German Politics

[Syt]

I thought we had a catch all thread for German politics. Anyways.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/jan/18/afd-politician-says-germany-should-stop-atoning-for-nazi-crimes

AfD politician says Germany should stop atoning for Nazi crimes

A politician from the rightwing populist Alternative for Germany (AfD) party has broken with the country's postwar political consensus by calling for a "180-degree turn" from the tradition of remembering and atoning for the Nazi era.

In a speech in a beer hall in Dresden, Björn Höcke, who leads the party in the eastern state of Thuringia, railed against Germany's decade-long tradition of acknowledging the crimes of the National Socialist era, describing the Holocaust memorial in Berlin as a "monument of shame".

"They wanted to cut off our roots and with the re-education that began in 1945, they nearly managed," Höcke said. "Until now, our mental state continues to be that of a totally defeated people. We Germans are the only people in the world that have planted a monument of shame in the heart of their capital."

The Memorial to the Murdered Jews of Europe, a large sloping field covered in austere slabs of concrete, was unveiled in 2005 and is located close to the German parliament and the Brandenburg Gate.

During the second world war Germany was responsible for the murder of more than 6 million Jews and other minorities.

Höcke, a former history teacher, also complained that German schoolchildren were supposedly not taught about the country's scientific and artistic achievements, and that German history was made to look "mean and ridiculous". "That cannot and must not continue," he added, which was greeted with a standing ovation and chants of "Germany, Germany" from his audience.

The event was organised by his party's youth organisation, but a video shows the audience was filled with elderly supporters.

The provocation comes before a meeting of European far-right parties in Koblenz on Satuday, organised by the European parliament's Europe of Nations and Freedom group.

Though the AfD leader, Frauke Petry, threatened to resign in the case of a rightward lurch before its party conference last year, she has continued to tolerate Höcke, seen as the figurehead of the party's nationalist wing.

An AfD strategy paper leaked to the press last December called for "carefully planned provocations" in the run-up to elections in September, leading to rushed retaliations from other parties. The more the AfD was stigmatised as a result, the paper suggested, "the more positive for the party's profile".

Current polls have the rightwing populists on 11-15%, behind Angela Merkel's Christian Democratic party and the Social Democratic party. In his speech, Höcke said he was aiming for the party to get "51% in this country", or a senior role in a coalition with "one of the establishment parties after it has gone through a cathartic purgatory".

The Central Council of Jews in Germany condemned the speech. Its president, Josef Schuster, said: "With these antisemitic and highly misanthropic comments, the AfD is showing its true face. I would have never dared to imagine that it would be possible for a politician to say such things 70 years after the Shoah."

The German vice chancellor, Sigmar Gabriel, said: "Björn Höcke despises the Germany I am proud of. Never, never ever must we allow the demagogy of a Björn Höcke to go unchallenged. Not as Germans, and especially not as Social Democrats."

At the event he also likened the Dresden bombing to the nuclear strikes on Japan and called Weizsäcker's milestone speech of 8th May 1985 (see here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_von_Weizs%C3%A4cker#First_term_.281984.E2.80.9389.29) a speech against the German people.

Höcke is a bit infamous now, not least because his speech about the breeding habits of Africans: http://www.dw.com/en/germanys-afd-distances-itself-from-h%C3%B6ckes-almost-racist-remarks/a-18917049


What's striking to me is not so much what he says. It's that I know (at least from my old home in North Germany) many who agree with what he says, but know not to say it in polite company or in public. And it's not uneducated, unemployed drunks. It's enterpreneurs, lawyers, marketing consultants, accountants, programmers, business analysts, and other "decent" people who wait for such a discourse to become normalized.

[Valmy]

Höcke, a former history teacher, also complained that German schoolchildren were supposedly not taught about the country's scientific and artistic achievements, and that German history was made to look "mean and ridiculous". "That cannot and must not continue," he added, which was greeted with a standing ovation and chants of "Germany, Germany" from his audience.

Well that's not good.

Germans are temperamentally unable to just go kinda nationalistic.

[Ed Anger]

Sorta turned on.

[CountDeMoney]

Those people never do anything in moderation.

[HisMajestyBOB]

So, your next Chancellor then?

[CountDeMoney]

I would be so for German militarization and massive rearmament, just to piss of the Russians and their GOPee lapdogs, if it weren't for the fact that we'd just have to go over there and kill them  again.

[Ed Anger]

Can I be: inspector general of the panzer troops?

