The Islamic State in Iraq and the Levant Megathread

[Norgy]

If Jesus was the son of god, he'd have had bullet points and a PowerPoint.
It's like he almost wanted to be misinterpreted.

We are all children of God Norgy  

He was illiterate so communicated like illiterate people do. Hey it worked in the sense that people remembered what he said well enough to write it down later on.

He should be happy they didn't share his browser history. 
"Healing lepers".
"Recipes for fish and bread to feed many".
"How to hit it off with whores".
"How to wash feet".

Of course, Mohammed's was far worse in any case.
"Hymen - fact or fiction"

[Tamas]

If Jesus was the son of god, he'd have had bullet points and a PowerPoint.
It's like he almost wanted to be misinterpreted.

We are all children of God Norgy  

He was illiterate so communicated like illiterate people do. Hey it worked in the sense that people remembered what he said well enough to write it down later on.

The illiterate people I have met did NOT speak in metaphors or complicated shit in need of centuries of deciphering.

[viper37]

If Jesus was the son of god, he'd have had bullet points and a PowerPoint.
It's like he almost wanted to be misinterpreted.

We are all children of God Norgy  

He was illiterate so communicated like illiterate people do. Hey it worked in the sense that people remembered what he said well enough to write it down later on.

No, he was literate.  But just like Donald Trump and Fox News, he used a language simple enough for his followers to understand, yet complex enough to deny he ever said what they believed he said.

[Norgy]

If Jesus was the son of god, he'd have had bullet points and a PowerPoint.
It's like he almost wanted to be misinterpreted.

We are all children of God Norgy  

He was illiterate so communicated like illiterate people do. Hey it worked in the sense that people remembered what he said well enough to write it down later on.

The illiterate people I have met did NOT speak in metaphors or complicated shit in need of centuries of deciphering.

Ah, you see, maybe they did. "Please help me with some money, sir" actually means "Your money will never make you happy, and kindness lasts eternally".

Man, I really should be a minister. I could make beellions.

[jimmy olsen]

Airstrikes killed 250 ISIS fighters in Fallujah

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2016/06/29/airstrikes_reportedly_kill_250_isis_fighters_in_iraq_as_coalition_forces.html

[jimmy olsen]

20 foreigners killed in cafe siege in Bangladesh. 

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-36692613

[Duque de Bragança]

I liked it when the Bengali prime minister said the attackers had no religion. Atheist or agnostic terrorists? 

[11B4V]

I liked it when the Bengali prime minister said the attackers had no religion. Atheist or agnostic terrorists? 

They did it in the name of logic and reason.

[Valmy]

I liked it when the Bengali prime minister said the attackers had no religion. Atheist or agnostic terrorists? 

The Red Scare is back!

Edit: My God Viper and Norgy posted stupid shit. So glad I didn't see it at the time.

[CountDeMoney]

Yeah, that's kinda what I was saying when I agreed with B4 about just going in and killing the guy from the start, rather than negotiating.

I'm pretty sure we can put that whole "negotiations" bullshit to sleep once and for all.

According to local press reports, the gunmen divided people by nationality and asked people to recite verses of the Koran, sparing those who could.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/asia_pacific/in-bangladesh-an-attack-aimed-at-foreigners-and-the-countrys-elite/2016/07/02/a5a87a34-4062-11e6-80bc-d06711fd2125_story.html?hpid=hp_rhp-top-table-main_bangladesh-750pm%3Ahomepage%2Fstory

After phalanxes of security personnel surrounded the building, the shooting subsided and negotiations got underway. It was then that the horrors really began for the hostages. At one table sat eight Japanese consultants with the aid organization JICA; others were occupied by Italian garment entrepreneurs or young friends who had studied at the local American school. Locals were also there, enjoying the start of the Muslim holiday of Eid al-Fitr.

A military spokesman, Brig. Gen. Nayeem Ashfaque Chowdhury, told reporters that "most of the victims were killed brutally with sharp weapons." In video footage shot from a nearby building, a young man can be seen patrolling the restaurant's interior, carrying what appears to be a foot-long blade. According to local media, those who couldn't recite the Koran had their throats cut. The Islamic State shared on Twitter photos purporting to show victims lying in pools of blood.

[Berkut]

Yeah, I am convinced.

And I mean that seriously.

If you think the people you are dealing with are in any way "Islamic terrorists", the SOP should pretty just be maximum aggressiveness applied immediately, with whatever resources are at hand.

Thinking back on other historic terrorist actions of this kind, Beslan, etc., etc., I can think of very few were just going after them immediately would not have ended up saving more lives in the long run.

[The Brain]

Yeah. And I understand that it's harder for the police to have to act quickly, and that it will mean more police casualties. It's much nicer to have hours to gather intelligence and plan, but that's not the reality we live in anymore.

[Berkut]

I actually think that the police are mostly motivated in these situations by:

1. The desire to save lives, and
2. Not be responsible for civilian deaths themselves.

IE, I think the desire to plan and negotiate is about not wanting to be seen as being responsible for getting hostages killed by being hasty. This likely results, unfortunately, in more people dying, but it is (from the police perspective) more of a sin of omission rather than commission.

It is simply emotionally easier to default to a stance of "wait and see". There will always be a million reasons why we should not act right now...we will get more men in just a few minutes, give it a couple more for the camera to get placed, we can have the SWAT sniper team in place if we just hang on for another 15 minutes, etc., etc.

[Malicious Intent]

(...)
If you think the people you are dealing with are in any way "Islamic terrorists", the SOP should pretty just be maximum aggressiveness applied immediately, with whatever resources are at hand.
(...)

Also: No prisoners. It's simply too risky, considering the proliferation of suicide vests among islamist terrorists. You see one go down, you put several more rounds into his skull.

Saw some footage of the Istanbul airport attack. A security guard hit one attacker, who went down and lost his weapon, but was still moving. He went closer to secure him, then saw the suicide vest and ran, just a moment before the terrorist blew up. Scary shit.

[dps]

I actually think that the police are mostly motivated in these situations by:

1. The desire to save lives, and
2. Not be responsible for civilian deaths themselves.

IE, I think the desire to plan and negotiate is about not wanting to be seen as being responsible for getting hostages killed by being hasty. This likely results, unfortunately, in more people dying, but it is (from the police perspective) more of a sin of omission rather than commission.

It is simply emotionally easier to default to a stance of "wait and see". There will always be a million reasons why we should not act right now...we will get more men in just a few minutes, give it a couple more for the camera to get placed, we can have the SWAT sniper team in place if we just hang on for another 15 minutes, etc., etc.

Sounds like in this particular situation, the police thought that since the gunfire had stopped, the killing had stopped, making it seem like taking their time was a good move.  Beyond the fact that you don't have to shoot someone to kill them, that's also a fallacy in that people who might have been shot but not killed outright might not be able to wait for medical attention.

If we are going to say that the police should be more aggressive in these situations, though, there needs to be an understanding that there will be mistakes made, and some hostages will be accidentally killed by the police at times.