The Government Shutdown Countdown Lowdown MEGATHREAD

[Malthus]

Confused Canadian here: does the "Tea Party" have a unified platform, is it a bunch of different movements under an umbrella label? Maybe different people have a different aspect or faction in mind when they speak of the "Tea Party".

[Eddie Teach]

Which means they are not anti-government types.  Which is precisely what I am saying.

They're not anarchists, sure. I think their voters(not sure about the politicians) are pretty sincere about wanting a government that takes in less money though.

Exactly.  Just like how the Republicans went from being pro-States when Clinton was in office to suddenly favoring Federal solutions once their guy was in office.

I could get behind a tribalist interpretation, that the Tea Party exists just to spite the Democrats for winning rather than as an ideological movement. But the theory some posters are forwarding here is that there is an ideological basis and it's social issues driving it. I don't think that's accurate. My impression has been that Republicans over the past 5 years have been focusing on the deficit and the economy more than ever.

[Valmy]

My impression has been that Republicans over the past 5 years have been focusing on the deficit and the economy more than ever.

Those are obvious weaknesses of the President though.

I think their voters(not sure about the politicians) are pretty sincere about wanting a government that takes in less money though.

Yeah?  And how many want to do the things to make that happen like significantly cut the military?  Hardly any except the Libertarians.

But it hardly matters.  Someday they will be in power again and then we will see how sincere they are. 

[merithyn]

Confused Canadian here: does the "Tea Party" have a unified platform, is it a bunch of different movements under an umbrella label? Maybe different people have a different aspect or faction in mind when they speak of the "Tea Party".

I'm not sure, to be honest. I can tell you that the Tea Party here in Champaign - or those who identify themselves as such by marching at the park, anyway - are social conservatives who are anti any kind of tax at all.

It seems that derspeiss thinks otherwise, so it may just be the local group.

And why do I feel like we've had this discussion before?

[Valmy]

Confused Canadian here: does the "Tea Party" have a unified platform, is it a bunch of different movements under an umbrella label?

Like any successful American political movement both of these things are true

[Berkut]

PW is right. The current Tea Party is about, at least in theory, smaller government.

In reality, they are a LOT about ZOMG WE MUST BEAT OBAMA AT ALL COSTS BECAUSE HE IS GOING TO DESTROY OUR COUNTRY! reactionary stupidity - but it is most certainly under the context of their over-riding desire to reduce the size (or at least limit the growth) of the federal government.

What makes them ridiculous is that they have zero idea about how to actually govern. Or, to put it maybe in a more generous light, they've realized that they CANNOT govern while maintaining their principles. Which I think is largely true - there is simply no way to reverse back to what they want. The "Should the US be a socialist nation" ship sailed a long, long, LONG time ago.

[Syt]

Fortunately, my family overseas keeps me up to date about THE TRUTH in AMERIKKKA:

http://freepatriot.org/2013/10/08/pentagon-warns-radical-changes-coming-u-s-next-fortnight/

Pentagon Warns of "Radical Changes" Coming to the U.S. In the Next Fortnight

A frighteningly serious "urgent bulletin" issued earlier today by certain sects within European government branches states that information has been received from main intelligence sources warning to expect a "radical change" in the government of the United States, possibly within the next fortnight, based on information they have received from "highly placed" sources within the the U.S. Department of Defense.

According to the bulletin, intelligence assets were notified by their Pentagon counterparts this past week that U.S. President Barack Obama is preparing to invoke the powers given to him under 50 USC Chapter 13 to hold that various American States are now in a "state of insurrection." This will allow him to invoke the National Emergencies Act under 50 USC § 1621 and in turn invoke the highly controversial "continuity of government" plan for the United States allowing him, to rule with supreme powers.

What is the "continuity of government" plan? In essence, it was an emergency plan created by top government and corporate officials, Former U.S. Defense Secretaries Donald Rumsfeld and Dick Cheney being two of them (Chaney also served as vice-president under U.S. President George W. Bush) in which a "shadow government" takes control should any natural or man-made catastrophe afflict the U.S. The plan was created shortly after the attempted assassination of President Ronald Reagan.

