Ian Thorpe comes out of the closet.

[DGuller]

To be honest, I would think that people who espouse that theory don't spend a lot of time thinking about conditions outside of the West.

Conditions inside the West weren't that different from the conditions outside of the West until recently.  What is wrong with the simplest and most obvious explanation:  some people evolve slower than other people?

[Admiral Yi]

It's convenient in that it turns the tables on the bashers.  If you are a homophobe, it's because ha, ha, you're gay yourself.  And it's stupid because it implies that the vast majority of males in the vast majority of countries all turn out to be fags in denial.

As opposed to the other irrational fears out there, which of course tend to paint such a positive picture of their subjects.

[grumbler]

  How is it convenient, and how is it stupid?  Your post makes no sense whatsoever.

It's convenient in that it turns the tables on the bashers.  If you are a homophobe, it's because ha, ha, you're gay yourself.  And it's stupid because it implies that the vast majority of males in the vast majority of countries all turn out to be fags in denial.

How about if Yi modifies his argument to say that he heard that the root of homophobia is the fear that you are a gay in denial?  Then you don't have to be a fag to be the root of homophobia, you just have to be afraid that you might be.

[derspiess]

  How is it convenient, and how is it stupid?  Your post makes no sense whatsoever.

It's convenient in that it turns the tables on the bashers.  If you are a homophobe, it's because ha, ha, you're gay yourself.  And it's stupid because it implies that the vast majority of males in the vast majority of countries all turn out to be fags in denial. 

Jeez, for once I'm puzzled by Yi and in agreement with DG (Sorry DG).

[DGuller]

  How is it convenient, and how is it stupid?  Your post makes no sense whatsoever.

It's convenient in that it turns the tables on the bashers.  If you are a homophobe, it's because ha, ha, you're gay yourself.  And it's stupid because it implies that the vast majority of males in the vast majority of countries all turn out to be fags in denial.

How about if Yi modifies his argument to say that he heard that the root of homophobia is the fear that you are a gay in denial?  Then you don't have to be a fag to be the root of homophobia, you just have to be afraid that you might be.

That's less patently stupid, but I still think is far too needlessly elaborate. 

I come from a culture that has been, and still is, virulently homophobic.  The explanation for Russian homophobia is very simple:  every Russian grows up with the idea that homophobia is a deviant behavior that is to be openly mocked, derided, and disdained.  There isn't any deeper fear behind it, kindergartners used "pidaras" as the worst kind of insult long before they know what being a pidaras means, and for that matter what not being a pidaras means.  Parents, without any sense of shame, teach their children what a bad thing homosexuality is.  During Soviet times, homosexual acts were even a crime punishable by long prison sentences.

I don't see why the explanation for the homophobia in the West has to be much more elaborate.  Even the liberal Western culture does not tolerate all deviations from the typical behavior, and until recently it wasn't that much more advanced than Russia when it came to enlightened attitude towards homosexuality.  I can understand that if the West had tolerated homosexuality flawlessly for centuries, then those that are still homophobic must be a special breed, but we're not there yet.

[Admiral Yi]

The source of your confusion is we are using different meanings of homophobia.  You're using it to mean "dislike of gays," whereas I'm using it in the original meaning of an irrational fear, in response to Syt, who was also talking about irrational fear.

[DGuller]

The source of your confusion is we are using different meanings of homophobia.  You're using it to mean "dislike of gays," whereas I'm using it in the original meaning of an irrational fear, in response to Syt, who was also talking about irrational fear.

You weren't responding to Syt, you were concurring with Syt as he responded to Mono.

[crazy canuck]

The source of your confusion is we are using different meanings of homophobia.  You're using it to mean "dislike of gays," whereas I'm using it in the original meaning of an irrational fear, in response to Syt, who was also talking about irrational fear.

I think it is more than that.  I think he just equated Russian culture with North American culture.

[Admiral Yi]

You weren't responding to Syt, you were concurring with Syt as he responded to Mono.

[Razgovory]

I suspect that a great deal of Homophobia isn't a fear of being gay or fear of enjoying it, but a need to assert masculinity and through that establish a social hierarchy.

[Sheilbh]

I think there's something to everyone's theory.

I wouldn't totally dismiss Yi though, many gay people I know have the story of the most rampantly, aggressively homophobic kid at school later coming out. In my case we always got on anyway due to other shared interests, but he was pretty awful. Until, aged 20, he upped sticks and moved to Brighton with a local 35 year old roofer. I like to assume they're both still very happy together.

[derspiess]

I can't think of any rampantly homophobic people from high school.  Just a couple guys everyone knew was gay but they apparently didn't know it themselves until way later.

[Eddie Teach]

Is that a selling point?

Why wouldn't it be?

Different broad aesthetic values over the general population of gay men vs straight women.

Kinda like how the biggest player on the L Word looked like this: