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Mobtown to become abortion battlefield

Started by CountDeMoney, November 23, 2009, 06:57:14 PM

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CountDeMoney

Gonna hit the anti-choice "clinics" in the chops, baby.  Post that sign! 

QuoteBaltimore to be center of abortion debate
City Council expected to approve rules for offices that don't provide abortion, birth control


By Matthew Hay Brown
November 23, 2009

Both sides of the abortion debate will be focusing on Baltimore today, when the City Council is expected to approve a first-in-the-nation law imposing new regulations on faith-based organizations that try to steer women away from the procedure.

The measure, introduced by council President Stephanie C. Rawlings-Blake at the behest of Planned Parenthood of Maryland, would require that crisis pregnancy centers that do not provide abortions or birth control post signs saying so.

Proponents frame the effort as a matter of public health. They accuse the centers of giving false or misleading information about the effects of abortion and birth control. Pregnant women, they say, should be told when they are not being given access to all of the options legally available to them.

But officials at such centers say they make their mission clear. They say the information they give is accurate, and making them advertise the services that they don't provide would be an unprecedented form of harassment.

"It really impugns our integrity," said Carol A. Clews, executive director of the Greater Baltimore Center for Pregnancy Concerns, which has two locations in the city and a third in Dundalk. "We are very forthright about what we do here and what we don't do. To put us in a position where we would have to put up a sign is offensive."

Jennifer Blasdell says it shouldn't be.

"It's not asking these centers to provide any sort of service that they find objectionable," said Blasdell, executive director of NARAL Pro-Choice Maryland. "It's just asking them to disclose what is true."

The City Council, having voted 12-3 last week to move the measure forward, is expected to approve it today. It would then go to Mayor Sheila Dixon, who supports abortion rights but has not said whether she would sign it.

If Dixon, now awaiting a jury verdict on theft charges, is forced to step down, Rawlings-Blake would become mayor.

The action has drawn attention across the abortion divide, with both sides saying Baltimore could be a test case for the nation. Since Rawlings-Blake introduced the bill last month, a similar proposal has sprung up in Montgomery County.

"This is clearly a first step, and they're using Baltimore as a steppingstone, trying to manipulate our legislature into doing something that no other assembly has done in the United States," said Archbishop Edwin F. O'Brien, spiritual leader of the area's 500,000 Catholics. "It's unheard of, and, I think, irresponsible."

Keiren Havens, vice president of Planned Parenthood of Maryland, says the local effort could serve as a national model.

"We've been very concerned about crisis pregnancy centers for quite a while," she said. "There's a growing national network of crisis pregnancy centers that are specifically designed to target what they call abortion-vulnerable women and deny them full medical information about abortion and contraception, including referrals for those services. And that's of great concern to us just as a public health issue."

Rawlings-Blake is aware of the national implications of the proposal. But she says they aren't her concern.

"I represent Baltimore City and my constituents here," she said. "When confronted with what I saw was a potential problem, I looked for solutions."

The legislation follows separate reports by NARAL Pro-Choice Maryland and Rep. Henry A. Waxman of California that accuse crisis pregnancy centers in the state and nationwide of attempting to deceive clients with false or misleading information.

At the Greater Baltimore Center for Pregnancy Concerns, NARAL Pro-Choice Maryland says, volunteer investigators posing as pregnant women were given inaccurate information about the safety and effectiveness of birth control, about links between abortion and cancer, and about the emotional trauma that women may experience undergoing the procedure.

Blasdell says the sign outside the organization's Charles Village center, which advertises "Accurate information on all options" and "Medical and community referrals," is itself misleading.

"It is easy for a woman to confuse that center with a comprehensive center that is going to give accurate information about her options," she said.

Cathy Johnson, a coordinator for the Greater Baltimore Center for Pregnancy Concerns, says she stands by the information she gives her clients.

