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The state of the EU

Started by Syt, January 09, 2016, 03:07:51 PM

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Syt

A good summary of the current frustrations with the EU:

http://www.zeit.de/politik/ausland/2016-01/europe-integration-polen-hungary-moral-ultimatum-crisis

QuoteIn the Land of the Lawless

Not only Poland is refusing to follow the European Union's lead. Overall, the community of states is losing its power to persuade. What's going on?

So that's the way things are headed in the community of states that just a short while ago could be considered the most civilized in the history of the world. The European Commission waves an admonishing finger at Warsaw and Warsaw gives it the finger in return. If you look for that one moment when the European Union (E.U.) began to fall apart at the highest level, the moment at which Europe stopped growing through crises and instead asked itself the question – what greater value does a union of states actually have over a strong national state – this exchange of words could have been it.

"The rule of law is one of the common values on which the union is founded," European Commission First Vice-President Frans Timmermans wrote to Poland's foreign minister and justice minister shortly before Christmas. The Dutchman warned the new ruling conservative government, in words that were only half-way diplomatic, about "undermining" the independence of the Polish constitutional court.

What the two ministers gave back in return was more than just a response to an admonition to keep things clean in the government. It was a rejection of the European idea per se. Poland is a sovereign country, according to Justice Minister Zbigniew Ziobro, and that means, "I don't think that an external body can impose something on us, because that could conflict with our sense of national pride." Foreign Minister Witold Waszczykowski added that any E.U. official "who came to office via political connections" is "not a legitimate partner for me."

These are words that mark a turning point. Until now, the working consensus of the E.U. has been that member states yield part of their sovereignty, pool it in Brussels and through the manifold power of the states, gain back all the more sovereignty. It is now precisely this – committing to delegated power – that appears to the new Polish government to be an infringement of their national pride and Brussels as a world of backrooms in which a few unelected, instead of many elected, make the decisions. So far it has only been angry citizens who have talked like that when they saw themselves being robbed of their self-determination by being forced to adopt energy-saving lamps or through free trade agreements. Now governments are talking that way.

Prime Minister Viktor Orbán of Hungary has an equally hostile view of Brussels, as do the Czech Republic's president, Miloš Zeman ("This land is our land"), as well as a third of the French who recently voted for the Front National. In Finland, an anti-E.U. party is now part of the government, and in the country next door, the no-less anti-integrationist, right-wing populist Sweden Democrats are leading in the opinion polls. In the Netherlands, the Mephistophelian, far-right Dutch politician Geert Wilders is now on an equal footing with the two major mainstream parties, as is the clownish anti-establishment Five Star Movement in Italy.

What is right-wing and what is left-wing criticism of the E.U.? Hard to say when ultimately both are concerned about the same thing: raising the will of the people above an international architecture that has become irritating and inconvenient. The hatred of an E.U. cartel that imposes either economic or cultural rules is uniting the nationalists and socialists in Europe, occasionally even allowing them join together, as in Greece, where the left-radical Syriza formed a coalition with the national-chauvinistic ANEL party.

Left and right have become second-class categories

In Britain, the reforms that Tory Prime Minister David Cameron desires can be roughly summed up in two demands. Leave us in peace with your fanaticism about "an ever-closer union." And keep us out of your common currency mush.

In short, left and right have become second-class categories in 2016 in Europe. Today, the actual stock question is do you want more Europe or less? More and more Europeans want less. That is a reverse of thrust, and it has taken place as drastically as that of a passenger plane touching down on the runway. Where has this sudden reverse energy come from?

It certainly comes from different sources in Poland than in France, Sweden, England or Greece. And yet there is a tipping point, one that all camps would maintain has come, that the E.U. is now no longer expanding through conviction but rather through subjugation.

The conviction that allowed the E.U. to grow once was that Europe's mini-states (and there are only mini-states in Europe) will only be able to compete in globalization if they link arms and band together. The euro helps them in doing this because it makes trade within the E.U. just as easy and reliable as trading with it. The Schengen Agreement lets the national borders fall for the market and the people but in turn the E.U.'s outer borders will be all the more protected. Europe blossoms as an ever-more elegant area of prosperity, security and justice.

