Elon Musk: Always A Douche

[Valmy]

In my experience, in most places in the corporate world, DEI was mostly a slogan for paying lip service to caring about diversity without really doing much to further it. It's been a bit surreal watching magaworld work themselves into a fury over it, conjuring imaginary horrors.

Yep. Sort of like all those oil companies talking about how green they are.

BP stands for BEYOND PETROLEUM!!!!111

[grumbler]

Eh, I read this.
https://thehub.ca/2024/06/03/elie-cantin-nantel-quebec-is-a-national-anomaly-why-the-socially-liberal-province-hasnt-gone-woke/

Well, half of it.

My guess is you did a quick google search and were happy when you found an article in English about Quebec that had the term DEI used in a negative context.  But if you read the reporters interpretation of what the motion was, you will understand it was not a rejection of DEI. No DEI programs in any Canadian provinces have a quota system. And so the motion was simply in keeping with Quebec provincial laws, which by the way, are entirely consistent with DEI principles are, in my view, the strongest statutory supports for those principles in the Country.

This seems to be another example of a misunderstanding of what DEI is both my the author of the article and you.

An easy way to steer clear of the right-wing bullshit is to recognize that any article whose title uses the word "woke" is crap.  The right doesn't even know what woke means, but they'll commit murder, if necessary, to stop it.

[crazy canuck]

Corporations and government didn't start hiring DEI consultants to design wheelchair access ramps or make their office more ergonomic for handicapped people.  We can drop that pretense right now.

A lot of DEI stuff went way overboard and tried to shame white people simply for being white, often accusing them of racism for daring to question false history.

Could I see some evidence that "Corporations and government" "went way overboard and tried to shame white people simply for being white, often accusing them of racism for daring to question false history?"  Note that Truth Social posts do not constitute evidence.

I'll have to dig the case for Quebec that went into court.

I would like to see it too please 

[crazy canuck]

An easy way to steer clear of the right-wing bullshit is to recognize that any article whose title uses the word "woke" is crap.  The right doesn't even know what woke means, but they'll commit murder, if necessary, to stop it.

 

[Razgovory]

.

This is my understanding, and if true why fight so hard to defend it?

The right are taking aim not just at shit ineffectual implementations of equality policies, but using DEI as a dog whistle for the entire concept of equality.
Big hints they're using it as a wedge to have a go at workers rights in general.

If their strategy is to attack something that is unpopular and doesn't work to get you to defend it so they can use it as wedge, then the smart thing is not to defend it.

[crazy canuck]

.

This is my understanding, and if true why fight so hard to defend it?

The right are taking aim not just at shit ineffectual implementations of equality policies, but using DEI as a dog whistle for the entire concept of equality.
Big hints they're using it as a wedge to have a go at workers rights in general.

If their strategy is to attack something that is unpopular and doesn't work to get you to defend it so they can use it as wedge, then the smart thing is not to defend it.

MAGA - Due process is evil.  50% of Americans don't support it.

Raz - Ok then let's stop with this due process stuff.

[Razgovory]

Eh, I read this.
https://thehub.ca/2024/06/03/elie-cantin-nantel-quebec-is-a-national-anomaly-why-the-socially-liberal-province-hasnt-gone-woke/

Well, half of it.

My guess is you did a quick google search and were happy when you found an article in English about Quebec that had the term DEI used in a negative context.  But if you read the reporters interpretation of what the motion was, you will understand it was not a rejection of DEI. No DEI programs in any Canadian provinces have a quota system. And so the motion was simply in keeping with Quebec provincial laws, which by the way, are entirely consistent with DEI principles are, in my view, the strongest statutory supports for those principles in the Country.

This seems to be another example of a misunderstanding of what DEI is both my the author of the article and you.

An easy way to steer clear of the right-wing bullshit is to recognize that any article whose title uses the word "woke" is crap.  The right doesn't even know what woke means, but they'll commit murder, if necessary, to stop it.

