News:

And we're back!

Main Menu

What makes a person a particular race?

Started by merithyn, August 13, 2009, 09:27:38 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

merithyn

Is it their culture or their biology?

For instance, if a black person is adopted by a white family and raised culturally white, are they still "black"? Additionally, if a person has a Mexican father and a white mother, is raised not knowing Spanish but spends equal time with both, what race do they put down on the census form? (We're assuming no "other" exists on said form.)

My sister and I were raised Mexican culturally because we were fostered out when we were very young - I was three, my sister was two months old - and lived with said foster family until we were nearing our teen years. However, our biological family is Welsh and English, and we both lived with them during our teen years. My younger sister speaks Spanish fluently, but I only understand bits and pieces of it. What race are we?

P.S. Neil, I <3 you, but stay out. I'm seriously wondering what people think constitutes a "race" under these circumstances, sans troll.
Yesterday, upon the stair,
I met a man who wasn't there
He wasn't there again today
I wish, I wish he'd go away...

dps

While the concept of human races is basically a cultural construct, race isn't culture.  You're white.

Admiral Yi

Ever since Tiger Woods we've been living in the hybrid age.

merithyn

Quote from: dps on August 13, 2009, 09:36:41 PM
While the concept of human races is basically a cultural construct, race isn't culture.  You're white.

Why? I mean, if we had been adopted, would that then change?
Yesterday, upon the stair,
I met a man who wasn't there
He wasn't there again today
I wish, I wish he'd go away...

garbon

It is often what others perceive you to be.
"I've never been quite sure what the point of a eunuch is, if truth be told. It seems to me they're only men with the useful bits cut off."
I drank because I wanted to drown my sorrows, but now the damned things have learned to swim.

derspiess

Racially speaking, I'm 75% Buckeye & 25% West Virginian.  I grew up in West Virginia.  But now I live in Ohio.  What am I???  :unsure:
"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall

Sheilbh

Quote from: merithyn on August 13, 2009, 09:40:57 PM
Quote from: dps on August 13, 2009, 09:36:41 PM
While the concept of human races is basically a cultural construct, race isn't culture.  You're white.

Why? I mean, if we had been adopted, would that then change?
Because we've lived through times when race determined what rights you had, or if you had any at all.  I think that recent experience means we can see it in purely cultural terms.
Let's bomb Russia!

Neil

I do not hate you, nor do I love you, but you are made out of atoms which I can use for something else.

merithyn

Quote from: Sheilbh on August 13, 2009, 09:50:38 PM

Because we've lived through times when race determined what rights you had, or if you had any at all.  I think that recent experience means we can see it in purely cultural terms.

Does that work for blacks raised "white" or vice versa?
Yesterday, upon the stair,
I met a man who wasn't there
He wasn't there again today
I wish, I wish he'd go away...

Sheilbh

Quote from: merithyn on August 13, 2009, 09:54:01 PM

Does that work for blacks raised "white" or vice versa?
Yes.  Though I don't think you can be raised 'white' unless everyone else sees you as 'white' which no-one else will.

Edit: We can call this 'The Jerk' rule :p
Let's bomb Russia!

garbon

Quote from: merithyn on August 13, 2009, 09:54:01 PM
Does that work for blacks raised "white" or vice versa?

I don't think so. Once your skin has a tanner shade, one is blocked from that designation.
"I've never been quite sure what the point of a eunuch is, if truth be told. It seems to me they're only men with the useful bits cut off."
I drank because I wanted to drown my sorrows, but now the damned things have learned to swim.

merithyn

What I mean by "raised white" or "raised Hispanic" is that culturally you understand that way of life to be "normal". So, for me, eating rice and beans with tortillas with every meal is "normal", but for my other Welsh/English-Americans, that's "foreign". For a white person to be raised "black" they understand what someone else means when they say that greens and macaroni and cheese are essential for any meal to be complete.

Note: Yes, I completely understand that I'm feeding the stereotypes. I apologize in advance for doing so.
Yesterday, upon the stair,
I met a man who wasn't there
He wasn't there again today
I wish, I wish he'd go away...

merithyn

Quote from: garbon on August 13, 2009, 09:59:33 PM
Quote from: merithyn on August 13, 2009, 09:54:01 PM
Does that work for blacks raised "white" or vice versa?

I don't think so. Once your skin has a tanner shade, one is blocked from that designation.

So while a lighter-skinned person can claim a darker race due to culture, it cannot go the other direction?
Yesterday, upon the stair,
I met a man who wasn't there
He wasn't there again today
I wish, I wish he'd go away...

HVC

Your race is your skin colour ( skin colour further divided into things like facial features). Like Garbon said it's mainly a perception of how others see you. A black man from lousiana and a black man from California would have little in common, but both are black.

I imagine a child raised by parents of a different race must have it tough in a lot of cases. a black kid raised by white parent, for instance, will no doubt be seen as "black" by his white peers, and "too white" by his black peers. 
Being lazy is bad; unless you still get what you want, then it's called "patience".
Hubris must be punished. Severely.

derspiess

Quote from: merithyn on August 13, 2009, 10:05:42 PM
So while a lighter-skinned person can claim a darker race due to culture, it cannot go the other direction?

Yeah.  But of course a black person's fellow blacks may give him shit for "being white" if he acts too much that way.
"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall