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Ukraine's European Revolution?

Started by Sheilbh, December 03, 2013, 07:39:37 AM

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Jacob

I like your informative posts, Siege :)

Grinning_Colossus

That the blue part is labelled 'Autonomous Republic of Crimea' would seem to suggest satirical intent.  :hmm:
Quis futuit ipsos fututores?

jimmy olsen

Quote from: Queequeg on March 05, 2014, 03:42:43 PM
Also it's funny that so many parts of ex-Yugoslavia are named after a type of ruler.  Hercegovina comes from the German for Duke, Herceg, and Voivodina comes from Voivode, an old Slavic term for warlord.  It probably means something like 'march'.
Also a term for a Tzimisce prince in the Old World of Darkness. :nerd:
It is far better for the truth to tear my flesh to pieces, then for my soul to wander through darkness in eternal damnation.

Jet: So what kind of woman is she? What's Julia like?
Faye: Ordinary. The kind of beautiful, dangerous ordinary that you just can't leave alone.
Jet: I see.
Faye: Like an angel from the underworld. Or a devil from Paradise.
--------------------------------------------
1 Karma Chameleon point

derspiess

I believe it was posted by pro-Russian types, though.
"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall

Syt

http://edition.cnn.com/2014/03/05/world/europe/russia-news-anchor-resigns/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

QuoteAnchor quits: I can't be part of network 'that whitewashes' Putin's actions

(CNN) -- Another member of state-funded Russia Today made waves on Wednesday -- not by standing behind Moscow, as the news network is wont to do, but by bucking it.

From the anchor chair, Liz Wahl closed a show -- as seen in video which she later tweeted -- talking about the "ethical and moral challenges" she faces working for Russia Today, also known as RT. She spoke of being from a family who fled to America to escape Soviet forces during the 1956 Hungarian revolution, being the daughter of a U.S. military veteran and being the partner of a physician who works at a U.S. military base.

"And that is why, personally, I cannot be part of a network funded by the Russian government that whitewashes the actions of Putin," Wahl said, referring to Russian President Vladimir Putin.

"I'm proud to be an American and believe in disseminating the truth," she added. "And that is why, after this newscast, I'm resigning."

Not that she would've necessarily lasted much longer, after her comments. In a statement, RT said, "When a journalist disagrees with the editorial position of his or her organization, the usual course of action is to address those grievances with the editor, and, if they cannot be resolved, to quit like a professional."

"But when someone makes a big public show of a personal decision, it is nothing more than a self-promotional stunt," said the network.

Russia Today anchor: 'Occupation' wrong Russian TV personality supports Putin Putin: Military force is 'last resort' Is there any truth to Putin's words?

Talking Wednesday night to CNN's Anderson Cooper, Wahl said the idea she did this "for personal gain ... couldn't be farther from the truth." She said she'd "hesitated to speak on this for a while for fear of repercussion," but decided to act now based on her belief "the propagandist nature of RT (had come) out in full force" over its coverage of the Ukraine crisis.

"RT is not about the truth; it's about promoting a Putinist agenda," Wahl told CNN. "And I can tell you firsthand, it's about bashing America."

Wahl, who characterizes herself as a Filipina-Hungarian-American and RT America correspondent on her Twitter feed, became the second personality from Russia Today to defiantly, publicly challenge the government that effectively signs their paychecks.

Her resignation announcement didn't explicitly mention the crisis in Ukraine, though she mentioned it later in her CNN interview. Backed by Western diplomats, officials in that Eastern European nation claim that Russian troops have violated their sovereignty by effectively invading the Crimean peninsula.

Putin, meanwhile, has denied sending any more of his country's troops into the country, or that any of the up to 25,000 troops who are stationed there have played any part in the standoff, according to the state-run RIA Novosti news agency.

But that situation is central to RT's coverage, which leans toward Moscow's point of view. On Wednesday, for instance, its website featured stories with headlines such as "Kiev snipers hired by Maidan leaders," "'Cold War stereotypes': Russia condemns NATO plan" and "Questions on Ukraine the West chooses not to answer."

