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[Canada] Canadian Politics Redux

Started by Josephus, March 22, 2011, 09:27:34 PM

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crazy canuck

Quote from: Jacob on April 28, 2011, 06:38:28 PM
I guess we'll see. Or, more likely, not see :)

I truly hope you are correct.

crazy canuck

Quote from: Neil on April 28, 2011, 07:18:51 PM
They could simply have any corporation doing business in Canada pay tax on their gross revenue rather than net profits.  Or the net profits of the parent corporation and all subsidiaries.

That would be an excellent way to ensure we have no corporations left doing business in Canada.

crazy canuck

Quote from: Josephus on April 28, 2011, 07:13:21 PM
That Globe endorsement might be worth its weight in gold for Harper. Normally a fairly centrist paper with many Liberal readers, it just might make Iggy supporters, especially in T.O. switch their allegiance to Harper.

Not sure its that big a deal.  IIRC the Globe has endorsed them at least a couple times during this string of minority governments.

Neil

Quote from: crazy canuck on April 28, 2011, 08:52:44 PM
Quote from: Neil on April 28, 2011, 07:18:51 PM
They could simply have any corporation doing business in Canada pay tax on their gross revenue rather than net profits.  Or the net profits of the parent corporation and all subsidiaries.
That would be an excellent way to ensure we have no corporations left doing business in Canada.
And the NDP would rejoice.
I do not hate you, nor do I love you, but you are made out of atoms which I can use for something else.

Josephus

This is the best letter on the Globe endorsement, so I'm now thinking that Globe readers are not as stupid as I previously portrayed them.

Re Facing Up To Our Challenges (April 28): There is one significant point that The Globe and Mail editorial board seems to have ignored in its endorsement of Stephen Harper and the Conservatives. The board praises Mr. Harper based on his five years as Prime Minister of a minority government.
Interactive
Globe endorsements through history

You explicitly say that Harper's government has been "moderate and pragmatic." You do not acknowledge that this may have been the case only because of the Conservative Party's minority status.

The economic stimulus for which you praise the Conservatives was substantial and effective because other parties had the leverage necessary to ensure this was the case.

Mr. Harper has given many glimpses of how his conduct would differ were he free of the constraints of minority status. Instead of acknowledging these, you indulge in wishful thinking that he will "relax his grip on Parliament, its independent officers and the flow of information". With a majority, it is as reasonable to conclude that Mr. Harper will do exactly the opposite, to the considerable detriment of our public institutions, and this country.


Civis Romanus Sum<br /><br />"My friends, love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair. So let us be loving, hopeful and optimistic. And we'll change the world." Jack Layton 1950-2011

Zoupa

Bingo.

Anyhoo. I'm voting NDP. The candidate here is a 25 year old high school teacher with no experience in politics and government. She's polling ahead of the Lib candidate, same one that won with 12 000 votes up last time  :lol:

Loving it. I'm praying for a giant clusterfuck come monday night. At least it'll be interesting.

Gaius Marius

Quote from: Oexmelin on April 28, 2011, 02:55:04 PM
I don't mind people having little to no experience in party politics. Career politicians often frighten me more, and one can't on the one hand complain that politics attract only second-rate individuals, and on the other hope that stellar candidates would have focused their early lives on becoming MPs. Political flair can be developped elsewhere. Broad minds, varied experiences, a healthy mix of backgrounds in a party seems much more important, and the force of conviction can sometimes work wonders at getting your ideas implemented. 

Which is not to say that some NDPs (or, in Quebec, some Conservatives) do not appear quite... ehm... thin, as far as ideas or capacity are concerned.

I think thats probably true for alot of incumbent MPs, and probably for a majority of candidates in ridings where they have no chance and are just completing the turn. Or if they have a mind and ideas of their own, their party leader must have told them to 'shut the fuck up.'  Sometimes you get to see some independent thought when watching committee proceedings, but that is largely hidden from the public eye.

Its hard to do in 2011 when independents don't really get elected and party discipline on issues and votes is in vogue, but I think its still in the best interest of the voter to look at all the local candidates and decide who would best represent you an MP, both in terms of ability and in terms of conduct. Even if you don't agree with policy positions they have, better a strong personality in Ottawa for your area than a weak one that won't even speak up on the things that you agree with them.

My two cents: an inexperienced NDP government federally would be the second-worst result (a Bloc minority would be the worst technically, though fortunately impossible) we could have right now. A bigger NDP caucus would be alright; if they want to be serious about forming government federally, they have to have more experienced and senior members that understand how parliament operates, and they need to spend time serving on committees and studying the bills they have to vote on.  Grand ideas mean nothing if you don't have a plan to achieve them without screwing everything else up.

