academic performance. 

A little more specifically (though I'm still sort of generalizing), from what I have gathered European educational systems tend to more proactively identify kids' abilities & aptitude, and route kids through the type of education that is better tailored to their abilities.  Seems to be a lot less political correctness built into the system than what we have in ours.

Over here in our public school system (and again I'm generalizing-- some states/districts are a lot better than others), people seem to be overly concerned with "inclusiveness" & self-esteem.  People screech in horror over testing kids early on and segmenting kids based upon aptitude because it "limits their potential", ignoring the facts that less intelligent kids' academic potential is already limited & that you're limiting the brighter kids' potential by lumping them & the less-bright kids into the same classes.

Just don't become more like Sweden then.

Except maybe that school vouchers (like we have in Sweden) seem to work reasonably well.

[derspiess]

Just don't become more like Sweden then.

What's wrong with the Swedish system?  Hard to imagine it being worse than ours.

Except maybe that school vouchers (like we have in Sweden) seem to work reasonably well.

The mere mention of the word "vouchers" draws screams from the left.  The Dems & teachers unions have managed to stamp them out in many (most?) places they've been used-- even the ones intended to help poor urban black kids who are stuck in some of the country's worst public schools.

[The Brain]

Just don't become more like Sweden then.

What's wrong with the Swedish system?  Hard to imagine it being worse than ours.

There is a very strong tradition (since the 70s) of wanting to make all students suck equally hard. Since, you know, anything else is elitism. The left with its strange and tragic combination of anti-intellectualism and negative attitude towards practical skills dominates the education establishment. The current rightish government is trying to make things better but it's a difficult task.

Student results are in freefall. When I started uni in 94 we were significantly less prepared than previous generations, and these days the situation is a LOT worse.

The vouchers seem to work though, let parents who give a fuck find schools that produce results. The left hates them, which can only mean they're great.

[Grinning_Colossus]

Education is one case where I seriously wish we were more like Europe.

Elaborate.

[grumbler]

There is a very strong tradition (since the 70s) of wanting to make all students suck equally hard. Since, you know, anything else is elitism. The left with its strange and tragic combination of anti-intellectualism and negative attitude towards practical skills dominates the education establishment. The current rightish government is trying to make things better but it's a difficult task.

Student results are in freefall. When I started uni in 94 we were significantly less prepared than previous generations, and these days the situation is a LOT worse.

The vouchers seem to work though, let parents who give a fuck find schools that produce results. The left hates them, which can only mean they're great.

The advantage of voucher systems (and charter schools, which the left seems to find more acceptable) is that schools can be created that cater to the needs of those left behind in the regular school system.  The factory model of education is a huge problem.

Having said that, I think it is equally an error to type students into a track.  Kids change, and a good education system needs to allow students to change tracks as they mature and their interests change.  A student/school mismatch is as big a problem when the school is under-demanding as it is when it is over-demanding.  Vouchers allow parents to have a much grater voice (but that's still an issue when parents don't give a shit or don't want to make the effort even when they do care, which is a lot of the time).

[jimmy olsen]

Nice to see they're thinking of revising the standards. I want to know more about that Race for the Top program. Anyone know any good nonpartisan groups that have evaluated its effectiveness?

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Politics/2011/0314/No-Child-Left-Behind-Why-Congress-will-struggle-to-hit-Obama-s-deadline

No Child Left Behind: Why Congress will struggle to hit Obama's deadline

President Obama wants No Child Left Behind revised by the fall. The Senate is working toward a bipartisan compromise, but House Republicans want to shrink the federal role in education.

By Gail Russell Chaddock, Staff writer / March 14, 2011
Washington

President Obama's call to Congress to significantly revise the nation's top education law, No Child Left Behind, by the first day of the new school year faces tough headwinds on Capitol Hill, despite broad agreement on needed fixes.

Both Republicans and Democrats agree that NCLB's achievement standards are too rigid. The Department of Education estimates that, according to those standards, more than 80 percent of the national K-12 schools may be labeled as failing this year – up from 37 percent last year.

But Mr. Obama's plans to reform NCLB come to a Congress preoccupied by budget matters and to House Republicans eager to reduce federal influence in education. With the current year's budget still living week to week on stopgap funding measures – followed by battles over the fiscal year 2012 budget and a highly controversial measure to raise the national debt ceiling – an education deal on the president's timetable looks unlikely.

The Obama administration's proposed fixes include: improving standards and assessments, giving high-performing schools more flexibility and the lowest-performing schools more help, and recruiting better teachers and rewarding them for how effectively they improve student performance.
Senate vs. House

The Senate has been working toward a bipartisan agreement on education reform for more than a year and hopes to complete work on the reauthorization of NCLB this spring. But the House is just getting started – and the mantra of the new majority House Republicans is: We're broke, so we can't afford it. They aim to scale back education spending and the federal role in local schools.

"Although we have our different approaches, everyone agrees current law is broken and in need of repair," said US House Education and the Workforce Committee chairman John Kline (R) of Minnesota and subcommittee chair Duncan Hunter (R) of California in a statement on Monday. "The status quo is failing both students and tax payers; it is time we reconsidered the role of the federal government in our schools."

On Monday, Obama rebuked this suggestion. "Let me make it plain: We cannot cut education," he said.

A telling sticking point is whether to renew funding for President Obama's signature Race to the Top grants. In an unprecedented move, the Democrat-controlled Congress gave the Education Secretary Arne Duncan a $4 billion fund to use at his discretion to leverage education reform. The Obama administration calls Race to the Top the most effective program in the department's history and is proposing $1.4 billion to fund the program for the balance of the fiscal year.

But the Republican-controlled House last month voted to zero out funding for the program. "The federal role in education is a history of underperformance, hype, and false promises," said Rep. Peter Roscam (R) of Illinois, the chief deputy whip, at a press briefing on Feb. 28.

The move to involve the federal government in standards-based reform has been a priority of the last four presidents. Despite opposition from GOP conservatives, President George H. W. Bush launched the concept with the support of top business groups. President Clinton, who campaigned to become "the education president," won legislation that used federal aid to leverage more accountability for results.

With the support of then-Sen. Edward Kennedy (D) of Massachusetts and Rep. John Boehner (R) of Ohio, President George W. Bush passed NCLB, which gave Washington a heightened role in the nation's classrooms. It set up rules to measure whether schools were demonstrating "adequate yearly progress" in reading and math, including a goal that all children should reach proficiency in these fields by 2014.

Republican conservatives went along during the NCLB debates. But with the federal deficit at $1.6 trillion, House conservatives – especially many in the 87-member GOP freshmen class – are now pushing back.

"There's a strong element in the Republican caucus that wants to do away with a federal role in education," says Jack Jennings, president of the Center on Education Policy. "The prospects of getting reauthorization are improving because of the president and Senate leadership, but the main obstacle will be the tea party in the House."

Sharp cuts in federal education funding could threaten implementation of several reforms, such as common core standards in English and math already adopted by 43 states. Another possible casualty would be systems to measure the effectiveness of teachers – a key to the reform goal of rewarding teachers according to their ability to raise student achievement.

Says Mr. Jennings: "The reforms may be stillborn because there won't be the money to put them in place.

[Richard Hakluyt]

Britain is introducing "free schools" that are based on the Swedish experience.

http://www.education.gov.uk/schools/leadership/typesofschools/freeschools

The Left hates them of course, people should never be allowed input into how their tax money is spent, Big Brother knows best.