The Shooting Gallery: Police Violence MEGATHREAD

[Zoupa]

Critical thinking is what makes the cop's version of events in the Michael Brown case (as in many others), not believable.

What does critical thinking say about the DOJ report?

Not much. It followed the letter of the law. I'm not laying blame on them.

[DGuller]

I can see how critical thinking would lead you to not take the words of a cop involved in a shooting at face value.  I think we have enough evidence to say that their testimony will never ever be anything other than self-serving, and same goes for every other cop on the scene. 

Where it seems like we depart from critical thinking is assuming that everything not trustworthy is automatically a lie.  Even Trump sometimes says things that are true, not everything that is the opposite of what he says is the case. 

There is nothing inconceivable about the cop's testimony, and DOJ report seemed to not only fail to find evidence against the cop, but actually found evidence to support the cop's story.  Sometimes it does happen that cops don't make the story up, because they don't actually have to.  Some of the 1000 people they shoot every year actually did present a threat that merited a deadly response, which is something that I think is too easily forgotten in all these "1 in a 1000 risk of death" kinds of arguments.

[Sheilbh]

This evening

[HVC]

Where's cobra commander?

[grumbler]

If you think "it's unfortunate that black people are being killed, but the looting has to stop", try turning it the other way around. It's unfortunate that there is looting, but the killing of black people has to stop.

How about inverting it?  The murder and the looting have to stop.  No "but" involved.

[jimmy olsen]

Eye popping numbers on that second question. Never would have imagined so many yes votes. The nation is radicalizing in real time.

https://twitter.com/PpollingNumbers/status/1267941135521067011

"Do you think the anger that led to these protests are justified?"
Justified 78%
Not Justified 18%

"Given the events around George Floyd, including the burning on a police precinct is..."
Justified 54%
Not Justified 38%

National @MonmouthPoll

[DGuller]

Protesters get soldiers to take a knee: https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1267945648705298433.

[fromtia]

Lawmakers Begin Bipartisan Push to Cut Off Police Access to Military-Style Gear
The effort to end a program transferring surplus military equipment from the Pentagon to the police reflects a revived bipartisan concern about excessive use of force by law enforcement.

Catie Edmondson
By Catie Edmondson
Published June 1, 2020
Updated June 2, 2020, 11:25 a.m. ET


WASHINGTON — Republicans and Democrats in Congress have begun a new push to shut down a Pentagon program that transfers military weaponry to local law enforcement departments, as bipartisan urgency builds to address the excessive use of force and the killings of unarmed black Americans by the police.

With protests turning violent across the country, lawmakers are scrutinizing the Defense Department initiative — curtailed by former President Barack Obama but revived by President Trump — that furnishes police departments with equipment such as bayonets and grenade launchers. The move comes after several nights when officers wearing riot gear have been documented using pepper spray and rubber bullets on protesters, bystanders and journalists, often without warning or seemingly unprovoked.

The push stands in stark contrast to the reaction of Mr. Trump, who has often encouraged rough tactics by law enforcement and spent Monday complaining privately to governors that they were not handling protesters aggressively enough.

"Mayors and governors must establish an overwhelming presence until the violence is quelled," Mr. Trump said in remarks from the Rose Garden on Monday evening. "If a city or state refuses to take the actions necessary to defend the life and property of their residents, then I will deploy the United States military and quickly solve the problem for them."


On Capitol Hill, however, where Republicans often take their cues from the president, most lawmakers had a different message as they focused on the immediate catalyst for the protests: George Floyd, a black man in Minneapolis who was killed after a police officer knelt on his neck for a prolonged period.

"In no world whatsoever should arresting a man for an alleged minor infraction involve a police officer putting his knee on the man's neck for nine minutes while he cries out 'I can't breathe' and then goes silent," Senator Mitch McConnell, Republican of Kentucky and the majority leader, said on Monday. "Our nation cannot deafen itself to the anger, the pain and the frustration of black Americans. Our nation needs to hear this."


Top lawmakers in both parties and on both sides of the Capitol moved quickly last week to announce their intention to hold hearings on the use of excessive force by law enforcement and racial violence.

Senator Brian Schatz, Democrat of Hawaii, who has long pressed to limit the transfer of military-grade equipment to police departments, announced that he would move to include an amendment in the must-pass annual defense policy bill to shut down the program entirely.

"It is clear that many police departments are being outfitted as if they are going to war, and it is not working in terms of maintaining the peace," Mr. Schatz said in an interview. "This is not the only thing we need to do, but as our country sees these images on television that remind us of some countries far, far away, it's time to recalibrate this program. Just because the Department of Defense has excess weaponry doesn't mean it will be put to good use."

Doug Stafford, Senator Rand Paul's chief strategist, responded on Sunday night to Mr. Schatz's idea: "We've being doing this one for years. Happy to help," he wrote on Twitter. Mr. Paul has also been a longtime proponent of the demilitarization of local police and has previously teamed with Mr. Schatz to reform the Pentagon program, known as 1033.

