News from Iran? Good? Bad? Who knows?

[Jaron]

I would like to congratulate Ahmadeinejad and Khamenei for martyring Ali Moussavi, a descendant of the Prophet named Ali, on Ashura, the day when Shi'ia remember the martyrdom of Ali, a successor of Muhammed, who famously died fighting tyrants.  That is kind of like a Russian Pogrom specifically targeting peacenik Jewish carpenters with long hair.

Congratulations.

[Admiral Yi]

I would like to congratulate Ahmadeinejad and Khamenei for martyring Ali Moussavi, a descendant of the Prophet named Ali, on Ashura, the day when Shi'ia remember the martyrdom of Ali, a successor of Muhammed, who famously died fighting tyrants.  That is kind of like a Russian Pogrom specifically targeting peacenik Jewish carpenters with long hair.

Isn't Moussavi Aizeri?  How can you be Aizeri and a descendent of Ali (pbem)?

[Camerus]

zomg, another Islamic martyr!!oneone   

[CountDeMoney]

That is kind of like a Russian Pogrom specifically targeting peacenik Jewish carpenters with long hair.

[Razgovory]

I would like to congratulate Ahmadeinejad and Khamenei for martyring Ali Moussavi, a descendant of the Prophet named Ali, on Ashura, the day when Shi'ia remember the martyrdom of Ali, a successor of Muhammed, who famously died fighting tyrants.  That is kind of like a Russian Pogrom specifically targeting peacenik Jewish carpenters with long hair.

Isn't Moussavi Aizeri?  How can you be Aizeri and a descendent of Ali (pbem)?

I think John Kerry was decended from Muhammad so it's possible I guess.

[CountDeMoney]

He could be a descendant of Muhammed Ali, still doesn't change anything in Iran, no matter what you ZOMG THEY KIN CHANGE FROM WIFFIN tards think.

[Sheilbh]

Isn't Moussavi Aizeri?  How can you be Aizeri and a descendent of Ali (pbem)?

The Sayyids - descendants of Mohammed through - didn't just stay in the Arab world for the past 1500 years.

[Queequeg]

Yup.  John Kerry is a Sayyed, IIRC through the Safavid line somehow.  That also makes him a claimant to the Roman throne, through the Komneni connection through Ak (or Kara, forgot) Koyunlu. 

[Crazy_Ivan80]

go back far enough and everyone can claim to be the descendant of this or that ruler or famous guy.
it means nothing in other words.

[KRonn]

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,581264,00.html

Report: At Least 15 Killed in Tehran Clashes



At least 15 people were killed during massive anti-government protests in Tehran when opposition supporters clashed with security forces in the streets, Iranian state television reported Monday.

The report said 10 people killed during Sunday's fierce clashes in the Iranian capital were members of "anti-revolutionary terrorist" groups, apparently referring to opposition supporters.

The other five who died were killed by "terrorist groups" in a "suspicious act," the report said, without elaborating.

Iranian security forces stormed a series of opposition offices on Monday, rounding up at least seven prominent anti-government activists in a new crackdown against the country's reformist movement, opposition Web sites and activists reported.

The bloodshed, some of the heaviest in months, drew an especially harsh condemnation from one opposition leader, who compared the government to the brutal regime that was ousted by the Islamic Revolution three decades ago.

Monday's developments were sure to deepen antagonism between the government and the reform movement, which has repeatedly shown resilience in the face of repeated crackdowns since June's disputed presidential election.

Mahdi Karroubi, an opposition leader who ran in the June election, posted a statement on an opposition Web site asking how the government could spill the blood of its people on the Shiite sacred day of Ashoura. He said even the former government of the hated shah respected the holy day.

"What has really happened that (caused the ruling system) spilled the blood of people on the day of Ashoura and gets a group of savage individuals confronting people?" he told the Rah-e-Sabz Web site. The shah, who was overthrown in 1979, was widely hated, and comparing a rival to the shah is a serious, though common, insult in Iranian politics.

Opposition Web sites reported at least seven arrests Monday. The Parlemannews site said three top aides to opposition leader Mir Moussavi were arrested, including his top adviser, Ali Riza Beheshti.

Security forces also stormed a foundation run by reformist former President Mohammad Khatami and arrested two people, a foundation official said, speaking on condition of anonymity because of fears of police reprisal. The Baran Foundation works to promote dialogue between civilizations.

