Switching lights off for the Earth Hour

[Tamas]

it is, actually:

I know you are new to the West and all that, but do you really buy that?

don't tell me you dont see the similarities between the "oh we are sinners" culture of Earth Hour and other similar shit, and good old Christian "oh we are sinners" shit?

No, not really.  At least not any more then any other idea which views certain acts as positive and other acts as negative.

well, your loss I guess

[Razgovory]

Do you regard the strict adherence to free market principles, so called "free market fundamentalism", similar to religion?

[crazy canuck]

I think we have this thread every year with predictable results.

In any event if earth hour coincides with a NCAA game the electrical use in my house will continue unabated.

[Admiral Yi]

Anything can be treated like a religion when beliefs are based on faith instead of proofs.

There's nothing intrinsic to the opinion that a free market delivers superior outcomes that makes it like a religion.

[crazy canuck]

Anything can be treated like a religion when beliefs are based on faith instead of proofs.

There's nothing intrinsic to the opinion that a free market delivers superior outcomes that makes it like a religion.

Thats nice but it has nothing to do with the NCAA tournament.

[Razgovory]

Anything can be treated like a religion when beliefs are based on faith instead of proofs.

There's nothing intrinsic to the opinion that a free market delivers superior outcomes that makes it like a religion.

I dunno, the Austrian school seems to eschew mathematical models and empirical testing.  This rejection of scientific means seems similar to religion.

However, the point of calling environmental ideas a "religion" is a way for people to rationalize the rejection of scientific studies.  Ideologies such as libertarianism is badly undermined by things like climate change.  So labeling such it "luddism", or "religious fundamentalism", helps a person ignore information that is damaging to their ideology and still feel rational.

[Admiral Yi]

I dunno, the Austrian school seems to eschew mathematical models and empirical testing.  This rejection of scientific means seems similar to religion.

Economics that relies on historical comparison rather than data analysis is not limited to the Austrian school.  Keynes was not a model builder and tester, neither was John Kenneth Galbraith.

However, the point of calling environmental ideas a "religion" is a way for people to rationalize the rejection of scientific studies.  Ideologies such as libertarianism is badly undermined by things like climate change.  So labeling such it "luddism", or "religious fundamentalism", helps a person ignore information that is damaging to their ideology and still feel rational.

That is one possible motivation, out of many,  for a person to label environmentalism a religion.  I label certain environmentalists religious when they are more concerned about the means than they are about the ends--for example if they oppose offsets or sinks or the like because it's not pure and esthetic enough.

Totally no clue what you mean by libertarianism being undermined by climate change.  Because it's an externalilty?

[mongers]

Anything can be treated like a religion when beliefs are based on faith instead of proofs.

There's nothing intrinsic to the opinion that a free market delivers superior outcomes that makes it like a religion.

I dunno, the Austrian school seems to eschew mathematical models and empirical testing.  This rejection of scientific means seems similar to religion.

However, the point of calling environmental ideas a "religion" is a way for people to rationalize the rejection of scientific studies.  Ideologies such as libertarianism is badly undermined by things like climate change.  So labeling such it "luddism", or "religious fundamentalism", helps a person ignore information that is damaging to their ideology and still feel rational.

[Valmy]

Ideologies such as libertarianism is badly undermined by things like climate change.

Not really.  A Libertarian would just demonstrate how government policies and incentives encouraged pollution and how the problem would be far less with freedom and stuff.

[Razgovory]

I dunno, the Austrian school seems to eschew mathematical models and empirical testing.  This rejection of scientific means seems similar to religion.

Economics that relies on historical comparison rather than data analysis is not limited to the Austrian school.  Keynes was not a model builder and tester, neither was John Kenneth Galbraith.

However, the point of calling environmental ideas a "religion" is a way for people to rationalize the rejection of scientific studies.  Ideologies such as libertarianism is badly undermined by things like climate change.  So labeling such it "luddism", or "religious fundamentalism", helps a person ignore information that is damaging to their ideology and still feel rational.

That is one possible motivation, out of many,  for a person to label environmentalism a religion.  I label certain environmentalists religious when they are more concerned about the means than they are about the ends--for example if they oppose offsets or sinks or the like because it's not pure and esthetic enough.

Totally no clue what you mean by libertarianism being undermined by climate change.  Because it's an externalilty?

Does Keynesian economics use mathematical models?  Which environmental "ends" in particular worry you?  The reason that libertarianism is undermined is because one of the central concepts, "I should be able to do what I want so long as I doesn't harm others" breaks down.  So yeah, it's an "externality", thing.

[Razgovory]

Ideologies such as libertarianism is badly undermined by things like climate change.

Not really.  A Libertarian would just demonstrate how government policies and incentives encouraged pollution and how the problem would be far less with freedom and stuff.

Yes, blaming the government is the favored solution to all libertarian problems, ideological or practical.  In this case they often blame governments for financing studies in the first place!

[Admiral Yi]

Many people, Keynesians among them, have tested his theories against data.  He personally did not AFAIK, which does not invalidate his work.

I didn't say any enviromental ends worry me.  You misread my post.

"As long as I doesn't [sic] harm others."  That seems relevant to externalities.

[Valmy]

Yes, blaming the government is the favored solution to all libertarian problems, ideological or practical.  In this case they often blame governments for financing studies in the first place!

Wait why is global warming a Libertarian problem that they must solve?  Last I checked pollution has tended to be low in societies experiencing anarchy

[Eddie Teach]

If everyone lived on a 20-acre ranch in Idaho, global warming would be welcome.

[Valmy]

If everyone lived on a 20-acre ranch in Idaho, global warming would be welcome.