The center, which sees about 1,000 women a year, counsels against abortion, and offers sonograms as a way of dissuading those who are considering the procedure. But Johnson says most of her work consists of supporting women who plan to carry their pregnancies to term, with parenting classes, maternity and infant supplies and referrals for prenatal care and adoption.

"We're not converting women who want to go to Planned Parenthood," Johnson said. "They come to us because they know what we do."

The council bill would require that a "limited-service pregnancy center" post a conspicuous and easily readable sign, written in English and Spanish, "substantially to the effect that the center does not provide or make referral for abortion or birth-control services." A center failing to comply within 10 days of being cited could be fined up to $150 per day.

In a letter to Rawlings-Blake, O'Brien called the measure "harassment." If it passes, he said in an interview, the archdiocese is prepared "legally to address it."

"When Planned Parenthood puts out in their literature on their doorstep that they do not provide baby formula and care for pregnant women to find homes for the babies, when they're asked to do that, we can come to some kind of compromise on what this city is expecting of us," he said.

Havens says Planned Parenthood follows the same standard of care as any gynecological provider. While this doesn't include providing "clothes or infant formula or baby rattles," she said, it does include referrals for prenatal care and adoption.

"We don't see ourselves on opposite sides of the issue here," she said. "All we're saying is if you are an organization that targets pregnant women, you should, if you're not going to provide them with information, you need to refer them for information that they need to make their life decision."

Neil

Aren't you going to argue that encouraging abortions in 'chocolate cities' is racist?
I do not hate you, nor do I love you, but you are made out of atoms which I can use for something else.

Lettow77

 Chocolate cities is an endearing term, and makes them sound like somewhere i'd want to live. It hides a darker meaning though, and colours what would otherwise be a cutesy phrase with a black connotation.
It can't be helped...We'll have to use 'that'

Viking

First Maxim - "There are only two amounts, too few and enough."
First Corollary - "You cannot have too many soldiers, only too few supplies."
Second Maxim - "Be willing to exchange a bad idea for a good one."
Second Corollary - "You can only be wrong or agree with me."

A terrorist which starts a slaughter quoting Locke, Burke and Mill has completely missed the point.
The fact remains that the only person or group to applaud the Norway massacre are random Islamists.

Faeelin

 :huh:

I would think that there would already be legal issues with misrepresenting yourself as a doctor and giving out inaccurate medical information.

grumbler

Quote from: Faeelin on November 24, 2009, 09:33:14 AM
:huh:

I would think that there would already be legal issues with misrepresenting yourself as a doctor and giving out inaccurate medical information.
Since that isn't what these "crisis pregnancy centers" represent themselves as, not much of an issue.

These are, to some degree, "fake" Planned Parenthood clinics, designed as decoys to draw in pregnant women who might otherwise go to PP.  To some degree they are also designed to provide pregnancy services for women who don't want to go to PP but cannot afford a regular doctor.

I have mixed feelings about the law in question.
The future is all around us, waiting, in moments of transition, to be born in moments of revelation. No one knows the shape of that future or where it will take us. We know only that it is always born in pain.   -G'Kar

Bayraktar!

derspiess

I think it's a good idea.  In fact, Baltimore should require every organization or business to post a sign listing all services they do not provide :lol:
"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall

grumbler

Quote from: derspiess on November 24, 2009, 12:03:13 PM
I think it's a good idea.  In fact, Baltimore should require every organization or business to post a sign listing all services they do not provide :lol:
This is more like forcing a barbershop to put up a sign advertising that it does not cut women's hair, but it isn't clear that even this should be a government regulation.

I guess my problem with not requiring the signs is that the very people who should be getting abortions (those who couldn't tell the difference between biblethumper clinics and abortion-provider ones) are the ones who we need to make sure get the abortions.
The future is all around us, waiting, in moments of transition, to be born in moments of revelation. No one knows the shape of that future or where it will take us. We know only that it is always born in pain.   -G'Kar

Bayraktar!