[11B4V]

I would be so for German militarization and massive rearmament, just to piss of the Russians and their GOPee lapdogs, if it weren't for the fact that we'd just have to go over there and kill them  again.

The French would save us.

[CountDeMoney]

The French would save us.

I know where you're going with this, and don't even.

[Capetan Mihali]

Interesting that similar academic arguments from the Historikerstreit era would have been totally off-limits for mainstream politics in West Germany thirty years ago, but not today.

[Josquius]

Was reading today about 1000 Muslims supposedly storming and burning the oldest church in a German city at the new year... Which was promptly dismissed by the police as bullshit.
Wonder if the same populist fake news crap will infect Germany in their election

[Malicious Intent]

Was reading today about 1000 Muslims supposedly storming and burning the oldest church in a German city at the new year... Which was promptly dismissed by the police as bullshit.
Wonder if the same populist fake news crap will infect Germany in their election

Members of AFD and NPD are rather blatantly spreading false news. The AFD in my town recently made news when they spread an "authentic" picture via party placards of alleged immigrants beating up a German policeman. As it turned out, that picture was originally taken in Greece during the austerity riots, and the AFD edited it to give the Greek police officer German markings and the demonstrators leftist and Arab writings on their clothes. The AFD publicly admitted the fake under pressure but then immediately went on to blame the "lying" media anyway.

[Zanza]

http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-germany-election-spd-idUKKBN1581XN

German SPD chief Gabriel makes way for Schulz to run against Merkel

The leader of Germany's Social Democrats (SPD) will put forward Martin Schulz, the former president of the European Parliament, to challenge conservative Chancellor Angela Merkel in a national election on September 24, sources said on Tuesday.

Sigmar Gabriel's decision, reported by Stern magazine and confirmed by party sources, will make Germany's election less predictable and also signals the SPD wants to end its role as junior partner in Merkel's current right-left coalition.

Opinion polls suggest Schulz has a better chance than Gabriel of unseating Merkel, who has led Germany since 2005 and is Europe's most powerful leader. Her conservatives' coalition with the SPD has governed Germany since 2013.

"If I were to stand, I would fail and the SPD would fail with me," Gabriel, who serves as vice chancellor and economy minister in Merkel's government, told Stern magazine.

"All the polls have shown that people don't want a grand coalition any more. In people's minds I stand for that. So Martin Schulz is the most suitable man," one person at the party meeting quoted Gabriel as saying.

The party is expected to formally decide on Schulz's candidacy for chancellor in the near future. If confirmed, he faces a very tough job beating Merkel, whose conservatives lead in opinion polls by about 15 percentage points.

But a poll conducted this month by the Emnid institute for the Bild newspaper showed that in a direct vote Schulz would win 38 percent versus 39 percent for Merkel, compared to a result of 27 percent for Gabriel and 46 percent for Merkel.

The SPD aims to form a coalition with smaller parties on the left but most analysts still think another right-left coalition is the most likely outcome of September's election.

Schulz, 61, said in November he would return to German politics after his stint as president of the European Parliament.

Stern reported that Gabriel, 57, a former schoolteacher, would also offer to give up his chairmanship of the SPD, a position he has held since 2009. Gabriel is the longest serving leader of the SPD since former Chancellor Willy Brandt.

German weekly Die Zeit, citing no sources, reported that Gabriel would seek the post of foreign minister.

The role of foreign minister will become available soon as Frank-Walter Steinmeier, also a leading member of the SPD, is expected to be elected to the largely ceremonial role of German president next month.

It's clear now who'll lead the two biggest parties into Germany's general election in September - Merkel for the Conservatives, Schulz for the Social Democrats. Merkel will likely still prevail, but this might give the SPD a small bump in opinion polls.

It's rather unusual that a party leader in Germany just resigns like Gabriel did now. Most of the time they only resign briefly before the knives come out. That was not yet the case in the SPD, so he shows statemanship and realism by resigning on his own terms.

[The Larch]

And it puts forward a candidate that was not part of the Grand Coalition that Merkel dominated.

[Zanza]

Germany abolishes law that bans insulting foreign leaders
Decision comes days after Donald Trump's inauguration and a year after prosecution of German comic who wrote crude poem about Turkish President

Germany has decided to abolish a law which defends the honour of foreign leaders.

International heads of state will no longer be able to ask the German government to prosecute people deemed to have offended them under an obscure passage of German law.

This was the 19th century law that Erdogan used to have a German comedian prosecuted last year. The case was later dropped though. It's somehow fitting that this is officially taken off the books now that Trump is president. I could imagine him using it in his narcism.