Pandora papers

[The Larch]

Also the graph is just about politicians, not every person involved in the papers.

Over here one of the first things that got reported was Guardiola's involvement. 

[DGuller]

If there is one silver lining here, it's that Ukraine finally beat Russia at something.

[The Minsky Moment]

Americans are very involved in setting up the trusts the money sits in - interestingly South Dakota in the lead.

South Dakota has no usury laws.

[The Minsky Moment]

but maybe if the public were truly aware of what current policies allow you, then they would want to change those policies.

Hope springs eternal.

[viper37]

So we have a low-corruption arc from North America over Northern Europe and down through Africa and large parts of the Middle East.

It may mean they are elsewhere.  Not all of these offshore tax heavens are included.

[viper37]

Reading stories and coverage of it now. As ever UK's role in tax avoidance and corruption is as the facilitator - with lots of very clever, very nice people working for banks, other financial institutions, law firms, accountants building the infrastructure to enable this. Half of all Russian money laundering, apparently, flows through London at some point

Some US states too are in this, like South Dakota.  It's apparently used as a heaven for some foreign politicians to anonymously buy properties in the US.

[Josquius]

I find it curious the media's main focus is on the blairs comparatively minor tax dodginess post premiership than the much shadier stuff about dark money in politics.

[Sheilbh]

I find it curious the media's main focus is on the blairs comparatively minor tax dodginess post premiership than the much shadier stuff about dark money in politics.

He's the most prominent Brit so will be the first story. The last couple of days in the Guardian have been on Tory donors and Lords - but they're not that famous. All four British stories at the miinute are on the Guardian - and the Guardian and the BBC are, I think, the only British outlets who are in on the project so have access to the leak, so everyone else will be a day or two behind them.

And aren't they part and parcel? Tony Blair - since his premiership - has increased his net worth to allegedly around £50million+ - with a lot of that in a property portfolio. Cherie is obviously a successful QC so she will be bringing in a fair chunk too. And his son's edtech start-up is apparently worth £100millions (clients including Citi, KPMG, Westminster council etc).

He was, probably until the Obamas, the best paid speaker in the world. He works as an advisor for various investment banks, financial service institutions, a Korean firm that specialises in exploiting Iraqi oilfields - not to mention his advice on "human rights" or "pro-business reforms" for multiple autocrats who are also in the papers such as leaders in Egypt, Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan. I think Blair is the model of the money in politics - and you get it when you retire and don't have to report on your income, if you did a good job.

[viper37]

I find it curious the media's main focus is on the blairs comparatively minor tax dodginess post premiership than the much shadier stuff about dark money in politics.

they talked a lot about Jordan's King.  But with barely 100M$ in there, he's kinda poor. I mean, compared with some others who have like 2 billion$ in there, that's nothing.

[viper37]

I think Blair is the model of the money in politics - and you get it when you retire and don't have to report on your income, if you did a good job.

with a guaranteed no show job in a prominent lawfirm or construction company, our Liberal Party politicians are certainly a bunch of amateurs.

[HisMajestyBOB]

Reading stories and coverage of it now. As ever UK's role in tax avoidance and corruption is as the facilitator - with lots of very clever, very nice people working for banks, other financial institutions, law firms, accountants building the infrastructure to enable this. Half of all Russian money laundering, apparently, flows through London at some point

Some US states too are in this, like South Dakota.  It's apparently used as a heaven for some foreign politicians to anonymously buy properties in the US.

Pretty convenient. Once you convince everyone that your fictional state is real, you can use it for all sorts of nefarious purposes.

[Josquius]

.

And aren't they part and parcel? Tony Blair - since his premiership - has increased his net worth to allegedly around £50million+ - with a lot of that in a property portfolio. Cherie is obviously a successful QC so she will be bringing in a fair chunk too. And his son's edtech start-up is apparently worth £100millions (clients including Citi, KPMG, Westminster council etc).

