11 dead in French satirical magazine shooting

[Sheilbh]

A statement from Salman Rushdie, now being re-tweeted by Neil Gaiman and other writers:

"Religion, a mediaeval form of unreason, when combined with modern weaponry becomes a real threat to our freedoms. This religious totalitarianism has caused a deadly mutation in the heart of Islam and we see the tragic consequences in Paris today. I stand with Charlie Hebdo, as we all must, to defend the art of satire, which has always been a force for liberty and against tyranny, dishonesty and stupidity. 'Respect for religion' has become a code phrase meaning 'fear of religion.' Religions, like all other ideas, deserve criticism, satire, and, yes, our fearless disrespect."  –Salman Rushdie

I could not agree more. I guess for several people here, that's racism and bigotry but go fuck yourself.

I think those last sentences are really interesting. I saw these tweets by Stephen Pollard:

Easy to attack papers for not showing cartoons. But here's my editor's dilemma. Every principle I hold tells me to print them. But 1/2
what right do I have to risk the lives of my staff to make a point? 2/2
Because this isn't a mere debate about principles. As today showed, this is about lives. These people are butchers.
No, Charlie Hebdon didn't provoke anyone. It published cartoons.
Get real, folks. A Jewish newspaper like mine that published such cartoons would be at the front of the queue for Islamists to murder.
None of my points mean we shouldn't or wouldn't publish. I'm simply explaining it's a dilemma and not a simple issue of principle

I agree with him. I think if you're a blogger it's maybe fine to publish but if you're an editor it's a really difficult decision especially because you know it would put everyone from the receptionist up at risk. It's fine to make that point if you're explicit about it. What Pollard says here is 'the reason we maybe wouldn't is because of fear' which is in itself a pretty strong political point. It's trying to turn that into a point of principle about 'respect' that I think sticks in the craw.

Edit: And incidentally Art Goldhammer has a great piece on the blasphemous tradition Charlie Hebdo is part of:
http://america.aljazeera.com/opinions/2015/1/charlie-hebdo-gouaillesatireislamjournalism.html
Which is very 18th century. Maybe a better British comparison is Viz rather than Private Eye?

[Martinus]

Why is it that all religions "deserve" disrespect?

Because they demand respect.

Yup.

[Viking]

A statement from Salman Rushdie, now being re-tweeted by Neil Gaiman and other writers:

"Religion, a mediaeval form of unreason, when combined with modern weaponry becomes a real threat to our freedoms. This religious totalitarianism has caused a deadly mutation in the heart of Islam and we see the tragic consequences in Paris today. I stand with Charlie Hebdo, as we all must, to defend the art of satire, which has always been a force for liberty and against tyranny, dishonesty and stupidity. 'Respect for religion' has become a code phrase meaning 'fear of religion.' Religions, like all other ideas, deserve criticism, satire, and, yes, our fearless disrespect."  –Salman Rushdie

I could not agree more. I guess for several people here, that's racism and bigotry but go fuck yourself.

And so extremism begets more extremism.

Why is it that all religions "deserve" disrespect?

Find me one which is morale, ethical, true and logical and I'll respect it.

[Jacob]

Why is it that all religions "deserve" disrespect?

Because they demand respect.

Yup.

What should we do about gay people demanding respect?

[Malthus]

A statement from Salman Rushdie, now being re-tweeted by Neil Gaiman and other writers:

"Religion, a mediaeval form of unreason, when combined with modern weaponry becomes a real threat to our freedoms. This religious totalitarianism has caused a deadly mutation in the heart of Islam and we see the tragic consequences in Paris today. I stand with Charlie Hebdo, as we all must, to defend the art of satire, which has always been a force for liberty and against tyranny, dishonesty and stupidity. 'Respect for religion' has become a code phrase meaning 'fear of religion.' Religions, like all other ideas, deserve criticism, satire, and, yes, our fearless disrespect."  –Salman Rushdie

I could not agree more. I guess for several people here, that's racism and bigotry but go fuck yourself.

