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Martian Law?

Started by The Brain, June 05, 2016, 02:31:51 AM

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The Brain

With all this talk of going to other planets I'm curious about the legal situation. Is there today a consensus on which law will apply where on other planets, and on legal matters in general?

The spaceship itself during the trip is just like a ship at sea I assume. No huge legal problems I guess. But what about the permanent settlements on Mars? Will some country's law apply there? If so how is it decided which country's law?

If, for instance, a settlement on Mars falls under some country's law, then you get all kinds of problems regarding inspections etc. How will the government agencies inspect compliance in the early years before routine trips are feasible (it's not unlikely that a settlement will include equipment that requires a license and so on)? You can easily end up in a situation where either the settlement or the government agency is in violation of the law. Hos will these issues be handled?

Btw, will it be easier to pass the bar on Mars than on Earth? I'm asking for a friend.
Women want me. Men want to be with me.

Martinus

I would assume it works similar to Antarctica, so each country has jurisdiction over its own citizens. The issue of enforcement is another matter - but then I assume it will "work" the same it worked for jurisdiction over expeditions on Earth in the 19th century - i.e. poorly. :P

The Brain

Quote from: Martinus on June 05, 2016, 02:37:20 AM
I would assume it works similar to Antarctica, so each country has jurisdiction over its own citizens. The issue of enforcement is another matter - but then I assume it will "work" the same it worked for jurisdiction over expeditions on Earth in the 19th century - i.e. poorly. :P

If a company operates in Antarctica, is it where it's registered that determines which law it lives under, or is it the citizenships of the owners, or how is this done?
Women want me. Men want to be with me.

Martinus

Quote from: The Brain on June 05, 2016, 02:41:55 AM
Quote from: Martinus on June 05, 2016, 02:37:20 AM
I would assume it works similar to Antarctica, so each country has jurisdiction over its own citizens. The issue of enforcement is another matter - but then I assume it will "work" the same it worked for jurisdiction over expeditions on Earth in the 19th century - i.e. poorly. :P

If a company operates in Antarctica, is it where it's registered that determines which law it lives under, or is it the citizenships of the owners, or how is this done?

The former - in fact that's how it works anywhere in the world - a French company operating in the US has to obey French law (as well as US one).

The Brain

Quote from: Martinus on June 05, 2016, 02:44:15 AM
Quote from: The Brain on June 05, 2016, 02:41:55 AM
Quote from: Martinus on June 05, 2016, 02:37:20 AM
I would assume it works similar to Antarctica, so each country has jurisdiction over its own citizens. The issue of enforcement is another matter - but then I assume it will "work" the same it worked for jurisdiction over expeditions on Earth in the 19th century - i.e. poorly. :P

If a company operates in Antarctica, is it where it's registered that determines which law it lives under, or is it the citizenships of the owners, or how is this done?

The former - in fact that's how it works anywhere in the world - a French company operating in the US has to obey French law (as well as US one).

If US and French law ever conflict they have to cease operations in the US I assume? That's one of the reasons they have local daughter companies?

If Mars doesn't have local law then companies will only be bound by the laws of the country where they are registered. How anything-goes are the laws of the worst trash countries today?
Women want me. Men want to be with me.

Zanza

According to the Outer Space Treaty, celestial bodies such as Mars are the common heritage of mankind and may not be claimed by the sovereign states of Earth. I guess that makes them lawless. The spacecraft going there are under the jurisdiction of the state that sent them.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outer_Space_Treaty

celedhring

So, the key question here is: if I murder somebody in Mars outside the spaceship, can I get away with it? I smell a Hollywood sci-fi courtroom drama here!

Martinus

Well, most countries claim jurisdiction over crimes committed against the interests of their own citizens, even by foreigners outside of their territorial jurisdiction.

MadImmortalMan

Whoever can get their computer to throw rocks accurately at the Earth gets to rule themselves.
"Stability is destabilizing." --Hyman Minsky

"Complacency can be a self-denying prophecy."
"We have nothing to fear but lack of fear itself." --Larry Summers

celedhring

Quote from: Martinus on June 05, 2016, 03:38:58 AM
Well, most countries claim jurisdiction over crimes committed against the interests of their own citizens, even by foreigners outside of their territorial jurisdiction.

What if Jack Nicholson is the defense attorney though?

garbon

Quote from: celedhring on June 05, 2016, 03:23:32 AM
So, the key question here is: if I murder somebody in Mars outside the spaceship, can I get away with it? I smell a Hollywood sci-fi courtroom drama here!

Presumably the rest of your expedition would take issue. Maybe be inclined to administer some frontier justice.
"I've never been quite sure what the point of a eunuch is, if truth be told. It seems to me they're only men with the useful bits cut off."
I drank because I wanted to drown my sorrows, but now the damned things have learned to swim.

Monoriu

If there is no efficient way for law enforcement from Earth to reach Mars, very soon the colonists will take matters into their own hands and set up their own legal system.  Which may not be a bad thing.

dps

Quote from: celedhring on June 05, 2016, 03:23:32 AM
So, the key question here is: if I murder somebody in Mars outside the spaceship, can I get away with it? I smell a Hollywood sci-fi courtroom drama here!

From Article VIII of the treaty:  "A State Party to the Treaty on whose registry an object launched into outer space is carried shall retain jurisdiction and control over such object, and over any personnel thereof, while in outer space or on a celestial body."

So basically, the crew of a spaceship is still under the law of the nation that launched the ship, even if it's landed on a planet and they've left the ship.


celedhring

Rats, guess I'll steal garbon's pitch and make it a space western instead.  :hmm:

Solmyr

Here's your law, bitches.