Canadian Language Education Questions

[Grey Fox]

3.)  If you are French/English Canadian how much English/French did you study?

sufficient knowledge of English as a second language is required for many university faculties.

Why is that?  Are courses taught in English at the Universities?

No, well English classes. It's a requirement of the modern world especially technical fields where textbooks are not available in French, especially with the American technical world(ie our dual imperial/metric system)

[The Brain]

We had some courses given in English at uni. Instead of simply embracing the world as it is I sulked in my tent and ranted about independence.

[viper37]

Why is that?  Are courses taught in English at the Universities?

Some faculties do offer that, yes.  In my faculty, anybook beyond the 1st year was in english.  First year was about half&half.  Some classes have french books but english supplemental texts.
Accountants would have more material in French than their finance or economics comrades.  No mandatory classes are offered in english, but optional classes can be taught in english instead of french, and some supplemental courses are only in english.

Futur doctors have most of their material in french, IIRC.  Social sciences is nearly exclusively in french too, and I don't think they have a requirement for knowledge of english.
Law faculty (here, it's simply a bachelor degree, no need to study anthropology for 3 years before applying for law classes) does require sufficient english knowledge, IIRC.

It really depends on the faculties and the various department inside the faculties.  Afaik, finance has always been mostly in english and I don't see it changing.  Teachers told us we had no business there if we didn't understand the language.  I tend to agree as there is not a lot of research made in french for these fields, unlike accounting or medecine.  Toronto is the financial center of the country, New York is not so far either.  If you study finance and want to work in a big company or work as a trader, chances are you'll be working in english, from Montreal or outside the province.  Not much use for finance guys in SMBs, unfortunately.

[Crazy_Ivan80]

Again, I agree that it was good that such was changed and they can't force everyone to speak French only. However I don't see why it is good for the "abused" to turn around and become the "abusers".  I can't think of why one country should have different regions where a different language must be spoken for certain public services.

no one is being abused. In flanders the government is in Dutch, in Wallonia it is in French, in Brussels it is (officially, but the reality is that much of francophones -nearly a century after the deal for Brussels was made - when the city was still neerlandophone in majority even- still don't bother with respecting the law) Dutch-French and the "Oost-Kantons" (the few communities that were received from Germany after WW1 and that succesfully resisted frenchification) it's German. That was the deal struck to solve the issue here and agreed upon by a vast majority of MPs, after the Flemish proposition to make the entire country bilingual was shot down by the francophones.

As for why you can't imagine it? That's a riddle you yourself will have to solve. But it may have to do with a) the US not having had significant conquered minorities (the Flemish being the exception is it's the only majority in the world that wants to dismantle the state it lives in) within its borders that posed a threat to national unity (like the francophones in Anglo-Canada: they were a subjected people) and b) a significant lack of neigbours that might provide help to said minorities in case of conflict.
The New World is in that facet very lucky that it exists out of few countries and/or that most countries were colonised by a small number of colonisers resulting in countries with much the same dominant languages.
Count yourself Lucky but the experience doesn't work for large parts of the world.

[viper37]

i started French in public school in grade 1 (90/91) did the policy change in Ontario?

Hmm, looking at it, it seems to be grade 4 to 8:

study FSL from Grades 4 to 8, and

http://www.edu.gov.on.ca/eng/amenagement/fls.html

So, yes it has changed.  During our exchanges in the 80s, our penpals where only starting to learn french in high school.
Well... Now that I remember, one of the group was in Vermont, duh
The other one was from south of Toronto, but IIRC, that was the same, they didn't start until high school.

[viper37]

But I don't think it is necessary - in that it will prove successful. You are only delaying the inevitable if the populace is not invested in seeing the language/culture thrive.

Wich populace?  Quebec, like many modern society is dependant in immigration.  Immigrants arrive and pick one culture.
If they wish to live in english, there are 9 provinces for that.  If they chose Quebec, they have to know that French is the language here.  Why should we pay for our own assimilations by teaching english to new arrivals?