It is silly in several respects.

First, there is nothing particularly "medieval" about religion - something that has existed since, as far as we know, the dawn of humanity.

Second, the notion that these terrorists represent the "heart of Islam" is simply untrue.

Third, while I support the right to satirize anything without fear of violence, I am unclear as to why all ideas "deserve disrespect".

[The Brain]

Many posters support terrorism. Film at 11.

[Sheilbh]

Third, while I support the right to satirize anything without fear of violence, I am unclear as to why all ideas "deserve disrespect".

To tie in with our other discussion it avoids a secular version of idolatry.

[Duque de Bragança]

suspects arrested, apparently.

Good.

Sorry, not yet, but they were identified. One from Reims, the other two, brothers, from Gennevilliers, a Parisian suburb.

[Viking]

A statement from Salman Rushdie, now being re-tweeted by Neil Gaiman and other writers:

"Religion, a mediaeval form of unreason, when combined with modern weaponry becomes a real threat to our freedoms. This religious totalitarianism has caused a deadly mutation in the heart of Islam and we see the tragic consequences in Paris today. I stand with Charlie Hebdo, as we all must, to defend the art of satire, which has always been a force for liberty and against tyranny, dishonesty and stupidity. 'Respect for religion' has become a code phrase meaning 'fear of religion.' Religions, like all other ideas, deserve criticism, satire, and, yes, our fearless disrespect."  –Salman Rushdie

I could not agree more. I guess for several people here, that's racism and bigotry but go fuck yourself.

It is silly in several respects.

First, there is nothing particularly "medieval" about religion - something that has existed since, as far as we know, the dawn of humanity.

Second, the notion that these terrorists represent the "heart of Islam" is simply untrue.

Third, while I support the right to satirize anything without fear of violence, I am unclear as to why all ideas "deserve disrespect".

He didn't say religion was medieval, he said religion was a medieval form of unreason. Nouns and Adjectives are different things.

He also didn't say they represented the heart of islam, he said religious totalitarianism was a deadly mutation in the heart of islam.

Reading comprehension much?

[Liep]

Why is it that all religions "deserve" disrespect?

Because they demand respect.

Yup.

What should we do about gay people demanding respect?

I have never met a gay person demanding respect from me, so I wouldn't know.

[Martinus]

Many posters support terrorism. Film at 11.

Fortunately, most of those who do I don't care for or their opinions. The only one really that troubles me is Malthus, since he is the only one I respect.

[mongers]

Why is it that all religions "deserve" disrespect?

Because they demand respect.

Yup.

What should we do about gay people demanding respect?

I don't think 'they' have ever demanded respect, rather an end to persecution and equality before the law. Its then up to the rest of use to like, embrace or otherwise the cultural aspects of LGBT life.

It's pretty clear to me that respect is not given, but earned; so you just can't put your ideology or religion into the public space and demand it be respected, without a positive contribution on it's or your part.

[The Minsky Moment]

You really do need to read it in Greek to get the puns, like the one about being born again vs being born from above, which is only a joke in Greek, not Aramaic.

Which amusingly means the joke is on Jesus, who certainly spoke Aramaic, but likely little if any Greek.

[Martinus]

Why is it that all religions "deserve" disrespect?

Because they demand respect.

Yup.

What should we do about gay people demanding respect?

I don't think 'they' have ever demanded respect, rather an end to persecution and equality before the law. Its then up to the rest of use to like, embrace or otherwise the cultural aspects of LGBT life.

It's pretty clear to me that respect is not given, but earned; so you just can't put your ideology or religion into the public space and demand it be respected, without a positive contribution on it's or your part.

Very well said.

[Crazy_Ivan80]

at least this whole thing shows that the political-correctness-disease is still festering. Shouldn't wait too long anymore  with administering the medicine though.