In another move, former Foreign Minister Ebrahim Yazdi and human rights activist Emad Baghi were arrested, according to the Rah-e-Sabz Web site. Yazdi, who served as foreign minister after the 1979 Islamic revolution, is now leader of the banned but tolerated Freedom Movement of Iran.

The arrests could not be independently confirmed.

Sunday's violence erupted when security forces fired on stone-throwing protesters in the center of Tehran. Opposition Web sites and witnesses said five people were killed, but Iran's state-run Press TV, quoting the Supreme National Security Council, said the death toll was eight. It gave no further details.

The dead included a nephew of Mousavi, according to Mousavi's Web site, Kaleme.ir. Police denied using firearms.

Some accounts of the violence Sunday in Tehran were vivid and detailed, but they could not be independently confirmed because of government restrictions on media coverage. Police said dozens of officers were injured and more than 300 protesters were arrested.

The street chaos coincided with commemorations of Ashoura, fueling protesters' defiance with its message of sacrifice and dignity in the face of coercion. The observance commemorates the 7th-century death in battle of one of Shiite Islam's most beloved saints.

Still, many demonstrators had not anticipated such harsh tactics by the authorities, despite police warnings of tougher action against any protests on the sacred day.

The clashes marked the bloodiest confrontation since the height of unrest in the weeks after June's election. The opposition says Ahmadinejad won the election through massive vote fraud and that Mousavi was the true winner.

The Dec. 20 death of the 87-year-old Grand Ayatollah Hossein Ali Montazeri, a sharp critic of Iran's leaders, has given a new push to opposition protests. Opposition leaders have used holidays and other symbolic days in recent months to stage anti-government rallies.

Iran is under pressure both from its domestic opposition within the country and from the United States and its European allies, which are pushing Iran to suspend key parts of its nuclear program.

U.S. National Security Council spokesman Mike Hammer, speaking in Hawaii Sunday, where U.S. President Barack Obama is vacationing, denounced Tehran's "unjust suppression of civilians."

Foreign Minister Carl Bildt of Sweden, which holds the rotating presidency of the European Union, expressed concern about the "increased repression" in Iran.

The Associated Press contributed to this report.
[\quote]

[Neil]

I would like to congratulate Ahmadeinejad and Khamenei for martyring Ali Moussavi, a descendant of the Prophet named Ali, on Ashura, the day when Shi'ia remember the martyrdom of Ali, a successor of Muhammed, who famously died fighting tyrants.  That is kind of like a Russian Pogrom specifically targeting peacenik Jewish carpenters with long hair.

I don't think they care.

[Grallon]

I don't think they care.

It's interesting to think this isn't the first time in recent years that a contested regime would attack its own citizens to quell dissent, only to have them turn en masse against the rulers and overthrow them (think Caeucescu).  One would think they'd learn... yet they never seem to!

The legitimacy of the iranian regime was shaken after the election in june - this repression will simply erode what's left of it and it's a matter of time before it falls.  Hmmm but will it be before or after Iran gets the bomb?




G.

[Neil]

It's interesting to think this isn't the first time in recent years that a contested regime would attack its own citizens to quell dissent, only to have them turn en masse against the rulers and overthrow them (think Caeucescu).  One would think they'd learn... yet they never seem to!

The legitimacy of the iranian regime was shaken after the election in june - this repression will simply erode what's left of it and it's a matter of time before it's fall.  Hmmm but will it be before or after Iran gets the bomb?

Iran is more like China.  People might complain, but the government is willing to slaughter them all, and nothing will change, no matter how much Spellus-types wish it would.

[KRonn]

These protests now are long going, get very large crowds, and do spell problems for that terrorist regime in Tehran. It has to mean trouble for the leaders, big trouble. No idea if it can cause real change. I tend to think the govt thug-ocracy has the power, the will, the willing thug groups, and the means to keep quelling dissent, but it all appears to have gotten much worse for the powers that be.

[Razgovory]

Even if the Iranian government did fall it's replacement wouldn't necessarily be friendly to the West.  A state's self interests are dictated by it's geography so one state replacing another on the same territory will tend to gravitate towards the same self-interests as it's predecessor.