Elon Musk: Always A Douche

[Berkut]

This is like a bunch of baseball fans talking about Babe Ruth, and a significant number of them arguing that the thing about him that is the most interesting is that he is named after a candy bar, or that he had an illegitimate daughter. 

And if you point out that he was one of the best hitters of his generation, or even all time, you are accused of being some kind of delirious fanboy. FOCUS ON THE SILLY NAME AND HIS illegitimate daughter, damnit!

[viper37]

This is often because the boss asks his employees to follow his example.

[viper37]

It's Michael Dell, man!


Tbf, back in the 90s, he revolutionized computer sales by selling directly to the consumers.  Before that, companies were exclusively selling to distributors/resellers.  It did transform the computer industry in a major way.  It contributed to the democratization of the PC just as much as IBM in the 80s, other PC makers were forced to adjust and review their business model.

[viper37]

I simply think that people are vastly overestimating the number of those types alive today.  Purdue Pharma is not transformational, nor is Inditex, Bloomberg, nor, arguably, Apple.  Sergei Brin doesn't seem to be an asshole, nor Larry Page or Jack Dorsey. Sam Walton hasn't even alive for the last 30 years.

Bloomberg was transformative for finance.  It's been copied a lot, but it's software/terminal was transformative of finance.

Apple, for as much as I dislike their overpriced gadgets, was transformative: iPiod and iPhones were transformative devices.  Before that, mobile devices were Nokia and Blackberry for business users, functional, but not very practical.  Apple brought it for the consumer market.  Android didn't release it's first public OS until a year and a half later.  the iPod was hugely successful, putting Apple back on track.

I'd also say it was transformative in the PC market by bringing a graphical UI to its OS, years before Microsoft.  I don't think MS would have developed Win 3.0, or even Win 95 if it wasn't for the MacOS.  MS reacted to the competition more than it innovated.  Even today, I'm not sure I would characterize MS as a innovative company.  Then again, multinational companies rarely are.

[viper37]

I dispute that Bill Gates is an asshole.

His anti-competitive measures pretty much grants him a spot on the list.  In the 90s, probably among the top, but he's been topped by so many others since then.

[viper37]

Finance is, in part, about how fast you can get the information so you can act on it.  The other part lies in analyzing past information and how similar news will affect the stocks.

Bloomberg gave you that and so, so, much more.  You want to know why that stock dipped on 13-05-20?  Click on that date on the graph, it'll give all the news about the company.  Before that, you'd have to look manually through news article and find the relevant one on the relevant date.

Want to see if two stocks (or more) correlate to one another? A couple of clicks and its done.

Want to watch all news about XYZ Inc. and ABC Ltd as they come out?  Bloomberg will give you alert on these two companies in priority.

It was very much transformative.  Getting easy access to information is key to making profit in this industry.

[viper37]

This is like a bunch of baseball fans talking about Babe Ruth, and a significant number of them arguing that the thing about him that is the most interesting is that he is named after a candy bar, or that he had an illegitimate daughter.

And if you point out that he was one of the best hitters of his generation, or even all time, you are accused of being some kind of delirious fanboy. FOCUS ON THE SILLY NAME AND HIS illegitimate daughter, damnit!

58 pages.  Out of it, excluding yours, 4-5 messages have discussed Elon Musk personal behavior concerning his extra-marital child.  

The focus of the thread is more about his business practice, which seems mostly about over promising and under-delivering and pump & dump.  His stunt on crypto-currency and Twitter being the latest ones.

A more apt comparison would be the 8 players of the 1919 White Sox who betted against their own team.  They were great baseball players and not one of their fans could equal them.  Does that mean they did not deserve criticism?

You're not a fan of hockey, but Evander Kane is a great hockey player.  However, he has an attitude problem on ice and off the ice.  He's made many dirty hits, and he has had accusations of domestic violence and sexual assaults.  But we certainly need more talented hockey players like him.  His dirty hits?  His off-ice behavior?  Well, like you say, it's tabloid stuff...  We need talent.  By all means, let's excused everything else.

I'm not concerned about Elon Musk extra-marital affairs.  I'm not concerned about anyone's extra-marital affairs, this is part of their private life.  But generally speaking, people like Elon Musk do like the attention of the public on their private life when all goes well.  Can't really complain they get it when it goes bad.

Anyway,  like I said, not much concerned.  I posted that quip because of the lol, not because it meant anything.  10 children in this day and age is something out of the ordinary.  Especially when the 10th is welcome in secret while the 9th was delivered almost publicly.  Like I said, some people do crave for the public attention.

What worries me about Musk is how he uses social media to manipulate stock and inflate his own fortune, to the detriment of most other shareholders.  Publishing fake news in a traditional newspaper so as to manipulate a stock would be frowned upon.  It should be the same when it's done on Twitter.

Other business managers would be criticized for some of his work practices, so I don't see why he should be exempt of criticism, or legal penalties, because he is a genius.

[Valmy]

It's Michael Dell, man!


