TV/Movies Megathread

[The Minsky Moment]

Many times I've mentioned this is one of my big Sci fi and fantasy pet peeves.
Small village of 1000 people completely isolated from outsiders for 1000 years?
Yet....everyone is white except for one black extra.
Sure sure. Genes can hide in the background before popping out unexpectedly.... But really it's just crap casting of extras. They didn't think about it logically.


Black Anne Boleyn or Asian Russian nobles on the other hand I'm fine with. World building isn't at the core of what these shows are doing. They're about the characters and race blind casting is a valid choice.

I don't think the idea is that any of them are actually white or black or asian. They are just characters, and their identity, personality, and story is not more relevant to their ethnicity then their hair or eye color or whether they are tall or short.

Just ignore it.

They aren't characters. They're set dressing. And just as worthy of note as Romans wearing Rolexes.

I'm curious about how you are so certain about the way genetics and phenotypic expression works in a completely fictional universe with magic etc.

Maybe some people are born with lighter skin color because Mom had vanilla ice cream just before conception.

[garbon]

So as I said I don't have racial hangups like apparently multiple white people do on this forum.

I suspect that you have more racial hangups then most people on Languish. Maybe not ALL people....

It is true that race is probably a topic that comes up more often for me than the average Languishta given that I'm a non-white person often in white dominated spaces.

However, I don't really hold a candle to all the consideration that many appeared to have had about WoT's casting. Only thought I had about race when watching was oh cool they have a diverse cast and then thought no more about race until this thread.

[Valmy]

My issue with Foundation was that it was designed to be trendy and so despite having such unique and iconic source material felt kind of generic. I gather from what is being said here that WoT is kind of the same thing just for fantasy?

[Sheilbh]

However, I don't really hold a candle to all the consideration that many appeared to have had about WoT's casting. Only thought I had about race when watching was oh cool they have a diverse cast and then thought no more about race until this thread.

I didn't notice with WoT until this thread - howevver I don't think that was anything to do with my views/attitudes on race so much as my flaming homosexuality. I just don't think about the practicalities of procreation ever so it never even really occurred to me

[Valmy]

So as I said I don't have racial hangups like apparently multiple white people do on this forum.

I suspect that you have more racial hangups then most people on Languish. Maybe not ALL people....

It is true that race is probably a topic that comes up more often for me than the average Languishta given that I'm a non-white person often in white dominated spaces.

However, I don't really hold a candle to all the consideration that many appeared to have had about WoT's casting. Only thought I had about race when watching was oh cool they have a diverse cast and then thought no more about race until this thread.

I mean what they are saying is that diversity is an indication of a cosmopolitan location. Having a small isolated group, at least one isolated for a long period of time, all being diverse would be very different from how it works at least in this reality. So saying how that impacted suspension of disbelief is not necessarily some indication of some extreme psychological hang-ups.

[garbon]

It is true that race is probably a topic that comes up more often for me than the average Languishta given that I'm a non-white person often in white dominated spaces.

However, I don't really hold a candle to all the consideration that many appeared to have had about WoT's casting. Only thought I had about race when watching was oh cool they have a diverse cast and then thought no more about race until this thread.

I mean what they are saying is that diversity is an indication of a cosmopolitan location. Having a small isolated group, at least one isolated for a long period of time, all being diverse would be very different from how it works at least in this reality. So saying how that impacted suspension of disbelief is not necessarily some indication of some extreme psychological hang-ups.

Personally, it feels wholly unnecessary. Why would that be what impacts one's suspension of disbelief when you've orc creatures and people casting magic? And as Joan says why in such a word would we assume race works in the same way?

It also feels to me a bit naive as only solution would be to have only all white casting () or to have only brown/black people cast as those leads and thus it'd be positioned as a show about race (aka "that black show").

[grumbler]

These Wheel of Time folks don't know much about horses or bows, do they? 

I do like that the producers didn't cast pretty people for these roles.  The acting isn't great, but at least the casting isn't stereotypical.

[Syt]

didn't cast pretty people

You mean: "character actors" (at least that seems to be the go to term when a famous actor who didn't have traditionally good looks dies).

