Straight exes - the quiet voice for gay marriage

[Valmy]

This has got to be the lamest reason ever given for gay marriage.

Are you smoking crack?  That is a serious problem that effects many many people.  Homophobia leading gays to get into straight marriages, have kids, do the whole thing then it all comes out and ruins the family.

Lamest reason my ass.  Fuck you.

[Admiral Yi]

Give me a shout when you've settled down.

[Berkut]

This has got to be the lamest reason ever given for gay marriage.

Are you smoking crack?  That is a serious problem that effects many many people.  Homophobia leading gays to get into straight marriages, have kids, do the whole thing then it all comes out and ruins the family.

Lamest reason my ass.  Fuck you.

Those are reasons for society to be more tolerant of gays, not for gay marriage.

Gays don't marry straight people because they are ok with being gay, but REALLY REALLY REALLY want to be married.

[Caliga]

As others have already pointed out, I don't think it's the same issue, though the two issues are (obviously) related.

[MadImmortalMan]

I know - another gay thread. 

You don't have to rolleyes--just use the gay megathread that is gay.

[Valmy]

Those are reasons for society to be more tolerant of gays, not for gay marriage.

Gays don't marry straight people because they are ok with being gay, but REALLY REALLY REALLY want to be married.

Well that's true.  I guess I just see them connected in my mind.

Alright then Yi I see what you are getting at I withdraw my Languishite flame.  I still disagree with you though.

[garbon]

I call bollocks.
Gay marriage isn't going to make some gays wish they were straight and enter into straight relationships.
It will only help those who are already utterly confirmed gays.

I'm not sure I agree that it is meaningless. After all, one of the reasons it took me a while to come out was because I thought being gay was something shameful. If there had been government recognize partnerships, that would have gone a long way for me.

[Martinus]

Gays don't marry straight people because they are ok with being gay, but REALLY REALLY REALLY want to be married.

You would be surprised.

One of my exes (who is either bi and tending gay or gay in denial) actually decided to try his luck with a chick because he thinks marriage is a stable institution and whatnot. Of course you may then say that he is not ok with being gay but it is a chicken and an egg dilemma and it is clear both things are related.

[Malthus]

I call bollocks.
Gay marriage isn't going to make some gays wish they were straight and enter into straight relationships.
It will only help those who are already utterly confirmed gays.

I'm not sure I agree that it is meaningless. After all, one of the reasons it took me a while to come out was because I thought being gay was something shameful. If there had been government recognize partnerships, that would have gone a long way for me.

Seems to me there is a big difference between not wishing to publicly announce one's homosexuality because of a fear of prejudice (perfectly understandable IMO) and going so far as to marry someone of the opposite sex.

The latter indicates real identity issues which I would imagine would not be remedied by access to gay marriage.

Maybe it could be argued that enacting gay marriage would be a social signal that would reduce homophobia, to the point where less folks would have such issues. But I think the better position is that its effect would be marginal. People in such denial as to actually go out and marry a woman, are not going to suddenly decide not to be in denial because they could now marry a man.

[Martinus]

Maybe it could be argued that enacting gay marriage would be a social signal that would reduce homophobia, to the point where less folks would have such issues. But I think the better position is that its effect would be marginal. People in such denial as to actually go out and marry a woman, are not going to suddenly decide not to be in denial because they could now marry a man.

Oscar Wilde was pretty sure he prefers boys, yet he married a woman.

[Malthus]

Maybe it could be argued that enacting gay marriage would be a social signal that would reduce homophobia, to the point where less folks would have such issues. But I think the better position is that its effect would be marginal. People in such denial as to actually go out and marry a woman, are not going to suddenly decide not to be in denial because they could now marry a man.

Oscar Wilde was pretty sure he prefers boys, yet he married a woman.

Oscar Wilde lived in a very different society than today's - for example, he spend some time in prision for liking boys.

[Martinus]

Maybe it could be argued that enacting gay marriage would be a social signal that would reduce homophobia, to the point where less folks would have such issues. But I think the better position is that its effect would be marginal. People in such denial as to actually go out and marry a woman, are not going to suddenly decide not to be in denial because they could now marry a man.

Oscar Wilde was pretty sure he prefers boys, yet he married a woman.

Oscar Wilde lived in a very different society than today's - for example, he spend some time in prision for liking boys.

The social change is not as big as you think. You are arguing from a perspective of a white upper middle class educated secular Canadian - it's quite different in Alabama or Poland, or among Latino or black homosexuals (one of the biggest causes of black female HIV infections, I believe, are guys who fuck men but marry women). The concept of being "true to oneself" is a rather recent phenomenon, and one that is not universally embraced, even in the West.

[Eddie Teach]

From the sounds of it, Alabama is a lot closer to Canada than to Poland.


From looking at a map too. 

[Martinus]

From the sounds of it, Alabama is a lot closer to Canada than to Poland.


From looking at a map too. 

Why do so many black or Latino MSM in the USA marry women then?

[garbon]

Seems to me there is a big difference between not wishing to publicly announce one's homosexuality because of a fear of prejudice (perfectly understandable IMO) and going so far as to marry someone of the opposite sex.

The latter indicates real identity issues which I would imagine would not be remedied by access to gay marriage.

Maybe it could be argued that enacting gay marriage would be a social signal that would reduce homophobia, to the point where less folks would have such issues. But I think the better position is that its effect would be marginal. People in such denial as to actually go out and marry a woman, are not going to suddenly decide not to be in denial because they could now marry a man.

Like Mart just suggested, I think it is a matter of location. From liberal Massachusetts I really had little to actually fear (perhaps some taunting at school) as my family had given me no indication whatsoever that they'd reject me.  However, for someone in a different situation, it isn't implausible.  In fact until sometime near 16 or 17, I'd succeeded in convincing myself that I was a bisexual (not as bad as a homosexual, surely!).