Tbf, back in the 90s, he revolutionized computer sales by selling directly to the consumers.  Before that, companies were exclusively selling to distributors/resellers.  It did transform the computer industry in a major way.  It contributed to the democratization of the PC just as much as IBM in the 80s, other PC makers were forced to adjust and review their business model.

Well more like late 80s. And sure it was a big deal. But at the end all he did was sell computers.

[Barrister]

It's Michael Dell, man!


Tbf, back in the 90s, he revolutionized computer sales by selling directly to the consumers.  Before that, companies were exclusively selling to distributors/resellers.  It did transform the computer industry in a major way.  It contributed to the democratization of the PC just as much as IBM in the 80s, other PC makers were forced to adjust and review their business model.

Well more like late 80s. And sure it was a big deal. But at the end all he did was sell computers.

That's like saying Amazon was just like a company selling goods from a catalog through the mail.

True, but kind of misses the bigger point.

[crazy canuck]

It's Michael Dell, man!


Tbf, back in the 90s, he revolutionized computer sales by selling directly to the consumers.  Before that, companies were exclusively selling to distributors/resellers.  It did transform the computer industry in a major way.  It contributed to the democratization of the PC just as much as IBM in the 80s, other PC makers were forced to adjust and review their business model.

Well more like late 80s. And sure it was a big deal. But at the end all he did was sell computers.

I think you have your timing off.  Dell was a very big deal in the 90s.  And it was not really until the 90s that Dell could implement its online sales strategy.  Viper is right, it completely changed the way computers were sold.

[Valmy]

It's Michael Dell, man!


Tbf, back in the 90s, he revolutionized computer sales by selling directly to the consumers.  Before that, companies were exclusively selling to distributors/resellers.  It did transform the computer industry in a major way.  It contributed to the democratization of the PC just as much as IBM in the 80s, other PC makers were forced to adjust and review their business model.

Well more like late 80s. And sure it was a big deal. But at the end all he did was sell computers.

I think you have your timing off.  Dell was a very big deal in the 90s.  And it was not really until the 90s that Dell could implement its online sales strategy.  Viper is right, it completely changed the way computers were sold.

Of course it was a big deal in the 90s, but it wasn't like it just sprang from the ground it was exploding around 1988 and its 1988 IPO was a huge deal around here. That is where all the "Dellionaires" made their millions by jumping in early. Look I live in the area. I was there I think I know when Dell started to be a big deal. And I think it is a great company and I think Dell is a great business man. I think doing the built to order thing with little warehousing and phone/online sales was all great.

But come on. It is not like if Michael Dell never existed we would all be buying computers at Radio Shack and we would still be living like its 1985. It is not like built to order was some kind of revolutionary idea that he invented. He just applied it to computers. And it is not like everything else wasn't attempted to be sold online once the technology got there. He just was the first guy and he did it better. But what is revolutionary about selling computers? Selling things built to order? Doing it without a middle man? Nothing that hadn't already been done. He just put it together. And frankly the company is kind of dinosaur now, I mean people still need computers but so much is now done on phones and tablets. Time has moved on past Dell, though it obviously chugs along.

If Michael Dell truly was the revolutionary genius the people who worked at Dell claimed he was he would have been ahead of that curve. And that's all I am saying. I thought his worship by the employees in the company over the top.

[Eddie Teach]

"Dude! You're getting a Dell!"

[crazy canuck]

It's Michael Dell, man!


Tbf, back in the 90s, he revolutionized computer sales by selling directly to the consumers.  Before that, companies were exclusively selling to distributors/resellers.  It did transform the computer industry in a major way.  It contributed to the democratization of the PC just as much as IBM in the 80s, other PC makers were forced to adjust and review their business model.

Well more like late 80s. And sure it was a big deal. But at the end all he did was sell computers.

I think you have your timing off.  Dell was a very big deal in the 90s.  And it was not really until the 90s that Dell could implement its online sales strategy.  Viper is right, it completely changed the way computers were sold.

Of course it was a big deal in the 90s, but it wasn't like it just sprang from the ground it was exploding around 1988 and its 1988 IPO was a huge deal around here. That is where all the "Dellionaires" made their millions by jumping in early. Look I live in the area. I was there I think I know when Dell started to be a big deal. And I think it is a great company and I think Dell is a great business man. I think doing the built to order thing with little warehousing and phone/online sales was all great.

But come on. It is not like if Michael Dell never existed we would all be buying computers at Radio Shack and we would still be living like its 1985. It is not like built to order was some kind of revolutionary idea that he invented. He just applied it to computers. And it is not like everything else wasn't attempted to be sold online once the technology got there. He just was the first guy and he did it better. But what is revolutionary about selling computers? Selling things built to order? Doing it without a middle man? Nothing that hadn't already been done. He just put it together. And frankly the company is kind of dinosaur now, I mean people still need computers but so much is now done on phones and tablets. Time has moved on past Dell, though it obviously chugs along.