You don't have to be anti-Europe to see that a lot of this conviction was starry-eyed naivety. Europe's outer borders have remained open in the largest refugee movement since the end of the Second World War, with the result that the barriers have been closing again like dominoes in the interior and, of all places, in border regions that have grown so close together, such as those between Sweden, Denmark and Germany.

Should we accept ultimatums from a club of rule-breakers?

The euro? Unfortunately, it reinforced the tendency to waste money in countries that had that tendency and, in doing so, weakened Europe's economic region. Above all, many core E.U. countries, Spain, Italy, France, are today economically worse off than 10 years ago; all of the young unemployed there are searching in vain for the benefits of the euro and globalization. The fact that the cause might possibly be ultimately with the E.U. is often lost. Brussels is too handy as a code word for the failure of the elite and powers of capitalism.

Lastly, the promise of an "area of justice." In order to save the euro, its member states pretty much broke every rule that had ever been written for the monetary union, and in order to distribute the refugees, a quota solution, which was forced through by a majority decision of the European Council, is suddenly supposed to follow the suspended Dublin Regulation. And resounding out of Warsaw is, should we accept ultimatums from this club, from a reform school for nations that is more ambitious in issuing rules than in following rules?

"The good of the nation is above the law." This sentence is one of the most sinister that can currently be heard in the parliament in Poland. It was said by Kornel Morawiecki of the Kukiz'15 movement. It is an outrageous statement, a justification for despotism, the likes of which it was thought would never be heard again in Europe, certainly not from a former Solidarność fighter. The stupid thing is, if you replace "nation" with "European Union," the sentence could just as well have come from Angela Merkel.

Hungary's head of government, Mr. Orbán, accused the chancellor of "moral imperialism" when she proposed distributing the refugees around Europe. The broader resentment behind such remarks is a feeling that the E.U. is being led in Berlin and Brussels by a squad of modern-day sanctimonious hypocrites who believe they must force their concepts of higher political culture on others. The Polish foreign minister complained on Monday in the German daily Bild newspaper about "25 years of leftist and liberal indoctrination," without naming the brainwashers by name. Mr. Waszczykowski describes all the more vividly what lies in store for his country if wackos of that sort aren't put a stop to in the media: a new "mix of cultures and races, a world of bicycle-riders and vegetarians who only rely on renewable energies and fight against every form of religion."

In other words, never again having to adhere to a concept of salvation. Never again be a satellite state. Never again be ruled over by foreign apparatchiks, who consider themselves the avant-garde. It is no surprise that the loudest right-wing critics of Europe often come from the ranks of former East-European dissidents.

The disappointment over Europe from the left sounds about the same, except the imperialism comes in the form of economic torture. A broad anti-neo-liberal International believes the E.U.'s honoring of democracy is simply a label, because no matter how a people decide about their economic policy, in the end it is forced under the yoke of austerity by the Brussels-Berlin-Frankfurt troika. Not a market for people but market before people is the working principle of the E.U. The example of the Transatlantic Trade and Investment Partnership (TTIP) also makes people in North America able to connect with the thought that non-elected negotiators authorize non-elected company bosses to strip parliaments of power. Greek Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras was glad to see at the close of 2015 that Greece "no longer stands alone" in opposition to Brussels, "this kingdom of bureaucracy." No wonder that he scores points with his criticism, particularly with young people, for whom the E.U. promises to open up the world and who, instead, don't even have the key to their own apartment in their pocket.

And now? Is the E.U. coming into a tailspin because its wings, the big promises of integration, are breaking off?

At any rate, the plane can't be pulled up by the European Council depriving Poland of its voting right. Of course, a community of liberal democracies must react when the division of powers and the checks and balances are done away with, when the judiciary and the media are brought into line. But it must also exactly diagnose what is fueling this neo-authoritarianism. Is it the stress of democracies trying to adapt that are only half as old as the others? Or is it at times simply the overwhelming demands, both cultural and economic? Then a possible answer might be the rediscovery of an old idea, of a Europe of not only two speeds, but three, four speeds, one that learns to live with everything not happening at the same time. But above all, it should be a Europe that spurs on the quick instead of punishing the slow and by doing so only putting them more on the defensive.

