"Fuck off and die, Political Correctness!"-- Jonathan Chait

Started by Queequeg, January 27, 2015, 04:44:30 PM

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Siege

Very patronizing of the American conservative movement.
Also, today there is no difference between liberals and the left. Both shun free speech and free market as unequilizing social conventions, tools of the dominant class, whether the dominant class is perceived to be white people, the rich, the male patriarchy, or whatever flavor they are smoking that day.


"All men are created equal, then some become infantry."

"Those who beat their swords into plowshares will plow for those who don't."

"Laissez faire et laissez passer, le monde va de lui même!"


crazy canuck

Quote from: Jacob on January 27, 2015, 11:11:21 PM
My mistake, I fell into the bad American habit of equating "liberal" with leftist.

My summary should have been: "Political Correctness gone mad. It's the lefties who are the real oppressors."

Not quite accurate either.  His view is more nuanced than that.  It is an echo of the warning Orwell gave about the authoritarian left after his experience is Spain and imo it is a warning that shouldn't be forgotten.

Crazy_Ivan80

Quote from: crazy canuck on January 28, 2015, 07:42:32 AM
Quote from: Jacob on January 27, 2015, 11:11:21 PM
My mistake, I fell into the bad American habit of equating "liberal" with leftist.

My summary should have been: "Political Correctness gone mad. It's the lefties who are the real oppressors."

Not quite accurate either.  His view is more nuanced than that.  It is an echo of the warning Orwell gave about the authoritarian left after his experience is Spain and imo it is a warning that shouldn't be forgotten.

indeed. the article was a good read. And in a p-c world it wouldn't have been allowed and it's writer put away in some gulag.

grumbler

Quote from: Siege on January 28, 2015, 06:20:24 AM
Very patronizing of the American conservative movement.
Also, today there is no difference between liberals and the left. Both shun free speech and free market as unequilizing social conventions, tools of the dominant class, whether the dominant class is perceived to be white people, the rich, the male patriarchy, or whatever flavor they are smoking that day.

Today there are effectively no differences between the liberals and conservatives.  Both sides want to impose their dogma without it being challenged or debated.  What that dogma is doesn't really matter to either side.
The future is all around us, waiting, in moments of transition, to be born in moments of revelation. No one knows the shape of that future or where it will take us. We know only that it is always born in pain.   -G'Kar

Bayraktar!

crazy canuck

Quote from: grumbler on January 28, 2015, 09:47:12 AM
Quote from: Siege on January 28, 2015, 06:20:24 AM
Very patronizing of the American conservative movement.
Also, today there is no difference between liberals and the left. Both shun free speech and free market as unequilizing social conventions, tools of the dominant class, whether the dominant class is perceived to be white people, the rich, the male patriarchy, or whatever flavor they are smoking that day.

Today there are effectively no differences between the liberals and conservatives. 

Wow.

Baron von Schtinkenbutt

Quote from: crazy canuck on January 28, 2015, 10:09:56 AM
Quote from: grumbler on January 28, 2015, 09:47:12 AM
Quote from: Siege on January 28, 2015, 06:20:24 AM
Very patronizing of the American conservative movement.
Also, today there is no difference between liberals and the left. Both shun free speech and free market as unequilizing social conventions, tools of the dominant class, whether the dominant class is perceived to be white people, the rich, the male patriarchy, or whatever flavor they are smoking that day.

Today there are effectively no differences between the liberals and conservatives. 

Wow.

:secret:  grumbler is mocking Siege's ridiculous statement.

KRonn

QuoteTrigger warnings aren't much help in actually overcoming trauma — an analysis by the Institute of Medicine has found that the best approach is controlled exposure to it, and experts say avoidance can reinforce suffering. Indeed, one professor at a prestigious university told me that, just in the last few years, she has noticed a dramatic upsurge in her students' sensitivity toward even the mildest social or ideological slights; she and her fellow faculty members are terrified of facing accusations of triggering trauma — or, more consequentially, violating her school's new sexual-harassment policy — merely by carrying out the traditional academic work of intellectual exploration. "This is an environment of fear, believe it or not," she told me by way of explaining her request for anonymity. It reminds her of the previous outbreak of political correctness — "Every other day I say to my friends, 'How did we get back to 1991?' "

But it would be a mistake to categorize today's p.c. culture as only an academic phenomenon. Political correctness is a style of politics in which the more radical members of the left attempt to regulate political discourse by defining opposing views as bigoted and illegitimate. Two decades ago, the only communities where the left could exert such hegemonic control lay within academia, which gave it an influence on intellectual life far out of proportion to its numeric size. Today's political correctness flourishes most consequentially on social media, where it enjoys a frisson of cool and vast new cultural reach. And since social media is also now the milieu that hosts most political debate, the new p.c. has attained an influence over mainstream journalism and commentary beyond that of the old. 