People of Quebec are attached to their culture, though I would dispute some of what they call culture... but that's my personal taste.  Even though I don't like Xavier Dolan, nor his movies, I think a moderate help from the government is necessary to help him achieve notoriety.  Not many people are interested in seeing movies shot in French with unknown actors in the US, especially when they are made by gays for gays...  So a little help on the marketing side can't hurt.  I would disagree with most of our cultural policies in the specifics, but in the broader sense, I'd say government intervention is unfortunately necessary, due to the size of the market.

It's like protecting an endangered species.  Eventually, conservation measures help the animals re-attain a normal status, and you start the regular hunting again.

[viper37]

The past might inform the present but it doesn't have to dictate the future.

It doesn't.  But it gives a good indication on what will happen if you revert back to the same mistakes.

[viper37]

Again, I agree that it was good that such was changed and they can't force everyone to speak French only. However I don't see why it is good for the "abused" to turn around and become the "abusers".  I can't think of why one country should have different regions where a different language must be spoken for certain public services.

Let's say I hate gays.  I think they are bad horrible people.

Suddenly, comes some stupid politicians forcing me to employ gays, if they want to work for me.

Is that discrimination against myself, my company? Is that trempling my individual right to be forced to work side by side with a gay man I don't like because I think he's a bad, horrible person?

What if a bar decides they don't want a gay clientele because it's scares consumers away?  Are we discriminating against this bar?

I think it's a question of balance, wouldn't you agree?

[garbon]

Again, I agree that it was good that such was changed and they can't force everyone to speak French only. However I don't see why it is good for the "abused" to turn around and become the "abusers".  I can't think of why one country should have different regions where a different language must be spoken for certain public services.

Let's say I hate gays.  I think they are bad horrible people.

Suddenly, comes some stupid politicians forcing me to employ gays, if they want to work for me.

Is that discrimination against myself, my company? Is that trempling my individual right to be forced to work side by side with a gay man I don't like because I think he's a bad, horrible person?

What if a bar decides they don't want a gay clientele because it's scares consumers away?  Are we discriminating against this bar?

I think it's a question of balance, wouldn't you agree?

I think making that analogy only serves to condemn you.

[Crazy_Ivan80]

Again, I agree that it was good that such was changed and they can't force everyone to speak French only. However I don't see why it is good for the "abused" to turn around and become the "abusers".  I can't think of why one country should have different regions where a different language must be spoken for certain public services.

Let's say I hate gays.  I think they are bad horrible people.

Suddenly, comes some stupid politicians forcing me to employ gays, if they want to work for me.

Is that discrimination against myself, my company? Is that trempling my individual right to be forced to work side by side with a gay man I don't like because I think he's a bad, horrible person?

What if a bar decides they don't want a gay clientele because it's scares consumers away?  Are we discriminating against this bar?

I think it's a question of balance, wouldn't you agree?

rather bizarre analogy since one can learn a language but not pick his sexuality

[The Brain]

I don't think gays are bad horrible people.

[Razgovory]

Let's say I hate gays.  I think they are bad horrible people.

Suddenly, comes some stupid politicians forcing me to employ gays, if they want to work for me.

Is that discrimination against myself, my company? Is that trempling my individual right to be forced to work side by side with a gay man I don't like because I think he's a bad, horrible person?

What if a bar decides they don't want a gay clientele because it's scares consumers away?  Are we discriminating against this bar?

I think it's a question of balance, wouldn't you agree?

In the US it depends on the state (sadly), but generally speaking you can't discriminate against people in hiring or service.

[Eddie Teach]

I don't think gays are bad horrible people.

You think they're good at being horrible?

[The Brain]

I don't think gays are bad horrible people.

You think they're good at being horrible?

Meh. They're OK.

[garbon]

I don't think gays are bad horrible people.

You think they're good at being horrible?

Meh. They're OK.

We think you stink.