2024 US Presidential Elections Megathread

[Gups]

I read that when asked whether climate change had anything to do with fossil fuels, not one of them raised his/her hand.

I should be numbed to his by now, but I still find it shocking.

I don't think any of them are that stupid.  But the people whose votes they are courting are, and so they all have to lie.  It's a shame.

Yes, hat's kind of what I find most shocking.

[Josquius]

It's made even more painful from the fact they haven't just failed to understand things.
They understand just fine.
It's just they've seen THE OTHERS favour doing something to solve the problem hence its woke and bad to believe in it.

[Valmy]

I read that when asked whether climate change had anything to do with fossil fuels, not one of them raised his/her hand.

I should be numbed to his by now, but I still find it shocking.

Ramaswamy said something like he knew climate change was a thing and caused by CO2 but we had to keep burning fossil fuels in order to make enough money to deal with climate change or something.

I thought ok well for a Republican that is at least not too bad. We are compelled to continue to burn fossil fuels in the short term. And then he does this. Ah well.

[Sheilbh]

It's made even more painful from the fact they haven't just failed to understand things.
They understand just fine.
It's just they've seen THE OTHERS favour doing something to solve the problem hence its woke and bad to believe in it.

I go back to wishing someone had branded Pfizer as the Trump vaccine that Democrats don't want you to get and Moderna as the lib vaccine that'll kill you.

It's not an indication of a healthy politics but it's a shame that the polarisation can't be taken advantage of to do something. Make solar and Tesla the Republican route to energy transition, say v wind and, I don't know, Leaf for Democrats. Again not great but it'd be good to keep moving.

FWIW I think the big win of the IRA is that it positioned lots of energy transition stuff not as fighting climate change but reducing dependency on and competing with China, plus it means I think there will be a green industrial complex with lobbying power who want their subsidies protected etc. I feel like turning something into a national security issue and getting corporate power behind it may not give us the satisfaction of sinners repenting, but might keep the US spending money on energy transition and getting to net zero.

[Valmy]

I read that when asked whether climate change had anything to do with fossil fuels, not one of them raised his/her hand.

I should be numbed to his by now, but I still find it shocking.

I don't think any of them are that stupid.  But the people whose votes they are courting are, and so they all have to lie.  It's a shame.

Yes, hat's kind of what I find most shocking.

Right wing media has spent decades convincing their viewers that human caused climate change is a malevolent scam designed to...do something bad. We who think climate change is a thing we have to deal with are evil to our cores.

Or we are stupid and brainwashed. Something like that.

And even the few times they admit that, in fact, we are right they then go on that we are stupid and brainwashed anyway because we are too hysterical about it. Climate cult!

Which is weird. A cult cannot be correct about its central tenants. If L Ron Hubbard actually had discovered all the secrets of humanity and Scientology really did give you super powers nobody would think they were a cult just because they were a little silly about it. We would be lining up for the super powers.

But, you know, are there wacky extremists with counter-productive ideas about environmentalism and climate change out there? Sure. So that will then get used. The point is: we are wrong about climate change. The exact way we are wrong about climate change shifts around as needed.

What impact this has on actual policies I don't know. Texas is a leader in renewable energy despite its leading politicians insisting wind and solar are nothing but evil conspiracies and climate change is a scam.

So I think this is a another matter of the tail wagging the dog. The right wing media compels the politicians to pretend like this is their position when it isn't really.

[HVC]

I sometimes wonder if Hansmeister is a liberal scientists scam for funding money.

[Gups]

I read that when asked whether climate change had anything to do with fossil fuels, not one of them raised his/her hand.

I should be numbed to his by now, but I still find it shocking.

Ramaswamy said something like he knew climate change was a thing and caused by CO2 but we had to keep burning fossil fuels in order to make enough money to deal with climate change or something.

I thought ok well for a Republican that is at least not too bad. We are compelled to continue to burn fossil fuels in the short term. And then he does this. Ah well.

I don't think he did - at least not according to this clip (and it also sounds like I was unfair about the hand raising)

https://www.independent.co.uk/tv/news/vivek-ramaswamy-gop-debate-climate-change-b2398433.html

"During the first 2024 GOP presidential debate on 23 August 2023 candidates were asked to raise their hands if they believed human behavior was causing climate change.

Nobody was able to raise a hand before Florida governor Ron DeSantis overtook the conversation by blasting President Biden over his handling of the Maui wildfires.

Vivek Ramaswamy was quick to join the conversation by saying he believed that "climate change agenda is a hoax." His statement was met with boos from the audience.

The only candidate to acknowledge climate change was South Carolina governor Nikki Haley."

[Sheilbh]

On the boos before he said the "climate change agenda is a hoax", he said "I'm the only person on this stage who isn't bought and paid for" - I think some people have said that it might have been booing that. It's not super-clear.

[Valmy]

I don't think he did - at least not according to this clip (and it also sounds like I was unfair about the hand raising)

I thought he did earlier. So I thought maybe he was alright, at least on my biggest issue. I just want the GOP to acknowledge this is going on and put forward some plan. Probably something like plant 40 trillion trees and just keep drilling or something, but still a plan.

But yeah during the debate he went on about the hoax thing. A hoax...perpetrated for over 40 years by millions of people over dozens of countries to achieve some goal unclear even to those of us that are in on it.

And bear in mind this guy got rich investing in big pharma. Why he thinks he can win over the conspiracy set is unclear. And he got boo'd for it anyway, what an idiot.

[Sheilbh]

And bear in mind this guy got rich investing in big pharma. Why he thinks he can win over the conspiracy set is unclear. And he got boo'd for it anyway, what an idiot.

Same reason Trump could chant "Drain the Swamp" - "I know you're for sale, I bought you."

Looking at the NYT coverage of a candidate who disagrees with birthright citizenship and 14 amendment. I continue to think nothing has been learned from 2016:

How Vivek Ramaswamy Broke Through: Big Swings With a Smile

With unchecked confidence and insults, the biotech entrepreneur baited his rivals into skirmishes that dominated Republicans first debate.

And I think mainstream like this or things like showing entire Trump rallies uninterrupted have played a bigger role in Trump's victory but also the mainstreaming of this politics than the fringe right alternative media.

[Savonarola]

Ramaswamy Says He'd Run the Government Like Elon Musk Runs Twitter: 'A Good Example Of What I Want To Do'

I don't use Twitter and the news about the recent changes hasn't meant anything to me; but, from what I've been able to piece together, Musk's leadership style seems a tad... mercurial.

[Valmy]

Same reason Trump could chant "Drain the Swamp" - "I know you're for sale, I bought you."

I don't know if "you can buy stocks in corporations" is quite the same thing.

[Josquius]

Ramaswamy Says He'd Run the Government Like Elon Musk Runs Twitter: 'A Good Example Of What I Want To Do'

I don't use Twitter and the news about the recent changes hasn't meant anything to me; but, from what I've been able to piece together, Musk's leadership style seems a tad... mercurial.

Bizzare someone would say they would run something as Musk does twitter and mean it to be a positive rather than stating they should never be allowed near power.

[HVC]

Ramaswamy Says He'd Run the Government Like Elon Musk Runs Twitter: 'A Good Example Of What I Want To Do'

I don't use Twitter and the news about the recent changes hasn't meant anything to me; but, from what I've been able to piece together, Musk's leadership style seems a tad... mercurial.

He's gonna change the countries name and stop paying bills?

[Zanza]

That Ramaswamy guy sounds like a fine VP candidate for The Donald.