Thousands of angry Greeks march against austerity

[sbr]

And no, Greeks do not hate black people:

Webster, I forgot about that little fucker.

[Jaron]

I don't remember you calling the teabaggers out like this. But both seem to have the same motivation, no?

Be sensitive guys. This is autism awareness week.

[dps]

I don't remember you calling the teabaggers out like this. But both seem to have the same motivation, no?

Grumbler, don't you know that the teabaggers are protesting against austerity measures demanded by the IMF and EU?

[Faeelin]

I don't remember you calling the teabaggers out like this. But both seem to have the same motivation, no?

I lack the sophisticated, nuanced understanding of the motivations of Greek protestors that Tim displays, but the fundamentals behind both sets of protests seems pretty much the same. Both sets of protests are basically by a bunch of pissed off people who don't understand why the economy adn their country seem to have gone to hell.

[Scipio]

As I understand it, the fundamental problem is that Greeks don't pay their own taxes.  Now that's fucking brilliant, especially if they can get some fat German businessman to pay their taxes for them.  The mainland Greeks have been loafing since 3d C. BC.  They're fucking expert at two things: loafing, and getting conquered by people with darker skin than them.

[Palisadoes]

There is no evidence that the Greeks protesting are all, or even most, angry civil servants.

The ones today (yesterday) were apparently largely anarchists and trade unionists. The former protest for the sake of it, and the latter come from mainly the public sector, as far as I'm aware.

[Eddie Teach]

I lack the sophisticated, nuanced understanding of the motivations of Greek protestors that Tim displays, but the fundamentals behind both sets of protests seems pretty much the same. Both sets of protests are basically by a bunch of pissed off people who don't understand why the economy adn their country seem to have gone to hell.

The Americans are protesting because they think the government is going to spend more and raise their taxes. The Greeks are protesting because the government is going to spend less so it can pay down the debt. Sure, you can simplify things so much that they're the same (the reason people are protesting is they don't like what the government's doing!) but what is the use of that?

[grumbler]

I lack the sophisticated, nuanced understanding of the motivations of Greek protestors that Tim displays, but the fundamentals behind both sets of protests seems pretty much the same. Both sets of protests are basically by a bunch of pissed off people who don't understand why the economy adn their country seem to have gone to hell.

I think you lack any understanding of what the tea party types seem to be protesting for.  They want the types of austerity measures the Greeks are protesting against.  They seem to me to be diametrically opposite on views and goals.

[jimmy olsen]

Irresponsible morons, they keep this shit up and after the state collapses into insolvency they'll have a real junta or dictatorship of some flavor or another on their hands.

I don't remember you calling the teabaggers out like this. But both seem to have the same motivation, no?

The tea baggers have yet to wield any appreciable power in the congress or on the streets nor are they likely too. Call me back when they bring Washington to a screeching halt.

[garbon]

Like any of us would ever return your phone calls.

[Martim Silva]

It's not just corruption though, but just general stupidity: people working for the forestry agency getting paid to maintain cut-down forests; lake maintainance workers getting paid to maintain dried-up lakes;

Waste is common in most countries. Want me to dug obscure examples of the same thing in the US? There are many of them...

Many civil servants getting paid for 14 months of work a year, and so on...

Actually, this is quite common in Southern Europe: Portugal and Spain also have 14 months, Italy and France have 13 months, Belgium too, Germany and Holland have similar season-linked payments.

Just because Americans and Brits like to be robbed blind by their bosses doesn't mean everyone else should do it.

ALSO, take note that the ordinary citizen earns very little. Counting with those extra wages, your average greek lives with the fabulous wage of about 18K per year [in Portugal is 10K per year], though with prices far superior of those in the US.

Take the extra pay away from people, and many will be facing dire financial problems - the extras were meant to allow people to actually go on vacation, or to buy things for the kids during Christmas. Without those, they cannot do so.

(in fact, most people depend on those just to balance their budgets; they don't go on vacation even with their vacation bonus)

As I understand it, the fundamental problem is that Greeks don't pay their own taxes.

Let me explain better:

The fundamental problem is that THE RICH don't pay their own taxes.

As you can guess, civil servants, being paid directly by the State, have no way to avoid taxation on what they earn - they pay it all.

It's the company bosses, the big managers, fund managers, politicians and rich bankers finding all kinds of loopholes to hide their true incomes that really cost the Greek State a fortune.

But the measures are always the same - it's the poor guys who cannot dodge taxes who have to pay more. The fatcats will continue to dodge taxes. You'll still see the marinas full of yachts and the politicians going on expensive travels (on taxpayer money), while the poorest will be denied even the money to buy their kids a Christmas present.

But it's the poor people who are the "idiots" for not wanting to be robbed to pay for the follies of the rich businessmen and the madness of the politicians...

[The Brain]

All the greasy peoples suck ass and couldn't work their way out of a wet fetus bag. They're lazy as fuck too.

[Martim Silva]

All the greasy peoples suck ass and couldn't work their way out of a wet fetus bag. They're lazy as fuck too.

You mean like Iceland, who is also quite broke due to the bankers' greed?

Or Ireland, in dire straits after being the poster child of liberalization?

Or the Baltic States, which have imploded after being models of total liberalism?

[The Brain]

All the greasy peoples suck ass and couldn't work their way out of a wet fetus bag. They're lazy as fuck too.

You mean like Iceland, who is also quite broke due to the bankers' greed?

Or Ireland, in dire straits after being the poster child of liberalization?

Or the Baltic States, which have imploded after being models of total liberalism?

You OK, kemosabe? I didn't mention those peoples at all.

[Martim Silva]

You OK, kemosabe? I didn't mention those peoples at all.

Your comment was directed at Southern Europeans. I merely pointed out that non-southern europeans, indeed some rather blonde peoples, are having troubles just as deep.

The reason for the problems isn't racial nor cultural. It's closely linked to economic ideology.

That said, the Greek government revealed its plans for cuts, and they'll just cut the 13-14 wages of those making over 3,000 euro ($3,900) per month. All others will have their bonuses capped at 1,000 euro ($1,300). They fear revolution.

Still, it's insufficient. With these plans, Greece will suffer a strong recession and most likely will still be saddled with heavy debt after 3 years. Which means it will need more bailouts. Some are saying this may end up costing up to 250 billion euro, instead of the 120 billion initially advanced, and they may very well be right.