Woke was used by the left before it was used by the right, in particular it was to be used as way for center-leftists to criticize those further to the left.

[Razgovory]

.

This is my understanding, and if true why fight so hard to defend it?

The right are taking aim not just at shit ineffectual implementations of equality policies, but using DEI as a dog whistle for the entire concept of equality.
Big hints they're using it as a wedge to have a go at workers rights in general.

If their strategy is to attack something that is unpopular and doesn't work to get you to defend it so they can use it as wedge, then the smart thing is not to defend it.

MAGA - Due process is evil.  50% of Americans don't support it.

Raz - Ok then let's stop with this due process stuff.

The majority of the population doesn't support getting rid of due process and it does seem to work and it is something that matters.  So not the best example you could have come up with.

[crazy canuck]

Eh, I read this.
https://thehub.ca/2024/06/03/elie-cantin-nantel-quebec-is-a-national-anomaly-why-the-socially-liberal-province-hasnt-gone-woke/

Well, half of it.

My guess is you did a quick google search and were happy when you found an article in English about Quebec that had the term DEI used in a negative context.  But if you read the reporters interpretation of what the motion was, you will understand it was not a rejection of DEI. No DEI programs in any Canadian provinces have a quota system. And so the motion was simply in keeping with Quebec provincial laws, which by the way, are entirely consistent with DEI principles are, in my view, the strongest statutory supports for those principles in the Country.

This seems to be another example of a misunderstanding of what DEI is both my the author of the article and you.

An easy way to steer clear of the right-wing bullshit is to recognize that any article whose title uses the word "woke" is crap.  The right doesn't even know what woke means, but they'll commit murder, if necessary, to stop it.

Woke was used by the left before it was used by the right, in particular it was to be used as way for center-leftists to criticize those further to the left.

You are correct that the term "woke" was used by the left. The meaning you have attributed to it's meaning at that time is not accurate.  It was not a term used in a disparaging way.

[crazy canuck]

The majority of the population doesn't support getting rid of due process and it does seem to work and it is something that matters.  So not the best example you could have come up with.

Your criteria is that it be a wedge issue.  It has been a wedge issue for quite some time.  Also, the right claims that due process is not working.  That is why the need for the government to curb its "abuses".  That shows up in a lot of ways, too many to list here amongst the Trumpists.  And here in Canada the Conservatives saying they would use the Notwithstanding Clause to pass legislation our SCC has already rules is unconstitutional.

The difference is you support due process and you do not support DEI.  So it is the perfect example to show the logical inconsistency in your position that people should stop supporting DEI because it has been labelled by the right as being "woke".

[Josquius]

.

This is my understanding, and if true why fight so hard to defend it?

The right are taking aim not just at shit ineffectual implementations of equality policies, but using DEI as a dog whistle for the entire concept of equality.
Big hints they're using it as a wedge to have a go at workers rights in general.

If their strategy is to attack something that is unpopular and doesn't work to get you to defend it so they can use it as wedge, then the smart thing is not to defend it.

OK. Next time there's a trans lynching I'll get my pitchfork.

If the left don't defend equal rights then there's no point in the left existing.

[Razgovory]

The majority of the population doesn't support getting rid of due process and it does seem to work and it is something that matters.  So not the best example you could have come up with.

Your criteria is that it be a wedge issue.  It has been a wedge issue for quite some time.  Also, the right claims that due process is not working.  That is why the need for the government to curb its "abuses".  That shows up in a lot of ways, too many to list here amongst the Trumpists.  And here in Canada the Conservatives saying they would use the Notwithstanding Clause to pass legislation our SCC has already rules is unconstitutional.

The difference is you support due process and you do not support DEI.  So it is the perfect example to show the logical inconsistency in your position that people should stop supporting DEI because it has been labelled by the right as being "woke".

No, I didn't say I didn't support DEI.  I'm ambivalent, but if doesn't really work and exists mostly as a way for corporations to launder their reputations, why should we defend it?  Trump and his team talk about getting rid of due process for illegal immigrants, which is not a popular issue (though really we've been deporting people without due process for a while now), and more importantly, is a meaningful issue.