Two days ago, another RT personality -- Abby Martin -- referred directly to "Russia's military occupation of Crimea" while seemingly going off this pro-Russia script at the end of her "Breaking the Set" program.

"I can't stress enough how strongly I am against any state intervention in a sovereign nation's affairs," said Martin, a California native who, like Wahl, is based in Washington. "What Russia did is wrong."

While Martin refused to "defend military aggression," she didn't leave RT.

In fact, she returned to the air the following night and wasn't even reprimanded, according to the network. As RT noted in a statement, Martin called it "kind of a sad commentary that" -- while she's regularly spoken out against military intervention -- "my only criticism of Russia's actions was picked up" by the media.

On Wednesday night, Wahl said she'd recently become upset over portions of one of her interviews being cut, what she called a "very dangerous" segment on neo-Nazi elements among the Ukrainian opposition and "very, very loaded" questions being planted by RT's management.

"I felt that I could no longer work here and go on television and tell the American people that this is what's happening and have it pose as news," Wahl said. "It's something that I don't feel comfortable with."

Both Wahl and Martin's remarks shined a spotlight on what exactly RT is -- in terms of its purpose and its viewpoint, especially for its U.S.-based, English-language programming.

The Russian foreign ministry's website points to the network as a top media source. And the Columbia Journalism Review says it is best "known as an extension of former President Vladimir Putin's confrontational foreign policy."

In its statement on Martin, the network said that "RT journalists and hosts are free to express their own opinions."

What makes Martin's comments different from those of Wahl, according to RT, is that the former "spoke in the context of her own talk show, to the viewers who have been tuning in for years to hear her opinions on current events, the opinions that most media did not care about until two days ago."

"For years, Ms. Martin, has been speaking out against U.S. military intervention only to be ignored by the mainstream news outlets," RT added. "But with that one comment, branded as an act of defiance, she became an overnight sensation."

The network then seemed to suggest that Wahl -- who cheered Martin as "my girl" after her commentary -- paid attention to all the hoopla.

"It is a tempting example to follow," RT said.

Wahl said many who do follow the lead of network management -- the senior members of which are in Moscow -- are young, "inexperienced" and "eager to please" their bosses.

"Eventually, you learn what management likes, what management dislikes," she said. "... They kind of make sure the narrative is delivered in one way or another."

I am, somehow, less interested in the weight and convolutions of Einstein's brain than in the near certainty that people of equal talent have lived and died in cotton fields and sweatshops.
—Stephen Jay Gould

Proud owner of 42 Zoupa Points.

Valmy

One bizarre response I saw on twitter was outrage no anchors quit when we invaded Iraq.  I guess I forgot that all the news stations were 100% behind the war and were whitewashing it.
Quote"This is a Russian warship. I propose you lay down arms and surrender to avoid bloodshed & unnecessary victims. Otherwise, you'll be bombed."

Zmiinyi defenders: "Russian warship, go fuck yourself."

Berkut

Quote from: Solmyr on March 05, 2014, 07:09:20 PM
President of Kazakhstan Nazarbayev was on TV expressing concerns about the invasion. I guess he's getting worried about his own country. :lol:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfkJskTttBg


Well yeah.

Russia is basically saying that have carte blanche to invade any country in the area that has a sizable Russian speaking population who *might*, in theory, someday, be oppressed in some manner which is soley defined by Russia.

How many of the former Soviet republics have sizable Russian speaking minorities? All of them?
"If you think this has a happy ending, then you haven't been paying attention."

select * from users where clue > 0
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Syt

Well, all news organizations are biased one way or the other, but in the West they're at least (mostly) free of government influence (or at least there's plenty independent outlets to choose from other than state media) and they can voice their opinion, and journalists can switch to networks that fit their views if there's a big disagreement.
I am, somehow, less interested in the weight and convolutions of Einstein's brain than in the near certainty that people of equal talent have lived and died in cotton fields and sweatshops.
—Stephen Jay Gould

Proud owner of 42 Zoupa Points.

