Quo Vadis GOP?

[crazy canuck]

With respect, you are not as plugged in as you may think.  He was THE person on the right who ventured onto university campuses and made being a radical right winger cool. 

[Valmy]

With respect, you are not as plugged in as you may think.  He was THE person on the right who ventured onto university campuses and made being a radical right winger cool. 

He was far from the only person who did that.

[crazy canuck]

With respect, you are not as plugged in as you may think.  He was THE person on the right who ventured onto university campuses and made being a radical right winger cool. 

He was far from the only person who did that.

Ok, List others who did it, and with anything near the same result.

[Valmy]

With respect, you are not as plugged in as you may think.  He was THE person on the right who ventured onto university campuses and made being a radical right winger cool. 

He was far from the only person who did that.

Ok, List others who did it, and with anything near the same result.

Petersen, Ben Shapiro, and Marty's hero before the weird sex thing took him down. Just off the top of my head.

And all of those guys have and are incredibly successful. The University debate tour is a thing tons of right wing celebrities do. Kirk was just one of those guys. Plenty of people will fill in now that he is gone. There was absolutely nothing significant or essential about Kirk. There are plenty more like him or are waiting in the wings to be just like him.

[crazy canuck]

With respect, you are not as plugged in as you may think.  He was THE person on the right who ventured onto university campuses and made being a radical right winger cool. 

He was far from the only person who did that.

Ok, List others who did it, and with anything near the same result.

Petersen, Ben Shapiro, and Marty's hero before the weird sex thing took him down. Just off the top of my head.

And all of those guys have and are incredibly successful. The University debate tour is a thing tons of right wing celebrities do. Kirk was just one of those guys. Plenty of people will fill in now that he is gone. There was absolutely nothing significant or essential about Kirk. There are plenty more like him or are waiting in the wings to be just like him.

I grant you that Shapiro comes close in terms of his appearances on campuses.  But the other people don't come close to the same kind of activities on campus.  When was the last time Peterson was even on a university campus?  You have just listed a bunch of alt right personalities.

[Baron von Schtinkenbutt]

Petersen, Ben Shapiro, and Marty's hero before the weird sex thing took him down. Just off the top of my head.

And all of those guys have and are incredibly successful. The University debate tour is a thing tons of right wing celebrities do. Kirk was just one of those guys. Plenty of people will fill in now that he is gone. There was absolutely nothing significant or essential about Kirk. There are plenty more like him or are waiting in the wings to be just like him.

Peterson, Shapiro, and Yiannopoulos are of the general right-wing firebrand mold, translated into new media.  They were all about broadcasting their message as far and wide as possible.  Podcasts, speaking engagements, general media attention, it's all about getting as many eyeballs and earballs as possible for their personal circus.

Kirk was different.  He was an organizer.  Turning Point USA isn't just another right-wing media effort like Brietbart.  It's an activist organization that recruits, builds and tailors messages. and organizes concerted campaigns to persuade and indoctrinate.  It's not just one guy's podcast, newsletter, or cult of personality.  It's a organized, deliberate effort to persuade and indoctrinate.  The university tour was just part of this.

Obviously, I don't know what will happen to Turning Point USA without him.  However, I can see a political assassination galvanizing the organization and bolstering its efforts (at least with certain demographics).  Assassinating one of those others, while still bad, I don't think would have the same impact.

[Valmy]

Obviously, I don't know what will happen to Turning Point USA without him.  However, I can see a political assassination galvanizing the organization and bolstering its efforts (at least with certain demographics).  Assassinating one of those others, while still bad, I don't think would have the same impact.

I thought there was another person who helped him do the Turning Point USA stuff? In any case we will see.

[Norgy]

While I am not in tune with the American political vibe, hasn't Jordan Peterson sort of slid into more obscurity? He is still being read, but there's less Peterson mess in the media, as far as I can tell.

[garbon]

Obviously, I don't know what will happen to Turning Point USA without him.  However, I can see a political assassination galvanizing the organization and bolstering its efforts (at least with certain demographics).  Assassinating one of those others, while still bad, I don't think would have the same impact.

Maybe but it also seems like he could be more toxic if still alive.

[Jacob]

Obviously, I don't know what will happen to Turning Point USA without him.  However, I can see a political assassination galvanizing the organization and bolstering its efforts (at least with certain demographics).  Assassinating one of those others, while still bad, I don't think would have the same impact.

It remains to be seen whether the assassination results in galvanizing the organization, or in it petering out because it lacks the central charismatic organizing personality (or because multiple central personalities are fighting for control).

[crazy canuck]

Obviously, I don't know what will happen to Turning Point USA without him.  However, I can see a political assassination galvanizing the organization and bolstering its efforts (at least with certain demographics).  Assassinating one of those others, while still bad, I don't think would have the same impact.

It remains to be seen whether the assassination results in galvanizing the organization, or in it petering out because it lacks the central charismatic organizing personality (or because multiple central personalities are fighting for control).

Yes, it will all depend on whether there is someone like Kirk who can step into his shoes.  There is no one who immediately comes to mind, but no doubt someone will try.

[Grey Fox]

Kirk was 31, Peterson is a 60+ years old immigrant. They never were the same for the University attending generation.

[Sheilbh]

I don't believe in conspiracy theories - except about post-war Italian politics where they all appear to be true

You mean Gladio, I suppose.

I think it's well-proven that anti-communist right-wing nuts were behind that train station bombing attack.
Aldo Moro, a bloody prime minister, was murdered by Brigado Rosso.

Thing is, it actually connects with NATO plans for stay-behind groups if the Red Army came at us.
Those plans are near declassification by date now. It will be interesting to read them.

Yeah and P2 - and the life and career of Giulio Andreotti - and what did he know about Aldo Moro. Or the bombings like Bologna station. Plus the Mafia. And at the end of it emerging like a phoenix - Berlusconi (and on Mandelson and Epstein, I do feel like the stories about Berlusconi hosting other leaders at a villa and the bunga-bunga parties are underinvestigated).

Literally everything I read about post-war Italy and I end up going down a conspiracy rabbit hole to the extent that I think they're probably all true - even when they're mutually impossible. It all explains Umberto Eco at least.

[grumbler]

Most of what I know about Charlie Kirk is stuff I researched after that famous Cambridge debate a couple of years ago where a female student set him up and knocked him down like a bop bag, repeatedly.

He was a one-trick pony, but his trick seems to have been entertaining.

[The Minsky Moment]

"Prove me wrong" - without using any facts or data, because I don't accept them. Odd gimmick but well suited in a world mediated by the dominance of asocial media and the funhouse mirror version of reality it creates.

His energy and passion were impressive and creditable if badly directed.  His success in his chosen sphere was merited, but it also has to be pointed out that it testifies to the extraordinary financial support easily available to young people with talent willing to aggressively push right wing agendas.  See also Leonard Leo.

Interesting that the right gets so worked up about George Soros.  There are a hundred Soroses on the American right.