Citizens are proving day-for-day, for example, how much more quicker, younger and energetic Polish civil society is compared to a government that has half its brain stuck in USSR paranoia. Defiant radio producers and journalists who simply play the Anthem of Europe every hour – imagine that happening on the BBC or the German station ARD. The world will be hearing, must hear, much more about them in the future.

In the meantime, Europe can very well take a tough stance against authoritarian, illiberal governments without necessarily mobilizing the E.U., namely by bilateral actions, and lots of it. Dozens of needle-pricks from the capitals of Europe can do more than a hollow beat of the drum from Brussels, because the two Polish ministers are right about one thing, you shouldn't just hear a rebuke from a secondary authority like that of an E.U. commissioner for first order violations of freedom. Rather a defense of the greatest democratic value.
I am, somehow, less interested in the weight and convolutions of Einstein's brain than in the near certainty that people of equal talent have lived and died in cotton fields and sweatshops.
—Stephen Jay Gould

Proud owner of 42 Zoupa Points.

The Brain

Quote"The rule of law is one of the common values on which the union is founded," European Commission First Vice-President Frans Timmermans wrote to Poland's foreign minister and justice minister shortly before Christmas. The Dutchman warned the new ruling conservative government, in words that were only half-way diplomatic, about "undermining" the independence of the Polish constitutional court.

Sweden doesn't even have a constitutional court.
Women want me. Men want to be with me.

Crazy_Ivan80

how credible is the EU when it tries to punish Poland for doing what it does while at the same time sucking up to Turkey which is far, far worse?

If there's no credibility, there's no authority.

Martinus

Quote from: Crazy_Ivan80 on January 09, 2016, 04:46:03 PM
how credible is the EU when it tries to punish Poland for doing what it does while at the same time sucking up to Turkey which is far, far worse?

If there's no credibility, there's no authority.

I don't care about Turkey. I hope it punishes Poland for what it does. Turkey isn't an EU member. Go fuck yourself.

Admiral Yi

The EU has plenty of credibility issues.  There's no need to look at different treatment of members and non-members.

Crazy_Ivan80

Quote from: Martinus on January 09, 2016, 04:51:21 PM
Quote from: Crazy_Ivan80 on January 09, 2016, 04:46:03 PM
how credible is the EU when it tries to punish Poland for doing what it does while at the same time sucking up to Turkey which is far, far worse?

If there's no credibility, there's no authority.

I don't care about Turkey. I hope it punishes Poland for what it does. Turkey isn't an EU member. Go fuck yourself.
your charming self again eh. If you're hoping for the EU to do something... Well, I'm still waiting for the EU to do something about Orban. Or to terminate the accession-negotiations with Turkey. The sooner you accept that Brussels doesn't care about democracy the better.

Zanza

Will be interesting to see if Britain stays in or leaves and if the latter how it will be handled.

A lot of advantages of the EU are fairly abstract and hard to grasp, whereas its perceived downsides are much more blatant. I think that's why it was always a project of the elites.

I think the EU is a bit like the "What have the Romans ever done for us?" scene in Life of Brian.

alfred russel

Two of the biggest benefits seem to be economic integration and mobility which don't really require the EU. I think the really big benefit that you need the EU for is to keep countries politically in line and not to do dumbass stuff--especially in the former soviet bloc. It is easy to point out shortcomings on that front, but without the EU I highly doubt the former communist countries would have westernized politically so quickly.
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

There's a fine line between salvation and drinking poison in the jungle.

I'm embarrassed. I've been making the mistake of associating with you. It won't happen again. :)
-garbon, February 23, 2014

Monoriu

The EU should focus on things like the common market, free movement of goods and people, standardisation of rules, common currency, adherence to financial rules, defence against common foes, etc.  There really is no reason to meddle in Polish politics.  In other words, the economic use rather than the political use.

Zanza

Quote from: Monoriu on January 09, 2016, 07:47:52 PM
The EU should focus on things like the common market, free movement of goods and people, standardisation of rules, common currency, adherence to financial rules, defence against common foes, etc.  There really is no reason to meddle in Polish politics.  In other words, the economic use rather than the political use.
The EU does mostly focus on economic issues. Alfreds comment that you don't need the EU for economic Integration  makes no sense as that's it's main task. There would be massive non-tariff barriers to trade without the EU in Europe.