Syt

Quote from: Berkut on March 05, 2014, 11:40:09 PM
How many of the former Soviet republics have sizable Russian speaking minorities? All of them?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_diaspora#Statistics

And an out of date map:

I am, somehow, less interested in the weight and convolutions of Einstein's brain than in the near certainty that people of equal talent have lived and died in cotton fields and sweatshops.
—Stephen Jay Gould

Proud owner of 42 Zoupa Points.

Syt



What I don't get about the Russiapologists is that often their main argument is that the West is just as bad if not worse. If that's their opinion - fair enough.

But that shouldn't mean that it automagically absolves everyone else of their responsibility to not be dicks.
I am, somehow, less interested in the weight and convolutions of Einstein's brain than in the near certainty that people of equal talent have lived and died in cotton fields and sweatshops.
—Stephen Jay Gould

Proud owner of 42 Zoupa Points.

jimmy olsen

#2560
Quote from: Berkut on March 05, 2014, 11:40:09 PM
Quote from: Solmyr on March 05, 2014, 07:09:20 PM
President of Kazakhstan Nazarbayev was on TV expressing concerns about the invasion. I guess he's getting worried about his own country. :lol:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfkJskTttBg

Well yeah.

Russia is basically saying that have carte blanche to invade any country in the area that has a sizable Russian speaking population who *might*, in theory, someday, be oppressed in some manner which is soley defined by Russia.

How many of the former Soviet republics have sizable Russian speaking minorities? All of them?
Khazakistan has the most after Ukraine and Belarus.
It is far better for the truth to tear my flesh to pieces, then for my soul to wander through darkness in eternal damnation.

Jet: So what kind of woman is she? What's Julia like?
Faye: Ordinary. The kind of beautiful, dangerous ordinary that you just can't leave alone.
Jet: I see.
Faye: Like an angel from the underworld. Or a devil from Paradise.
--------------------------------------------
1 Karma Chameleon point

sbr

Quote from: jimmy olsen on March 05, 2014, 11:52:34 PM
Quote from: Berkut on March 05, 2014, 11:40:09 PM
Quote from: Solmyr on March 05, 2014, 07:09:20 PM
President of Kazakhstan Nazarbayev was on TV expressing concerns about the invasion. I guess he's getting worried about his own country. :lol:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfkJskTttBg

Khazakistan has the most after Ukraine and Belarus.

Well yeah.

Russia is basically saying that have carte blanche to invade any country in the area that has a sizable Russian speaking population who *might*, in theory, someday, be oppressed in some manner which is soley defined by Russia.

How many of the former Soviet republics have sizable Russian speaking minorities? All of them?

Syt

I'm pretty sure this whole thing isn't going as Putin planned. The response from the West he probably banked on.

However, according to an official opinion poll of the Kremlin over 70% of Russians are against an involvement in Ukrainian affairs. Also, he probably didn't expect the markets to tank so badly.

So what are his options:
- stalling for time till the referendum at the end of the month is through, and possibly the Ukrainian elections in May, and then take it from there
- orchestrating an incident that rallies public support for intervention - it would have to be something big, though

- other?
I am, somehow, less interested in the weight and convolutions of Einstein's brain than in the near certainty that people of equal talent have lived and died in cotton fields and sweatshops.
—Stephen Jay Gould

Proud owner of 42 Zoupa Points.

Syt

Guardian:

QuoteCrimea's vice premier, Rustam Temirgaliev - who incidentally is of Crimean Tatar descent - said today Crimea will hold a referendum on 16 March on whether the region should stay with Ukraine or join Russia, Reuters reported the Russia's RIA news agency as saying.

According to RIA, the referendum will ask whether voters want Crimea to become part of the Russian Federation or remain in Ukraine under the country's post-independence 1992 constitution.
I am, somehow, less interested in the weight and convolutions of Einstein's brain than in the near certainty that people of equal talent have lived and died in cotton fields and sweatshops.
—Stephen Jay Gould

Proud owner of 42 Zoupa Points.

Tamas

Who on Earth would dare not voting on joining Russia when there are Russian soldiers and militia bullying everyone? Nobody. They will get 99% of population voting on joining Russia.