Oliver Stone's Untold History of America

[CountDeMoney]

And Stalin really didn't do squat in defeating the other land-hungry Axis empire.

Smart man.

No shit.  "Americans did the building, Soviets did the dying" was wholly dependent on which time zone discussed.

I thought EdAnger was calling Stalin smart for not fighting the Japs.

The fuck does he know, he stockpiles strudel.  Ed, not Stalin.

[Ed Anger]

I know that not sticking your dick into a bees nest while a bunch of kraits are slicing you up is the best policy.

[CountDeMoney]

WHERE WAS OUR SECOND FRONT?

And don't say "China".

[Ed Anger]

We are Americans, we can handle such Herculean tasks without help from dodgy allies.

[CountDeMoney]

General Petraeus could apparently handle multiple fronts, lulz.

[Ed Anger]

 

[Josephus]

For once I agree with Marti...or he agrees with me, since it's what I've been saying all along.
The average person, (not people on this forum or our friends) have a lot less knowledge of basic WW2 history than you think. As Marti said, Private Ryan is their extent of their knowledge.

For them the WW2 narrative goes something like:

A long time ago when everything was black and white, there was this German guy and he hated Jews so he invaded some country with a lot of Jews. He killed Jews, and that made the USA mad, cause we got lots of Jews, so we went to rescue the Jews. Then they attacked Pearl Harbour which was like 9/11.  We left from Omaha and arrived on some beach in Germany, and then we threw a atom bomb and Hitler died but not before he threw this tantrum which you can see memed on youtube a lot. And we won the war and Private Ryan went home.

[garbon]

Rather shocking that J and Marti would take the stance that they are more intelligent than their fellow humans.

[Eddie Teach]

This is probably a self-selecting bias - you normally discuss history with people who know about history. I'm pretty sure that if you did a vox pop and asked people in the street about the role of the US vs. the USSR in winning WW2, most people in the US would say that the role of the US was dominant.

We had our hands full fighting another empire that apparently doesn't count.

[Malthus]

Anyway, this whole thread seems like a strawman. Yes, who would have thought that historical facts a popular tv programme targeted at general public (including young people) considers to be not very well known are actually known by many people on a forum composed of hardcore gamers united by their interest in niche historical games. Let's have a circle jerk over it.

And let's face it. Most people take their history knowledge from Hollywood. And I don't think the Soviet war effort features that prominently in Saving Private Ryan, Patton or Pearl Harbor.

When someone names their series the "Untold History Of The United States", it is reasonable to expect some actual contrarian history, even if the average mook on the street knows nothing about history.

[Josephus]

Rather shocking that J and Marti would take the stance that they are more intelligent than their fellow humans.

I actually don't doubt that for a second. I worked for two summers on a construction site. I've heard people talk.

One guy I met was convinced that sharks don't die.

"You never see dead sharks floating around on Jack Cousteau." He said to me.

[Razgovory]

I give most people more credit then some of you guys.

[CountDeMoney]

One guy I met was convinced that sharks don't die.

"You never see dead sharks floating around on Jack Cousteau." He said to me.

They don't get cancer, either.  Never seen a shark smoke, have you?

[Valmy]

When someone names their series the "Untold History Of The United States", it is reasonable to expect some actual contrarian history, even if the average mook on the street knows nothing about history.

Well yeah if the assumption is you are talking to people who have not heard any history then anything can be untold.

[Zanza]

Being taken prisoner was a major factor in ending the war.  If there were no Western Armies to surrender to, then they wouldn't have surrendered.  They would have kept on fighting.  The German government tried to surrender only to the Western allies at first.  Only after being told that no surrender would be accepted that didn't include the Soviets did the Germans finally give up.  The presence of the Western Armies was essentially like steam valve, allowing German pressure to against the Soviet to dissipate.  With out that mechanism, they would have to fight all those Germans.

Yes. Doesn't change the fact that the number you cited does not tell us anything about the comparative effort of the Americans and Soviets which is what both your original post and the thread are about.