Iormlund

Quote from: Zanza on January 09, 2016, 06:25:43 PM
Will be interesting to see if Britain stays in or leaves and if the latter how it will be handled.

A lot of advantages of the EU are fairly abstract and hard to grasp, whereas its perceived downsides are much more blatant. I think that's why it was always a project of the elites.

I think the EU is a bit like the "What have the Romans ever done for us?" scene in Life of Brian.

The problem is the elites fucked up big time. Brussels needs to realize it will take a generation of solid results to regain what was lost in the last ten years. There's no point in carrying on as if nothing happened.

alfred russel

Quote from: Zanza on January 09, 2016, 09:33:47 PM

The EU does mostly focus on economic issues. Alfreds comment that you don't need the EU for economic Integration  makes no sense as that's it's main task. There would be massive non-tariff barriers to trade without the EU in Europe.

Because you had the European Economic Community before the EU to do the same stuff.
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

There's a fine line between salvation and drinking poison in the jungle.

I'm embarrassed. I've been making the mistake of associating with you. It won't happen again. :)
-garbon, February 23, 2014

Eddie Teach

I believe the EEC morphed into the EU.
To sleep, perchance to dream. But in that sleep of death, what dreams may come?

Crazy_Ivan80

Quote from: Zanza on January 09, 2016, 06:25:43 PM
A lot of advantages of the EU are fairly abstract and hard to grasp, whereas its perceived downsides are much more blatant. I think that's why it was always a project of the elites.

as admitted by Herman Van Rompuy himself

(http://www.tijd.be/opinie/column/Met_55_miljoen.9715436-2337.art?ckc=1)
QuoteIn een eindejaarsinterview met De Tijd gaf Herman Van Rompuy toe dat Schengen als een avontuur begon. 'Er is niet nagedacht over hoe het zou functioneren bij crisissen. Dat komt wel vanzelf, dachten ze toen.' Maar dat bleek een schromelijke vergissing, zoals wel vaker in Europa.
exec translation: During an end-of-year-interview with "De Tijd" Herman Van Rompuy admitted that Shengen started as an adventure. 'We didn't think about how it would function during crises. That'll sort itself out, the thinking went.' That, however, turned out to be a mistake, as happens more often in Europe.

Quote from: google translate
In a year-end interview with Time gave Herman Van Rompuy that Schengen started as an adventure. "There is no thought about how it would function in crises. That comes naturally, she thought then. "But that was a gross mistake, as often in Europe.


The past year has landed one million refugees on the territory of the European Union. This is stated in the latest reports from the refugee agency of the United Nations and the International Organization for Migration. If beating the forecasts of the European Commission, the influx continues. By 2060 Europe can expect another 55 million refugees.

Former President of the European Council Herman Van Rompuy told almost casually in the double interview with Geert Mak in Deduction, the annual Time. To give you an idea: 55 million, which equates to more than 10 percent of the current number of EU citizens and 10 million more than the entire population of Spain. "And those are figures prior to the refugee crisis," stated Van Rompuy.

For the wise: it is certainly not exclude that there will be more. Not only the conflict in Syria, and Iraq continues, the fire may spread at any time in neighboring Turkey, Jordan and Lebanon. And even to Israel, at least according to the latest threat of Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, called caliph of the Islamic State.

The forecast of the flow of asylum seekers million dates back to the refugee crisis, put the omission, if not the indecision of the European institutions more in the limelight. The real asylum crisis had yet to begin when MSF, the situation in the Greek centers beginning in 2014 as 'hellish' described. Four years earlier, in the village of Sidero along the Greek side of the Maritsa discovered a mass grave with 200 bodies of refugees who had not survived the crossing of the river from Turkey. It took years for the Greek government, the existence of the mass grave yielded.