I'd like to see the current Conservative minority re-elected, but without Harper as Prime Minister. I'd prefer, say, Peter MacKay. Someone on the PC wing of the party who'd still be fiscally prudent, but less on the social conservative side as Harper is, at least as an individual.
First Man in Rome

Josephus

The Toronto Star officially endorsed the NDP today. They did have a second, smaller editorial saying that while they endorse the NDP they suggest that voters in Toronto continue to vote Liberal, less the split in the vote gives the Conservatives the riding. Also a recent poll puts them at 33 per cent.
Civis Romanus Sum<br /><br />"My friends, love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair. So let us be loving, hopeful and optimistic. And we'll change the world." Jack Layton 1950-2011

Barrister

Quote from: Gaius Marius on April 29, 2011, 04:17:55 AM
I'd like to see the current Conservative minority re-elected, but without Harper as Prime Minister. I'd prefer, say, Peter MacKay. Someone on the PC wing of the party who'd still be fiscally prudent, but less on the social conservative side as Harper is, at least as an individual.

What exactly has Harper done that is so socially conservative?

Were you aware he was the President of the Fraser Institute, a decidedly small government libertarian-minded organization, with no interest in social conservative issues?
Posts here are my own private opinions.  I do not speak for my employer.

HVC

i love that the Conservative attak ads were both very effective and ineffective at the same time. Libs lost the votes, but instead of going Conserv people went NDP :lol:
Being lazy is bad; unless you still get what you want, then it's called "patience".
Hubris must be punished. Severely.

Admiral Yi

Quote from: Josephus on April 28, 2011, 09:30:02 PM
This is the best letter on the Globe endorsement, so I'm now thinking that Globe readers are not as stupid as I previously portrayed them.

The economic stimulus for which you praise the Conservatives was substantial and effective because other parties had the leverage necessary to ensure this was the case.

Why did Canada need substantial economic stimulus?

Grey Fox

Was it really substantial? It was 30 billion, I think.
Colonel Caliga is Awesome.

Jacob

Quote from: Barrister on April 30, 2011, 12:14:35 PMWhat exactly has Harper done that is so socially conservative?

Here's a list of some of them:

Cutting of funding for any foreign aid schemes that promotes the use of contraception or abortion (a reversal of policy under both Liberal and Conservative governments).

Providing federal funding for explicitly evangelical charities, such as Youth for Christ in Winnipeg.

Wanting to shut down safe injection sites.

Favouring punishment over rehabilitation, significantly increasing funding for the prison system and generally pushing "tough on crime" when crime rates are falling.

Severely cutting funding for various women's and minority advocacy groups, including one which tracked and documented the hundreds of missing and murdered aboriginal women in the country.

http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/03/19/harper%E2%80%99s-hard-right-turn/
http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/article/804414--conservatives-accused-of-culture-of-intimidation?bn=1
http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/local/project-for-slain-women-faces-end-84292267.html


From a site on social conservatism, aimed at telling why social conservatives should vote for Harper:

QuoteWhat has the Harper government done to support the social conservative agenda?

First, the abolition of the Court Challenges Program, established under the Chrétien government to fund test cases by individuals and groups seeking to challenge federal laws and policies allegedly in violation of their constitutional equality rights. The program was used mainly, although not exclusively, by feminists and gays and lesbians to redress what they deemed to be unjust forms of discrimination.

The other major social conservative achievement of the Harper government is the $1,200 per year child-care allowance and the abandonment of the Liberal plan to set up a joint federal-provincial child-care system.

Thanks to the Harper government, Canada has also ceased to be a country with one of the lowest ages of consent for sexual activity in the Western world, the age limit having been raised last year from 14 to 16. The government has also consistently opposed the legalization of marijuana, and it supports firmer legislation for criminal offenders. Moreover, the Conservatives were the only party to take a firm stand against same-sex marriage.

...one cannot ignore the fact that the Harper government has been in a minority position and, perhaps more importantly, confronted until recently with very hostile media seeking every opportunity to make it appear extremist. Thus, it can be legitimately argued that the "soft" response of the Harper government on these issues has been based more on tactical prudential judgment than on a lack of commitment.

From: http://www.c2cjournal.ca/blog-articles/view/social-conservatives-and-the-harper-government/#

It's enough to cause concern, if you're concerned about social conservatism.

Jacob

Mildly amusing political cartoon:


Malthus

The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane—Marcus Aurelius