Facebook Follies of Friends and Families

[Berkut]

the problem when you think you're so right on something is it can lead to you unintentionally overlooking or misinterpreting things that should change your views

Thank you Captain Obvious.

[LaCroix]

well, you said you didn't get the objection

[dps]

Yeah, obviously a person should feel he is right about things that he has an opinion on, because, well, why would anyone hold an opinion which he felt he was wrong on.

OTOH, on most things, a person should probably at least acknowledge that it's possible that he's wrong.  If you don't do that, you can never grow or learn.  Of course, when you're debating something, it's tough to acknowledge that you might be wrong, because people will try to twist that to prove that you're wrong.

Beyond that, though, I have to disagree to a certain extent with DGuller's view that the American people in general agree on what would be good outcomes for society, at least to the extent that it's a useful starting point for evaluating policies.  Sure, we almost all agree that a terrorist attack on a major US city that kills 50,000 people would be a bad thing, and that we should have policies that prevent it, or at least minimize the likelihood of it happening.  But I'd hesitate to say that there's any consensus as to what policies would accomplish that with the least interference with our fundamental freedoms, or even it any interference with our fundamental freedoms is permissible in pursuit of the goal.  Heck, we can't even agree on what the exact limits of our fundamental freedoms are.  Is owning a handgun a fundamental freedom?  Is abortion?  Gay marriage?  Burning the US flag? 

[derspiess]

I think everything is fine at this point.

[Zoupa]

But no matter - keep pretending like everything is fine, and the left doesn't need to change their message or presentation. And we will see more Donald Trumps.

I don't think very many people are pretending everything is fine at this point.

Plenty of people are pretending like the problem is just racist right wingers, and there is no problem with the left, or how it is perceived by moderates and the right, at all.

And again, I think that is actually *mostly* true - I don't hang a majority of the blame on the left. But it only takes a small shift to see horrendous outcomes - something like a couple hundred thousand votes in a couple states.

But Trump got a decent chunk of votes from people who voted for Obama last time. Presumably THOSE people are not racists.

The left has to figure out how to start appealing to more than just the died in the whool left wing "elitists". And I very much consider myself one of those elitists.

Let's not forget that Hillary, an incredibly flawed candidate for a lefty like me, got about 3 million more votes. If your system made any sense, she'd be president.

Trump voters are responsible for their vote. It's not the Democratic party's fault that people voted for Trump. Again, they got 3 million more votes with a flawed candidate. Why is the onus on the DNC to change tactics and modify their message, vision etc? Because a few hundred thousand white guys in the midwest have disproportionate electoral college influence?

Fuck those people. They wanted Trump. They got him. Sometimes you only learn not to touch the oven after you get burned. Maybe once they see their situation worsen under the orange pedonazi, they'll start thinking about their vote more. Or maybe not, who knows.

[Razgovory]

Berkut is right.  The left, in US as a whole, is unambiguously in the right on about 80% of the issues, but political correctness or whatever you choose to call it is their biggest failing.  There is definitely a climate where a lot of true things cannot be said in polite company, and should one commit a faux pas and say them anyway, the cultured people are supposed to counter with a specious argument.

We just don't give confederates a fair shake.

[Syt]

Various family members are cheering that Trump refused to take questions from a CNN reporter during his press conference, saying that he should just ignore press and reporters completely and keep them in the dark.

[Razgovory]

Once a German, always a German.

[grumbler]

... just the died in the whool left wing "elitists"...

[CountDeMoney]

... just the died in the whool left wing "elitists"...

That's awesome.

[derspiess]

Because a few hundred thousand white guys in the midwest have disproportionate electoral college influence?

[derspiess]

Various family members are cheering that Trump refused to take questions from a CNN reporter during his press conference, saying that he should just ignore press and reporters completely and keep them in the dark.

Lemme guess, you're seeing a lot of that Batman slapping CNN meme? 

[viper37]

Trump voters are responsible for their vote. It's not the Democratic party's fault that people voted for Trump. Again, they got 3 million more votes with a flawed candidate. Why is the onus on the DNC to change tactics and modify their message, vision etc? Because a few hundred thousand white guys in the midwest have disproportionate electoral college influence?

The Republicans are responsible for designating him as their candidate, but once he's their candidate, I find it hard to blame Republicans voting for a Republican candidate.  Most PQ supporters supported the charter, until it cost them the election, then they all said they were against it.  The same would have happenned to the Republicans.

Fuck those people. They wanted Trump. They got him. Sometimes you only learn not to touch the oven after you get burned. Maybe once they see their situation worsen under the orange pedonazi, they'll start thinking about their vote more. Or maybe not, who knows.

If you look at the numbers, the problem is the number of Democrats who voted Obama but refused to endorse Hillary.  Again, it's a problem of loyalty.  They didn't get their boy Sanders, they got convinced by him that Hillary or Trump was more of the same, and they stayed home, or even voted for Trump this time.

This was the problem.  The left lacking loyalty and honor, as always.  Petty disputes over&over again, just like in the PQ where we now have to deal with Option Nationale and Quebec Solidaire morons on top of the uber leftist PQ intelligentsia like Martine Ouellet's supporters. Could they rally together and agree on a common centrist platform to fight the Liberals?  No, that was too much to asked.  As Oex once told me, the left wing would never agree to follow in a right direction.  Compromise for the left means the rightwing must shut up and follow the left to the edge of the cliff.

Well, the Americans are at the cliff now, thanks to Bernie Sanders and his Bernie bros.

I can't blame morons for acting like morons, it's like blaming a snake for biting.  But I can blame supposedly intelligent people for refusing to vote against the most dangerous individual to their country.

[Syt]

Various family members are cheering that Trump refused to take questions from a CNN reporter during his press conference, saying that he should just ignore press and reporters completely and keep them in the dark.

Lemme guess, you're seeing a lot of that Batman slapping CNN meme?

Some.

And this.

[CountDeMoney]

Lol, they just slap letters and words together, don't they?