If Michael Dell truly was the revolutionary genius the people who worked at Dell claimed he was he would have been ahead of that curve. And that's all I am saying. I thought his worship by the employees in the company over the top.

I was there I think I know when Dell started to be a big deal. And I think it is a great company and I think Dell is a great business man. I think doing the built to order thing with little warehousing and phone/online sales was all great.

But come on. It is not like if Michael Dell never existed we would all be buying computers at Radio Shack and we would still be living like its 1985. It is not like built to order was some kind of revolutionary idea that he invented. He just applied it to computers. And it is not like everything else wasn't attempted to be sold online once the technology got there. He just was the first guy and he did it better. But what is revolutionary about selling computers? Selling things built to order? Doing it without a middle man? Nothing that hadn't already been done. He just put it together. And frankly the company is kind of dinosaur now, I mean people still need computers but so much is now done on phones and tablets. Time has moved on past Dell, though it obviously chugs along.

If Michael Dell truly was the revolutionary genius the people who worked at Dell claimed he was he would have been ahead of that curve. And that's all I am saying. I thought his worship by the employees in the company over the top.

Great, with all your inside knowledge then you will remember, as I do, that sales over the internet didn't become a thing until the 90s.

[Barrister]

Of course it was a big deal in the 90s, but it wasn't like it just sprang from the ground it was exploding around 1988 and its 1988 IPO was a huge deal around here. That is where all the "Dellionaires" made their millions by jumping in early. Look I live in the area. I was there I think I know when Dell started to be a big deal. And I think it is a great company and I think Dell is a great business man. I think doing the built to order thing with little warehousing and phone/online sales was all great.

But come on. It is not like if Michael Dell never existed we would all be buying computers at Radio Shack and we would still be living like its 1985. It is not like built to order was some kind of revolutionary idea that he invented. He just applied it to computers. And it is not like everything else wasn't attempted to be sold online once the technology got there. He just was the first guy and he did it better. But what is revolutionary about selling computers? Selling things built to order? Doing it without a middle man? Nothing that hadn't already been done. He just put it together. And frankly the company is kind of dinosaur now, I mean people still need computers but so much is now done on phones and tablets. Time has moved on past Dell, though it obviously chugs along.

If Michael Dell truly was the revolutionary genius the people who worked at Dell claimed he was he would have been ahead of that curve. And that's all I am saying. I thought his worship by the employees in the company over the top.

Reading up on it I think I'm in Valmy's camp now.

Dell's big thing wasn't so much "selling computers on the internet".  After all they ran tons of paper ads, you could easily buy them over the phone, they ran tons of tv ads, etc.  Dell's big competitive advantage was cutting out the middlemen, assembling computers themselves, and keeping margins on components low.  All of which are time-honoured business strategies.

Until the home computer market became more commodified, more computers were manufactured in China (which even Dell couldn't compete with).  So their stock price dipped, they went private, they expanded into enterprise computing, they went public again, and are doing fine.  But there's nothing remotely revolutionary about Dell 2022's version.

[crazy canuck]

Of course it was a big deal in the 90s, but it wasn't like it just sprang from the ground it was exploding around 1988 and its 1988 IPO was a huge deal around here. That is where all the "Dellionaires" made their millions by jumping in early. Look I live in the area. I was there I think I know when Dell started to be a big deal. And I think it is a great company and I think Dell is a great business man. I think doing the built to order thing with little warehousing and phone/online sales was all great.

But come on. It is not like if Michael Dell never existed we would all be buying computers at Radio Shack and we would still be living like its 1985. It is not like built to order was some kind of revolutionary idea that he invented. He just applied it to computers. And it is not like everything else wasn't attempted to be sold online once the technology got there. He just was the first guy and he did it better. But what is revolutionary about selling computers? Selling things built to order? Doing it without a middle man? Nothing that hadn't already been done. He just put it together. And frankly the company is kind of dinosaur now, I mean people still need computers but so much is now done on phones and tablets. Time has moved on past Dell, though it obviously chugs along.

If Michael Dell truly was the revolutionary genius the people who worked at Dell claimed he was he would have been ahead of that curve. And that's all I am saying. I thought his worship by the employees in the company over the top.

Reading up on it I think I'm in Valmy's camp now.

Dell's big thing wasn't so much "selling computers on the internet".  After all they ran tons of paper ads, you could easily buy them over the phone, they ran tons of tv ads, etc.  Dell's big competitive advantage was cutting out the middlemen, assembling computers themselves, and keeping margins on components low.  All of which are time-honoured business strategies.

Until the home computer market became more commodified, more computers were manufactured in China (which even Dell couldn't compete with).  So their stock price dipped, they went private, they expanded into enterprise computing, they went public again, and are doing fine.  But there's nothing remotely revolutionary about Dell 2022's version.

In the late 80s they could pull off that kind of smallish operation because not many people bought home computers then.  In the 90s it really took off, as did Dell's adaptation to sell over the internet.

In the 80s Dell really was just a guy selling computers.  He revolutionized the industry in the 90s.