He was, probably until the Obamas, the best paid speaker in the world. He works as an advisor for various investment banks, financial service institutions, a Korean firm that specialises in exploiting Iraqi oilfields - not to mention his advice on "human rights" or "pro-business reforms" for multiple autocrats who are also in the papers such as leaders in Egypt, Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan. I think Blair is the model of the money in politics - and you get it when you retire and don't have to report on your income, if you did a good job.

This gets a lot of criticism but you know, in itself I don't see anything too bad about this.
He isn't involved in politics anymore so why not make money as a regular guy.
The only dodgy part is the potential for iffy trades of doing certain things whilst in government on the promise of pay offs down the line or even having your decisions influenced by the mere thought of future opportunities.
It should be tightly monitored  and scrutinised for sure but making millions after politics? Fair play to him.
Those getting involved in this sort of business whilst still in politics now... That's a different matter

[viper37]

.

And aren't they part and parcel? Tony Blair - since his premiership - has increased his net worth to allegedly around £50million+ - with a lot of that in a property portfolio. Cherie is obviously a successful QC so she will be bringing in a fair chunk too. And his son's edtech start-up is apparently worth £100millions (clients including Citi, KPMG, Westminster council etc).

He was, probably until the Obamas, the best paid speaker in the world. He works as an advisor for various investment banks, financial service institutions, a Korean firm that specialises in exploiting Iraqi oilfields - not to mention his advice on "human rights" or "pro-business reforms" for multiple autocrats who are also in the papers such as leaders in Egypt, Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan. I think Blair is the model of the money in politics - and you get it when you retire and don't have to report on your income, if you did a good job.

This gets a lot of criticism but you know, in itself I don't see anything too bad about this.
He isn't involved in politics anymore so why not make money as a regular guy.
The only dodgy part is the potential for iffy trades of doing certain things whilst in government on the promise of pay offs down the line or even having your decisions influenced by the mere thought of future opportunities.
It should be tightly minored and scrutinised for sure but making millions after politics? Fair play to him.
Those getting involved in this sort of business whilst still in politics now... That's a different matter

Making money after politics based on your notoriety is totally fine.
Using that money to buy some corporation registered in a tax heaven and dodge local taxes that way is a different matter.  Especially so as you can make all kind of shady deals once it's there.

[DGuller]

Making money after politics based on your notoriety is totally fine.

I don't think it is, at least not unconditionally.  It strikes me as the type of corruption that people in the future would be surprised was so openly tolerated.  I think a lot of such speeches and appearance fees are just delayed bribe payments, and same goes for giving board seats in companies that dealt with the government.

[Sheilbh]

I don't think it is, at least not unconditionally.  It strikes me as the type of corruption that people in the future would be surprised was so openly tolerated.  I think a lot of such speeches and appearance fees are just delayed bribe payments, and same goes for giving board seats in companies that dealt with the government.

Yeah my take is almost the opposite of Viper's.

The actual thing the Blairs did was buy an SPV that owned a building - that'll be the only asset that SPV has and it's a way of paying the stamp duty on shares (which is about 0.5-1.5%) instead of the stamp duty on commercial property (up to 5%). It is standard practice in commercial real estate rather than anything particularly innovative or a heavily engineered tax scam. So I would every office block and every hotel in London will be owned by an SPV for that reason. It is striking that it was owned by a Bahraini minister, but the flipside it's a barristers' chambers (used by Cherie Blair's chambers) and it's located in Gray's Inn like loads of other chambers so it makes sense as a legit commercial purchase rather than a favour.

The other stuff though - I think getting employed by investment banks, financial institutions, dictators etc is either a reward for services rendered or a way of getting access to Tony Blair's/any other senior politician's contacts. I think that's how corruption works in the UK rather than up-front payments and politicians are often paid to join the board of the very companies that facilitate London as a centre for global corruption. South Dakota has lots of trusts, I believe in terms of channeling money the number of companies registered in London is second only to Lebanon.

I can sort of see the speech thing just because I've seen the rates executives pay to have a speech from sportspeople, football managers, former miliitary folks who've segued into inspirational speaking. I can see Tony Blair being a very compelling - if terrifying - speaker on leadership. It's the £100 grand to hear John Major or Theresa May that I don't really understand