One of the most alarming aspects of the plan, is that Congress is not re-activated or acknowledged even if it is still in existence. Creators of the plan used the excuse that "it might take too long to find the members of congress" after a catastrophe, so all power is simply given to the President, who becomes supreme leader.

The reason President Obama is considering declaring a National State of Emergency, according to the bulletin, was outlined yesterday by Obama's US Treasury Department, which released a report warning of potentially "catastrophic" damage should Congress fail to raise the debt ceiling and prevent the government from defaulting on its debt.

Many people believe that China is flexing its military muscles right now, in preparation for a U.S. invasion should the Obama regime default on payment. If the U.S. defaults, it would be the first time in the nation's history. Read more here: Obama to Cause U.S. to Default on Credit For First Time In Nation's History Spiraling Milk to $100 a Gallon

[Valmy]

Many people believe that China is flexing its military muscles right now, in preparation for a U.S. invasion should the Obama regime default on payment.

LOL

Oh those wacky 'many people'.

[Grey Fox]

That would be really, really, REALLY awesome.

Man. The possibilities.

[derspiess]

Confused Canadian here: does the "Tea Party" have a unified platform, is it a bunch of different movements under an umbrella label? Maybe different people have a different aspect or faction in mind when they speak of the "Tea Party".

It's not really a centralized movement, which makes it a little tricky to pin down on some things.

[grumbler]

No, you guys really are whacky.

You guys are insisting that your caricature of the Tea Party is the real Tea Party, so you can more easily be outraged by it.

Which is ridiculous, because there is plenty to be outraged by without the need to create this Frankenstein tea Party that the people who actually identify themselves as "Tea Party" would never agree represents them.

But who am I kidding, I am tilting at windmills.

Exactly.  They already "know" the truth, so why should they heed any facts that might interfere with their smug certainty?  Ted Cruz has a gay billionaire sugardaddy, but he is secretly a cultural warrior bent on stamping out all reference to the existence of gays.  We just don't know about it, unless we are Canadian.

[grumbler]

Confused Canadian here: does the "Tea Party" have a unified platform, is it a bunch of different movements under an umbrella label? Maybe different people have a different aspect or faction in mind when they speak of the "Tea Party".

That's why I generally refer to "Tea party types" rather than "Tea partiers" or whatever.  There are a dozen or so Tea Parties.

[Grey Fox]

Ted Cruz, also a Canadian.

[Valmy]

Exactly.  They already "know" the truth, so why should they heed any facts that might interfere with their smug certainty?  Ted Cruz has a gay billionaire sugardaddy, but he is secretly a cultural warrior bent on stamping out all reference to the existence of gays.  We just don't know about it, unless we are Canadian.

Oh so are we just talking about the Canadians here?  Berkut needed to be more specific he just said 'you guys' without addressing anybody in particular.

If they want to discuss their countryman Ted Cruz more power to them I guess.

[merithyn]

Exactly.  They already "know" the truth, so why should they heed any facts that might interfere with their smug certainty?  Ted Cruz has a gay billionaire sugardaddy, but he is secretly a cultural warrior bent on stamping out all reference to the existence of gays.  We just don't know about it, unless we are Canadian.

http://www.ontheissues.org/senate/Ted_Cruz.htm

Ted Cruz on Abortion:
Click here for 4 full quotes on Abortion OR background on Abortion.
•Companies can deny insuring birth control. (Apr 2012)
•Protect innocent human life with partial-birth ban. (Jul 2011)
•Opposes public abortion funding. (Oct 2012)
•Opposes churches providing birth control. (Oct 2012)

on Civil Rights:
•Opposes gay pride parades and opposes gay marriage. (Feb 2012)
•One-man-one-woman marriage is building block of society. (Jul 2011)
•Disallow Ku Klux Klan from participating in Adopt-A-Highway. (Jul 2011)
•Voted NO on reauthorizing the Violence Against Women Act. (Feb 2013)
•Supports defining traditional marriage. (Oct 2012)
•Supports banning military gay marriage. (Oct 2012)