It is unclear how much support Mr. Schatz's measure could receive in the Republican-controlled Senate. But in the House, Representative Ruben Gallego, Democrat of Arizona and a former Marine, said on Monday that he would introduce similar legislation, opening up the possibility that the measure could find additional traction in making its way into the final defense bill.

"As a combat veteran and proud Marine, very little of my equipment or training was relevant to policing Phoenix or other American communities," Mr. Gallego said. "Our neighborhoods aren't war zones."

The program was created in the 1990s in an effort to offload surplus military equipment and aid police departments during the war on drugs. It expanded in the wake of the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks but came under heavy scrutiny in the aftermath of a string of high-profile deaths of black men at the hands of the police, including the shooting of Michael Brown, an unarmed 18-year-old, by a white police officer in Ferguson, Mo., in 2014.

In response to stark images of heavily armed police confronting unarmed protesters in armored vehicles in Ferguson, Mr. Obama placed limits on that program in 2015, restricting the transfer of weapons, including battering rams and explosives, from the Pentagon to local police. The Pentagon reported in 2017 that 126 tracked armored vehicles, 138 grenade launchers and 1,623 bayonets had been returned since Mr. Obama prohibited their transfer.

But Mr. Trump rescinded those restrictions in 2017, opening the flow of equipment to police departments. He argued the gear was necessary for officers to protect themselves and their communities.

On his call with governors on Monday, the president appeared to applaud the National Guard's handling of the riots in Minneapolis, pointedly remarking on their use of tear gas.

"They just walked right down the street, knocking them out with tear gas, tear gas," Mr. Trump said. "These guys, they were running."

Secretary of Defense Mark T. Esper used military language on the same call with governors, telling them, "we need to dominate the battle space," and that they would have his full support.

Senator Cory Booker, Democrat of New Jersey, on Monday laid out a framework for a series of reforms he said he hoped the Senate would take up. It included creating a national police misconduct registry, incentivizing states to adopt policies banning the use of chokeholds and reforming a legal doctrine known as qualified immunity that shields police officers from being held legally liable for damages sought by citizens whose constitutional rights were violated.

"Cities are literally on fire with the pain and anguish wrought by the violence visited upon black and brown bodies," Mr. Booker said. "There's no one singular policy change that will fix this issue tomorrow. We need an entire set of holistic reforms to improve police training and practices, and ensure greater accountability and transparency."

Representative Justin Amash, Independent of Michigan, said he would introduce a similar measure to strike down qualified immunity.

A pattern of "egregious police misconduct" has continued, Mr. Amash said in a letter to colleagues, "because police are legally, politically and culturally insulated from consequences for violating the rights of the people whom they have sworn to serve. This must change so that these incidents of brutality stop happening."

I bolded the Mitch McConell quote, because it's interesting to me that he seems to be able to acknowledge what's happening and isn't making looting the narrative. NY Times.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/01/us/politics/police-military-gear.html

[fromtia]

Protesters get soldiers to take a knee: https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1267945648705298433.

Are these guys National Guard? Whoever they are, good job them.

[Razgovory]

Critical thinking is what makes the cop's version of events in the Michael Brown case (as in many others), not believable.

No, that's magical thinking.  We can only deal with the information we have, not the information we wish we had.

[DGuller]

I bolded the Mitch McConell quote, because it's interesting to me that he seems to be able to acknowledge what's happening and isn't making looting the narrative. NY Times.

In the long run it would be much more helpful if Mitch didn't know when to fold them.  Sure, he knows this hand is hopeless, and some concessions will be made, so they may as well be made gracefully to make it go away quicker.  Once this passes, though, he'll be back at work putting the firewall against police accountability on the benches.

[fromtia]

In the long run it would be much more helpful if Mitch didn't know when to fold them.  Sure, he knows this hand is hopeless, and some concessions will be made, so they may as well be made gracefully.  Once this passes, though, he'll be back at work putting the firewall against police accountability on the benches.

I'm sure you are correct, I don't imagine for a moment Moscow Mitch has had a Road to Damascus moment.

Heres Dubya:

It remains a shocking failure that many African Americans, especially young African American men, are harassed and threatened in their own country. It is a strength when protesters, protected by responsible law enforcement, march for a better future. This tragedy — in a long series of similar tragedies — raises a long overdue question: How do we end systemic racism in our society?

https://www.bushcenter.org/

I know hes practically a libtard by todays savage standards of conservatism, but I still find it encouraging that he's not talking about looting.

[FunkMonk]

Defense Secretary Mark Esper says he had no advance notice before President Donald Trump led him and other senior administration officials to St. John's Episcopal Church for a widely criticized photo-op.

"I thought I was going to do two things: to see some damage and to talk to the troops," Esper said in an exclusive interview with NBC News on Tuesday night.

Esper said he believed they were going to observe the vandalized bathroom in Lafayette Park.

"I didn't know where I was going," Esper said. "I wanted to see how much damage actually happened."

SecDef in CYA 

[DGuller]

I think you get put on sex offender registry for that.

[merithyn]

No curfew in Portland tonight. The mayor admitted that it was ineffective and caused more harm than good.