Seriously, This Is As Bad As The Nazis.

[katmai]

When I was at Stonewall Inn last week, someone tried to order stoli and got told that vodka wasn't available because of the boycott.

Homos

[Neil]

I'm sure Latvians hate fags too.

[Syt]

When I was at Stonewall Inn last week, someone tried to order stoli and got told that vodka wasn't available because of the boycott.

Don't they have any non-Russian vodka?

[DGuller]

When I was at Stonewall Inn last week, someone tried to order stoli and got told that vodka wasn't available because of the boycott.

I've been boycotting Stoli ever since I had a shot of it. 

[garbon]

I like Ketel One.

[DGuller]

I like Ketel One.

That's the best one out there.

[derspiess]

When I was at Stonewall Inn last week, someone tried to order stoli and got told that vodka wasn't available because of the boycott.

I've been boycotting Stoli ever since I had a shot of it. 

Stoli is by far my favorite vodka.

[mongers]

One notable exception is the gay right campaigner Peter Tatchell who support peoples 'rights to offend others'.

God I love Peter Tatchell

I disagree with him on so very many things but he's great.

Shelf, here's Peter Tatchells take on Russia and the Olympics, a 4-5minute bbc world news interview, worth a watch:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQ1p2e4yGnE&feature=youtu.be&a

[grumbler]

I always think of Martin Amis on Larkin when it comes to PR:

P.C. begins with the very American--and attractive and honorable--idea that no one should feel ashamed of what he was born as, of what he is. Of what he does, of what he says, yes; but not ashamed of what he is. Viewed at its grandest, P.C. is an attempt to accelerate evolution. To speak truthfully, while that's still O.K., everybody is "racist," or has racial prejudices. This is because human beings tend to like the similar, the familiar, the familial. I am a racist; I am not as racist as my parents; my children will not be as racist as I am. (Larkin was less racist than his parents; his children would have been less racist than he.) Freedom from racial prejudice is what we hope for, down the line. Impatient with this hope, this process, P.C. seeks to get the thing done right now--in a generation. To achieve this, it will need a busy executive wing, and much invigilation. What it will actually entrain is another ton of false consciousness, to add to the megatons of false consciousness already aboard, and then a backlash.

It is interesting that, in the UK, PC seems to be viewed as a matter of "race."  That's not the way it started in the US.  Of course, everyone in the US isn't racist, as Amis argues everyone in the UK is, but I think he got that bit wrong.

[Sheilbh]

That's part of a piece that was a scathing defence of Larkin. After an acknowledged great writer dies there's always a reaction against them, if they survive then chances are the deserve to be acknowledged as a great writer. The reaction against Larkin was extreme. He was accused of many personal failings largely on the basis of his letters and subsequent biographies. A lot of it was overreaction, I think from the first PC generation so there was a year zero quality to it, against a man who was born in 1922 and doggedly seemed to always be a man born in 1922. I mean A.N. Wilson called him a 'really rather nasty, prematurely aged man' and 'really a kind of petty-bourgeois fascist' and 'really a nutcase' - that piece was entitled 'Larkin: The old friend I never liked'. People were comparing him to David Irving and saying there was a 'revolting sewer' running underneath the national monument that Larkin had become. It burned out and I think time's vindicated Martin Amis's defence - who remembers Tom Paulin's letter, or Andrew Motion's biography now?

So it's more about race because he deals with the accusations of misogyny elsewhere and was, in that part, dealing with the accusations of 'race hatred'. Part of Amis's argument is that I think everyone's racist to some extent, but that our kids are generally less racist than us and maybe one day we'll reach a point of absolute colour-blindness and that PC was trying to speed the process up.

But for what it's worth I think PC's a really baggy and kind-of useless phrase. I remember it being used largely to denote 'modern' alternative comedians like Ben Elton and Jo Brand over the old club comedians who'd make jokes about 'Pakis'. It seemed to be a good thing and part of it was, ultimately, censorship when TV companies decided that even if racist jokes made them money they probably shouldn't show them - 'a busy executive wing'. At the time it was cancelled the black and white minstrel show was the highest rated in this country. There's other sides to it but, broadly, I think it was positive.

Similarly in my own memory the shift on attitudes to gays has been incredible. The Sun went from a frontpage on whether we were run by a Gay Mafia (there were I think three gay ministers at the time) to celebrating Elton John's civil partnership ('David's taking Elton up the aisle') and supporting gay marriage.

Now PC seems to be mainly used for people announcing breathtakingly conventional opinions. They preface an outstanding statement of conventional wisdom with 'now may not be politically correct but...' It seems to mean all sorts of things including, say, the environment. See the Telegraph here:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/personal-view/8513876/The-A-Z-of-political-correctness.html

[Admiral Yi]

I think it's a form-fitting and immensely useful phrase.

[Sheilbh]

I think it's a form-fitting and immensely useful phrase.

It's the right-wing version of 'neo-liberal'. There may be a useful meaning under there somewhere but it's long got swallowed up.

[Admiral Yi]

Neo-liberal has a relatively clear cut meaning, referring to the position that if you fuck with market mechanisms you pay the price.  Neo-conservative might work better for you, which has about as many varied meanings as Tea Party does.

[Razgovory]

I'm actually fuzzy on what PC actually means.  Could you clue me in, Yi?

[Sheilbh]

I think neo-conservatism's now around the level of fascism, it just means 'something bad'

Neo-liberal's an agenda that encompasses Maggie, the IMF and New Labour. As I say I think there's a meaning in there somewhere (though not one those three would agree on) but it's just generally a Guardianista term of abuse.

Much like on that A-Z list from the Telegraph. Political correctness means everything from Halal fast food to dodgems.