Operation Enduring Nuremberg: The Trump Diaspora begins...con carne!

[Oexmelin]

What is your point? That governments employ agents empowered to use force? That they have broad powers of coercion and claim monopoly over legitimate violence? That CBP existed before Trump? Of course. These are pretty trivial point. Mine was that Trump found an agency enthusiastically willing to do its bidding, and we can expect it to be rewarded as such. And since it seems to be in need of being spelled out, it was a way to draw attention to the fact that authoritarian regimes do not always rely on outside elements - paramilitary groups, brown shirts, or what have you - that are often propped up as being the main "warning signs" of authoritarian turns.   

[Admiral Yi]

And since it seems to be in need of being spelled out, it was a way to draw attention to the fact that authoritarian regimes do not always rely on outside elements - paramilitary groups, brown shirts, or what have you - that are often propped up as being the main "warning signs" of authoritarian turns.

Authoritarian regimes typically rely on those types of groups, or co-opt existing groups, to illegally squash dissent.  So far ICE hasn't gunned down any anti-Trump demonstrators or smashed the NYT's printing presses.

It demonstrates a serious lack of perspective to call them Trump's thugs, as that label is essentially a function of a policy you happen to disagree with.

[grumbler]

What is your point? That governments employ agents empowered to use force? That they have broad powers of coercion and claim monopoly over legitimate violence? That CBP existed before Trump? Of course. These are pretty trivial point. Mine was that Trump found an agency enthusiastically willing to do its bidding, and we can expect it to be rewarded as such. And since it seems to be in need of being spelled out, it was a way to draw attention to the fact that authoritarian regimes do not always rely on outside elements - paramilitary groups, brown shirts, or what have you - that are often propped up as being the main "warning signs" of authoritarian turns.

My point is that this is exactly how every government agency works and every government works.  The new boss comes in, and some agencies that enact policy in the areas of the new government's interests get more power and funding and become the "thugs" of that government (it could be transportation infrastructure or tax enforcement or whatever - they get funded, have their power expanded, flex their muscles, etc).  The department of education became one set of Obama's thugs, given discretion to impose themselves, especially on higher education, and that was okay with people who favored that outcome, while pissing off those who did not.

There are an enormous number of things you can criticize Trump for; things that are actually blameworthy.  Shitty cabinet picks.  maintaining an open air of corruption and self-service.  Refusing to educate himself and spending his infinitely valuable face time with foreign leaders bragging about an election win that was fictional. Etc.  To blame him for emphasizing the law enforcement arenas he promised in the election to emphasize is boneheaded, though.  You just look like a sore loser.  Add in talk about "thugs" and you look like an emo sore loser.

[Oexmelin]

It demonstrates a serious lack of perspective to call them Trump's thugs, as that label is essentially a function of a policy you happen to disagree with.

No. It's a function of a policy that directly impacts me, my friends, and the values I hold dear - notably, that you shouldn't promote impunity and empower discretionary power in an administrative body that has already been investigated for abusing its power, and who routinely shove *their* politics in your face, not to mention their ignorance, whenever you are a foreigner who happens to not fit their notion of what a proper American citizen is. Is it a political label, Mr. "Loony Left"? Absolutely. Because I think what is at stake here is more than the polite discourse of disagreement.

[crazy canuck]

What is your point? That governments employ agents empowered to use force? That they have broad powers of coercion and claim monopoly over legitimate violence? That CBP existed before Trump? Of course. These are pretty trivial point. Mine was that Trump found an agency enthusiastically willing to do its bidding, and we can expect it to be rewarded as such. And since it seems to be in need of being spelled out, it was a way to draw attention to the fact that authoritarian regimes do not always rely on outside elements - paramilitary groups, brown shirts, or what have you - that are often propped up as being the main "warning signs" of authoritarian turns.

My point is that this is exactly how every government agency works and every government works.

No.  In fact most governments and most government agencies attempt to work within the law.  This government either does not know, or perhaps worse, does not care.  The fact that some within the agency were over enthusiastic in carrying out the decree is troubling.

[Oexmelin]

To blame him for emphasizing the law enforcement arenas he promised in the election to emphasize is boneheaded, though.  You just look like a sore loser.  Add in talk about "thugs" and you look like an emo sore loser.

You just can't help yourself, can you? You just need to constantly insult people. What's your line again? "Thanks, I needed an example of someone wielding insults and screaming ad hominem for my students".

[CountDeMoney]

Add in talk about "thugs" and you look like an emo sore loser.

This is ICE and CBP we're talking about here.  Amazing what federal gigs a high school diploma and 10 Veterans Preference points for "the voices" since coming home from Iraq can score these days. 

[Oexmelin]

Add in talk about "thugs" and you look like an emo sore loser.

This is ICE and CBP we're talking about here.  Amazing what federal gigs a high school diploma and 10 Veterans Preference points for "the voices" since coming home from Iraq can score these days.

I am sure the tens of thousands of thugs in the education department can have just as much power.

[PDH]

I am sure the tens of thousands of thugs in the education department can have just as much power.

*shudder*  NOT THE CHALK!  NOT THE CHALK!  I'll talk, I swear I'll name names!

[Ed Anger]

I am sure the tens of thousands of thugs in the education department can have just as much power.

*shudder*  NOT THE CHALK!  NOT THE CHALK!  I'll talk, I swear I'll name names!

Or cleaning the erasers. *shudder*

[Eddie Teach]

I am sure the tens of thousands of thugs in the education department can have just as much power.

*shudder*  NOT THE CHALK!  NOT THE CHALK!  I'll talk, I swear I'll name names!

Are you one of those professors who use markers and a projector for everything?

[Oexmelin]

I am sure the tens of thousands of thugs in the education department can have just as much power.

*shudder*  NOT THE CHALK!  NOT THE CHALK!  I'll talk, I swear I'll name names!

We have ways to make you talk.

It's called participation grade.

[Ed Anger]

Ugh. ONE OF THOSE.

[grumbler]

No.  In fact most governments and most government agencies attempt to work within the law.  This government either does not know, or perhaps worse, does not care.  The fact that some within the agency were over enthusiastic in carrying out the decree is troubling.

No.  This government is as bound by law as any in the world.  The office of the President may not understand the law, but they are as bound by it as they would be if they did.  The myth that CBP used to be a bunch of great guys and gals until Trump took office and issued a decree is comical.  These people have been jerks since forever.  You'll find plenty of horror stories from before Trump even took office.

[grumbler]

You just can't help yourself, can you? You just need to constantly insult people. What's your line again? "Thanks, I needed an example of someone wielding insults and screaming ad hominem for my students".

You can't help being emo, can you?  If I point out that people are being emo when they insist that officials they don't like are "thugs," you can either take that on board or go even more emo, like here.  I kinda find your taking the second approach more amusing, I'll admit, so keep up the emo if you can.