[Razgovory]

.

This is my understanding, and if true why fight so hard to defend it?

The right are taking aim not just at shit ineffectual implementations of equality policies, but using DEI as a dog whistle for the entire concept of equality.
Big hints they're using it as a wedge to have a go at workers rights in general.

If their strategy is to attack something that is unpopular and doesn't work to get you to defend it so they can use it as wedge, then the smart thing is not to defend it.

OK. Next time there's a trans lynching I'll get my pitchfork.

If the left don't defend equal rights then there's no point in the left existing.

Don't be daft.  People were leftists before DEI.  During the French Revolution they let you sit on the left side of the assembly even if you didn't have sensitivity training or didn't allow transwomen to participate in women's sports.  You can still be a leftist without supporting equal rights to children or great apes.  And not taking the maximalist position on everything doesn't mean you need to lynch trans people.

[Razgovory]

Eh, I read this.
https://thehub.ca/2024/06/03/elie-cantin-nantel-quebec-is-a-national-anomaly-why-the-socially-liberal-province-hasnt-gone-woke/

Well, half of it.

My guess is you did a quick google search and were happy when you found an article in English about Quebec that had the term DEI used in a negative context.  But if you read the reporters interpretation of what the motion was, you will understand it was not a rejection of DEI. No DEI programs in any Canadian provinces have a quota system. And so the motion was simply in keeping with Quebec provincial laws, which by the way, are entirely consistent with DEI principles are, in my view, the strongest statutory supports for those principles in the Country.

This seems to be another example of a misunderstanding of what DEI is both my the author of the article and you.

An easy way to steer clear of the right-wing bullshit is to recognize that any article whose title uses the word "woke" is crap.  The right doesn't even know what woke means, but they'll commit murder, if necessary, to stop it.

Woke was used by the left before it was used by the right, in particular it was to be used as way for center-leftists to criticize those further to the left.

You are correct that the term "woke" was used by the left. The meaning you have attributed to it's meaning at that time is not accurate.  It was not a term used in a disparaging way.

I do not believe you to be correct. The term dates back to prior to the Civil war when it was used by an organization called the "Wide Awakes".  It fell out of fashion among white people in the 1870's but remained in the Black vernacular.  It reenter white left-wing language in the 1960's and ended up replacing "Politically correct" among the left.  To quote Musa al-Gharbi

Since then, things have played out for "woke" much like they did for "political correctness":
within activist circles  the term increasingly gained two meanings.  In its initial contemporary usage, the term was used to identify someone who was alert to social injustice and committed to resisting it.  Gradually, however, the others on the left began to use the term pejoratively to refer to peers who were self-righteous  and non-self aware.  "Wokeness" came to be associated in these cercles with empty symbolic gestures and ideological dogmatism.  Eventually, the political Right seized on this intra-left disagreement and began using "woke" as a catchall for anything associated with the Left that seemed ridiculous or repugnant.  And this began to the luster off the term.

-Page 27, We Have Never Been Woke.

[Josquius]

quote]
If their strategy is to attack something that is unpopular and doesn't work to get you to defend it so they can use it as wedge, then the smart thing is not to defend it.
[/quo

]

Don't be daft.  People were leftists before DEI.  During the French Revolution they let you sit on the left side of the assembly even if you didn't have sensitivity training or didn't allow transwomen to participate in women's sports.  You can still be a leftist without supporting equal rights to children or great apes.  And not taking the maximalist position on everything doesn't mean you need to lynch trans people.

When it comes down to it DEI is just a modern corporate speak label for how they handle the core of what left wing politics is all about- equality for all.

Don't oppose the maximalist position of  "no, actually, anyone who doesn't fit into the empowered majority actually should be excluded from good jobs" and you're a pretty crap leftist.

Complain if you like about shit implementations.
But rail against the very concept of meritocracy and you're just dancing to the fascists merry tune.