There was already a telegenic trip to the Italian island of Lampedusa, where the media caravan that he brought in his wake was carrying the committee in view of stranded refugees. In the comfortable European headquarters was mostly the other hand looked at. Meanwhile, were formed at the external borders of the Union makeshift camps, homeless and desperate refugees jogged through the streets of Brussels and other European cities, and grew up around Calais and Dunkirk shanty towns whose residents number only approximately known.

In Conclusion Van Rompuy stated: "I do agree with you that it has launched the euro and Schengen as an adventure. There has not thought about how that would function in crises. Or that comes naturally, she thought then. Now it appears that they have grossly mistaken. "Anyone who then dared to warn, was dismissed as a narrow nationalist eurofobe.


Unworthy of man

Today grab those two mistakes - the euro crisis and the refugee crisis - on display in Europe, and has lost control of events.

A banking union that should perpetuate the future of the euro will remain a dream without the Germans blocked off European deposit guarantee scheme. The currency policy was completely outsourced to the European Central Bank, which holds the European economy into a prolonged stagnation of its holdings of quantitative money easing. Moreover, the asylum crisis affecting the eurozone countries while they are still struggling with the consequences of the financial crisis. Especially in Greece, Italy and Portugal, where the banking crisis continues, with collapsing banks as a result.

The European begrotingsoekazes most euro area countries have little or no fiscal space left. The outcome of the recent parliamentary elections in Spain there is a compelling consequence. Plagued by a youth unemployment rate of 50 percent, the country has dealt with the traditional power parties. Not only because of the savings exercises imposed by Europe, but also because of the corruption of the two major parties, the Christian Democratic PP and socialist PSOE, which aflosten each other over the decades to the EU udders.

Like the euro crisis, the refugee crisis the old state boundaries once uncovered in the EU, but also the internal rifts in the Member States. Significantly, the threat of the richest German state of Bavaria itself to monitor its borders and thus slow down the influx of asylum seekers.

According to Van Rompuy and other European leaders no one needs to worry: the rapidly aging Europe needed immigrants. It is reassuring that is repeated in European salons like a mantra. The European elite has the bad habit to serve a number of assumptions on the duration as indisputable truths. And if it turns out that she was mistaken, as in the overly rapid introduction of the euro or the sloppy implementation of the Schengen Agreement is from Brussels invariably handed the same panacea 'more Europe.'

Economists ensure that it is perfectly possible to integrate refugees and we are also better off. But for one will install them as saviors of the rapidly aging Occident, they still have something to offer other than blankets, bread and jungle camps such as those around Calais, where less than two hours from Brussels over 5,000 men, women and children in degrading huddle together conditions.

Germany puts thousands of teachers to teach newcomers the German, the German states put billions on the table to fund the shelter. In Flanders, along the bottom of the government funds are scraped to schools to enable refugee children to learn Dutch, to make them as offering a chance for real training. To the Syrian, Iraqi, Afghan and Eritrean parents of those children get started quickly, the rigidity of the Belgian labor market. If not, they end up in gray and black circuits.

It takes a generation and colossal resources to fit into the oncoming refugees in Western European society, preferably without too much social friction. Recent incidents and people upheavals - including Germany, the Corsican Ajaccio and Geldermalsen in the Netherlands - indicating that it will not run on a slate roof. And already not without a serious revision of the budgetary requirements and streamlining the European agreements, which are intended to prevent EU Member States come into conflict.

Van Rompuy does not believe that the EU is falling apart. "Because the people would never forgive their leaders." The latter is far from certain. Europe remains in force as long as Germany keeps the rating agencies in their basket. The European citizens, who will be leaders becoming ill that they not only spasmodically and at a heavy social cost to holding together the EU, but despite contrary signals - most recently the Danish 'nej branch' - wanted to force further integration.

On and around the Schuman roundabout they do not seem to realize that Viktor Orban, Marine Le Pen, Andrzej Duda and Milos Zeman and their supporters are also EU creations

alfred russel

Quote from: Peter Wiggin on January 10, 2016, 12:55:09 AM
I believe the EEC morphed into the EU.

Through a treaty that expanded the community into territories beyond the economic one.
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

There's a fine line between salvation and drinking poison in the jungle.

I'm embarrassed. I've been making the mistake of associating with you. It won't happen again. :)
-garbon, February 23, 2014