Good article and food for thought. I think it brings out some good points on how far gone "political correctness" can sometimes go, to society's detriment.

Eddie Teach

To sleep, perchance to dream. But in that sleep of death, what dreams may come?

crazy canuck

Quote from: Baron von Schtinkenbutt on January 28, 2015, 10:26:34 AM
Quote from: crazy canuck on January 28, 2015, 10:09:56 AM
Quote from: grumbler on January 28, 2015, 09:47:12 AM
Quote from: Siege on January 28, 2015, 06:20:24 AM
Very patronizing of the American conservative movement.
Also, today there is no difference between liberals and the left. Both shun free speech and free market as unequilizing social conventions, tools of the dominant class, whether the dominant class is perceived to be white people, the rich, the male patriarchy, or whatever flavor they are smoking that day.

Today there are effectively no differences between the liberals and conservatives. 

Wow.

:secret:  grumbler is mocking Siege's ridiculous statement.

I hope so.  Although Grumbler tried to say something similar in another thread so I am not entirely sure you are correct.

The Brain

Universities ceased to be relevant decades ago. At least close down everything non-STEM.
Women want me. Men want to be with me.

Siege

Quote from: Baron von Schtinkenbutt on January 28, 2015, 10:26:34 AM
Quote from: crazy canuck on January 28, 2015, 10:09:56 AM
Quote from: grumbler on January 28, 2015, 09:47:12 AM
Quote from: Siege on January 28, 2015, 06:20:24 AM
Very patronizing of the American conservative movement.
Also, today there is no difference between liberals and the left. Both shun free speech and free market as unequilizing social conventions, tools of the dominant class, whether the dominant class is perceived to be white people, the rich, the male patriarchy, or whatever flavor they are smoking that day.

Today there are effectively no differences between the liberals and conservatives. 

Wow.

:secret:  grumbler is mocking Siege's ridiculous statement.

What ridiculous statement?
I just stated the truth.


"All men are created equal, then some become infantry."

"Those who beat their swords into plowshares will plow for those who don't."

"Laissez faire et laissez passer, le monde va de lui même!"


Razgovory

Quote from: Baron von Schtinkenbutt on January 28, 2015, 10:26:34 AM
Quote from: crazy canuck on January 28, 2015, 10:09:56 AM
Quote from: grumbler on January 28, 2015, 09:47:12 AM
Quote from: Siege on January 28, 2015, 06:20:24 AM
Very patronizing of the American conservative movement.
Also, today there is no difference between liberals and the left. Both shun free speech and free market as unequilizing social conventions, tools of the dominant class, whether the dominant class is perceived to be white people, the rich, the male patriarchy, or whatever flavor they are smoking that day.

Today there are effectively no differences between the liberals and conservatives. 

Wow.

:secret:  grumbler is mocking Siege's ridiculous statement.

No, he's just going full libertarian.  You can be forgiven into thinking the ideology is some kind of parody or farce, but sadly it's not.
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

grumbler

Quote from: Baron von Schtinkenbutt on January 28, 2015, 10:26:34 AM
Quote from: crazy canuck on January 28, 2015, 10:09:56 AM
Wow.

:secret:  grumbler is mocking Siege's ridiculous statement.

Some people don't get "subtle."  Just laugh and move on; it's not worthy of notice.
The future is all around us, waiting, in moments of transition, to be born in moments of revelation. No one knows the shape of that future or where it will take us. We know only that it is always born in pain.   -G'Kar

Bayraktar!

The Minsky Moment

grumbler the libertarian is on par with Malthus the virulent anti-French bigot.
The purpose of studying economics is not to acquire a set of ready-made answers to economic questions, but to learn how to avoid being deceived by economists.
--Joan Robinson

grumbler

Quote from: KRonn on January 28, 2015, 10:37:00 AM
Good article and food for thought. I think it brings out some good points on how far gone "political correctness" can sometimes go, to society's detriment.

I agree.  There have always been universities that have resisted the pc movement, but I think that this gets harder as the stuents arrive with, via social media, an already-existing commitment to pc.  PC is popular with teens because, with pc, everyone can be a victim!
The future is all around us, waiting, in moments of transition, to be born in moments of revelation. No one knows the shape of that future or where it will take us. We know only that it is always born in pain.   -G'Kar

Bayraktar!