[viper37]

It also feels to me a bit naive as only solution would be to have only all white casting ()

so, you are hung up about race!

[Josquius]

Visit Brazil. Wildly different phenotypes pop up in the same family and it's not because of adultery.

True. As mentioned you do occasionally see Liam Gallagher (US)'s out there in the world. But these are rare and they're usually not too far down the family tree.
They're also drawing from a very inter-mixed baseline even before the known isolation point.

I'm curious about how you are so certain about the way genetics and phenotypic expression works in a completely fictional universe with magic etc.

Maybe some people are born with lighter skin color because Mom had vanilla ice cream just before conception.

It crops up even in settings where you are dealing with base line humans where the laws of genetics work as we know them.

If there's a fantasy setting where race does work so radically different.... Then I'd expect to see that explored. Such a major and non-genre standard change to how humans work you'd logically expect to be a major plot point (then you would be getting into 'that show about race' of course).
I'd actually be interested to see the 'anime hair colour' thing lampshaded just once with an attempt to explain it.

As said this is just something on a level of "Coffee cup in Westeros, lol" rather than "This show is unwatchable with its race mixing!". But it occurs frequently enough to be a common nitpick for me.

[Berkut]

It is true that race is probably a topic that comes up more often for me than the average Languishta given that I'm a non-white person often in white dominated spaces.

However, I don't really hold a candle to all the consideration that many appeared to have had about WoT's casting. Only thought I had about race when watching was oh cool they have a diverse cast and then thought no more about race until this thread.

I mean what they are saying is that diversity is an indication of a cosmopolitan location. Having a small isolated group, at least one isolated for a long period of time, all being diverse would be very different from how it works at least in this reality. So saying how that impacted suspension of disbelief is not necessarily some indication of some extreme psychological hang-ups.

Personally, it feels wholly unnecessary. Why would that be what impacts one's suspension of disbelief when you've orc creatures and people casting magic? And as Joan says why in such a word would we assume race works in the same way?

It also feels to me a bit naive as only solution would be to have only all white casting () or to have only brown/black people cast as those leads and thus it'd be positioned as a show about race (aka "that black show").

Exactly. Like I said, the show is not specifically ABOUT human ethnicities. So again, the fact that one character is black and another is white and another brown is as relevant as the fact the some of blue eyes and some brown eyes and some are blond and some have brown hair and some are tall and some are short.

You *could* have a show where the height of the characters are relevant to the story, in which case you should pay attention to it - maybe one about basketball players or something.

WoT, so far as I can tell, is not going for that. If a character is Asian, it doesn't mean anything in particular, and they don't need to "explain" why.

[viper37]

Maybe some people are born with lighter skin color because Mom had vanilla ice cream just before conception.

I'm guessing that if there were variations on how things over there are different then over here, they would be explained, in universe.

If you read the Witcher books, you understand, within this universe, why there are monsters and magicians and non humans.  It does not explain how a tree can impregnate a woman, but it does not happen in this universe either.

[grumbler]

didn't cast pretty people

You mean: "character actors" (at least that seems to be the go to term when a famous actor who didn't have traditionally good looks dies).

A character actor was one who made their name in famous supporting, not starring, roles.  Usually they were chosen to play eccentric characters or because the actor had some memorable feature like voice or mannerisms.

[grumbler]

I'm guessing that if there were variations on how things over there are different then over here, they would be explained, in universe.

No, they'd only be explained if they were significant to the story.  Storytellers have a fixed amount of audience attention to tell their story, so they can't stop to explain everything (like why leaving a bow strung when you are just carrying it around doesn't completely stretch out the bowstring, or how they can gallop their horses for hours without wearing them out  ).

[Sheilbh]

It also feels to me a bit naive as only solution would be to have only all white casting () or to have only brown/black people cast as those leads and thus it'd be positioned as a show about race (aka "that black show").

Although I do kind of get the idea of different bits of a fantasy world having people who look differently.

Unfortunately this can tend to overlap with a weakness for possibly a little bit of stereotyping from a real example in terms of what those cultures look like in fantasy writing so is probably best avoided