Should citizens with a permanent residence in a different country vote?

[The Brain]

No.

Only if you pay taxes in that nation.

That is the primary reason I am in favor of American abroad voting.  If you are an American citizen you pay taxes regardless of where you make your money.  The great federal beast must be satiated.

You fucking Communist. Why don't you think that they shouldn't have to pay taxes instead?

[grumbler]

That is the primary reason I am in favor of American abroad voting.  If you are an American citizen you pay taxes regardless of where you make your money.  The great federal beast must be satiated.

You deduct taxes you pay to the country in which your income is earned, though, so you don't pay a "full share" of US taxes (and often no taxes at all).

However, US citizens indefinitely resident overseas (other than diplomatic and military personnel and families) are generally not allowed to vote for local officials or ballot measures, so their impact will usually be pretty small.

[Valmy]

However, US citizens indefinitely resident overseas (other than diplomatic and military personnel and families) are generally not allowed to vote for local officials or ballot measures, so their impact will usually be pretty small.

Yep only in federal elections.  You have to have residence to vote in local elections.

[grumbler]

Yep only in federal elections.  You have to have residence to vote in local elections.

Well, you have to have residence in Federal elections as well (for the purposes of deciding which candidates/electors your vote goes to).  It is just that federal rules for residence allow you to claim a residence in which you last dwelt, as opposed to the one in which you now dwell.  States and localities are free to have different rules, and presumably they do.

[dps]

Which is why I used the word "permanent". I thought it doesn't mean "temporary", Valmy.

What's "permanent" when it comes to residency, though?  If you're an American who works for a multi-national company that transfers you to, say, Paris, France, then you're as much a permanent resident of Paris as you would be a permanent resident of Dallas, Texas, if the company had transferred you there instead (unless the tranfer was for a specific period of time, which isn't the norm).

[MadImmortalMan]

No.

Only if you pay taxes in that nation.

That would disqualify about half of the Americans living in the USA from voting too.

[Admiral Yi]

That would disqualify about half of the Americans living in the USA from voting too.

Everybody pays FICA and FUTA.

[Josquius]

We should be yes. But with drastically less power than a proper seat at home would have.
e.g. just one or two seats for the whole of the British citizenry abroad (which actually numbers....something huge. Millions)

Though meh, I'm still registered as living at home and for postal voting. If I needed for vote I could have my mam do it for me.

[clandestino]

We should be yes. But with drastically less power than a proper seat at home would have.
e.g. just one or two seats for the whole of the British citizenry abroad (which actually numbers....something huge. Millions)

This is actually what happens with the Portuguese system. During legislative elections the diaspora gets to elect 4 MPs (out of 310), two from the "European" circle and the other two from the rest of the world.

These guys don't tend to influence results as they are shared among the two major parties, although it seems they get to elect center-right MPs a little bit more than the residents.

They also vote in Presidential elections (their vote goes together with the others), but as I'm aware they don't vote on local elections, unless still registered there, wich leads to some of the books being filled with "ghost" voters.

I'm not going into the problem of their right to vote, but I guess since emigrants money always represented an important part on the national economy this is a non issue at the moment (or ever if my memory serves me well) in this country.

[viper37]

Do you think people with your country's nationality/citizenship, who have a permanent place of residence in a different country, be allowed to vote in national elections in your country?

Poland allows it, partially as a nod to the emigrants who were forced one way or another to leave Poland during the communist regime, but I am not sure if this is a sound policy in an otherwise democratic country. Communism fell 20 years ago. People who wanted to could have come back by now, and more people left simply for financial reasons etc.  I don't see why people who do not contribute to the wellbeing of my country (e.g. by paying taxes, working here etc.) should have a say in its governance.

What do you think?

If you don't live in the country, you should not vote in it.

Exception being made of soldiers and various government employees who need to work outside the country, of course (embassies, consulate, etc).

Otherwise, if a private citizen decides to live elsewhere, he should not enjoy the various priviledges, like the right to vote, unless he has a permanent residence in the country.

[Josquius]

This is actually what happens with the Portuguese system. During legislative elections the diaspora gets to elect 4 MPs (out of 310), two from the "European" circle and the other two from the rest of the world.

These guys don't tend to influence results as they are shared among the two major parties, although it seems they get to elect center-right MPs a little bit more than the residents.

They also vote in Presidential elections (their vote goes together with the others), but as I'm aware they don't vote on local elections, unless still registered there, wich leads to some of the books being filled with "ghost" voters.

I'm not going into the problem of their right to vote, but I guess since emigrants money always represented an important part on the national economy this is a non issue at the moment (or ever if my memory serves me well) in this country.

Doesn't one in every two Brazillians have dual-Portuguese nationality? (exageration but...yeah, theres a lot of non-Portuguese Portuguese)

[DGuller]

My family could vote in Ukrainian elections until we got our US citizenship.  I thought that was silly, given that we wanted nothing to do with Ukraine.  People like us should have no business deciding on Ukrainian business.

[clandestino]

Doesn't one in every two Brazillians have dual-Portuguese nationality? (exageration but...yeah, theres a lot of non-Portuguese Portuguese)

Well, I don't know where you get that idea. Certainly there are some cases of that as I would guess exists also between other European countries and their former colonial areas.

I'm not sure on the details of the law, but I guess it would be easier to get the nationality if you prove that you are descendent of Portuguese and since there were plenty of migrational movements between the two countries that may applie.

Are you refering to something in particular, like football players or Brazilian migrant workers in the UK?

[Siege]

Do you think people with your country's nationality/citizenship, who have a permanent place of residence in a different country, be allowed to vote in national elections in your country?

No. Only citizens that are considered residents (maybe the same criteria as residency for tax purposes?) should be allowed to vote.

Only a german could say something like this.

[Duque de Bragança]

We should be yes. But with drastically less power than a proper seat at home would have.
e.g. just one or two seats for the whole of the British citizenry abroad (which actually numbers....something huge. Millions)

This is actually what happens with the Portuguese system. During legislative elections the diaspora gets to elect 4 MPs (out of 310), two from the "European" circle and the other two from the rest of the world.

These guys don't tend to influence results as they are shared among the two major parties, although it seems they get to elect center-right MPs a little bit more than the residents.

They also vote in Presidential elections (their vote goes together with the others), but as I'm aware they don't vote on local elections, unless still registered there, wich leads to some of the books being filled with "ghost" voters.

I'm not going into the problem of their right to vote, but I guess since emigrants money always represented an important part on the national economy this is a non issue at the moment (or ever if my memory serves me well) in this country.

The Portuguese abroad also vote for the European elections. They are as a matter of fact in a better position than most Portuguese to really understand it the importance of Europe.

Actually, historically the Portuguese left has always been hostile to the emigrant/non-resident vote (cf. Salgado Zenha "dar o direito de voto aos emigrantes seria um autêntico golpe de estado") and regularly tries to curtail it cf.  the prime minister Sócrates  and his bill vetoed by the current president Cavaco Silva. It was only about forcing the people to vote at the consulates (after closing many of them) but the devil is in the details.
Voting for local elections would seem odd to me though.

Funny to see that the Left always rallies against the vote of citizens abroad who contribute to the economy (no IRS but property taxes) or did the draft. At the same time, they want to give voting rights to non-European foreigners without any reciprocation clause 

It should be easy to guess position on this issue I'll even say that living abroad gives you an hindsight that most local voters sorely lack.