Faeelin

Quote from: grumbler on November 24, 2009, 10:01:18 AM
Since that isn't what these "crisis pregnancy centers" represent themselves as, not much of an issue.

These are, to some degree, "fake" Planned Parenthood clinics, designed as decoys to draw in pregnant women who might otherwise go to PP.  To some degree they are also designed to provide pregnancy services for women who don't want to go to PP but cannot afford a regular doctor.

I have mixed feelings about the law in question.
I suppose I am more concerned about:

QuoteAt the Greater Baltimore Center for Pregnancy Concerns, NARAL Pro-Choice Maryland says, volunteer investigators posing as pregnant women were given inaccurate information about the safety and effectiveness of birth control, about links between abortion and cancer, and about the emotional trauma that women may experience undergoing the procedure.

I don't know if all pro-life facilities do this, but I know there are some in NJ that do.

The Minsky Moment

Quote from: derspiess on November 24, 2009, 12:03:13 PM
I think it's a good idea.  In fact, Baltimore should require every organization or business to post a sign listing all services they do not provide :lol:

Don't be silly - Baltimore should actively encourage all its local businesses to advertise their services falsely.  The more people deceived, the better.
The purpose of studying economics is not to acquire a set of ready-made answers to economic questions, but to learn how to avoid being deceived by economists.
--Joan Robinson

Faeelin

Quote from: The Minsky Moment on November 24, 2009, 01:18:54 PM
Don't be silly - Baltimore should actively encourage all its local businesses to advertise their services falsely.  The more people deceived, the better.

I don't see how you can call yourself planned parenthood when one of your services is to make sure she doesn't end up a parent.

alfred russel

Quote from: Faeelin on November 24, 2009, 01:32:27 PM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on November 24, 2009, 01:18:54 PM
Don't be silly - Baltimore should actively encourage all its local businesses to advertise their services falsely.  The more people deceived, the better.

I don't see how you can call yourself planned parenthood when one of your services is to make sure she doesn't end up a parent.

I do see how you can call yourself planned parenthood even when one of your services is to prevent unplanned parenthood from happening.
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

There's a fine line between salvation and drinking poison in the jungle.

I'm embarrassed. I've been making the mistake of associating with you. It won't happen again. :)
-garbon, February 23, 2014

CountDeMoney

Quote from: grumbler on November 24, 2009, 10:01:18 AM
Quote from: Faeelin on November 24, 2009, 09:33:14 AM
:huh:

I would think that there would already be legal issues with misrepresenting yourself as a doctor and giving out inaccurate medical information.
Since that isn't what these "crisis pregnancy centers" represent themselves as, not much of an issue.

These are, to some degree, "fake" Planned Parenthood clinics, designed as decoys to draw in pregnant women who might otherwise go to PP.  To some degree they are also designed to provide pregnancy services for women who don't want to go to PP but cannot afford a regular doctor.

I have mixed feelings about the law in question.

The law in question is to nail all the Army of God fucks and Operation Rescuetards with their "fake" clinics and their little covert anti-choice agendas.  They've been around since the mid-80s, posing as clinics, and once a knocked up teenager walks through the door, they do their best to shove the fetus down the poor confused girl's throat.

Fuck 'em.

jimmy olsen

Down on the floor! This is a hijacking!

Care to elaborate on the case in your signature Minsky?
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on November 24, 2009, 01:18:54 PM
JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR: Do you think that there is some benefit to society from patenting a method to cure someone that involves just human activity, as opposed to some machine, substance, or other apparatus to help that process?
MR. JAKES: Yes . . . .
JUSTICE BREYER: So you are going to answer this question yes. You know, I have a great, wonderful, really original method of teaching antitrust law, and it kept 80 percent of the students awake. They learned things. It was fabulous. And I could probably have reduced it to a set of steps and other teachers could have followed it. That you are going to say is patentable, too?
MR. JAKES: Potentially.

--Transcript excerpt from In re Bilsky, 11/9/09
It is far better for the truth to tear my flesh to pieces, then for my soul to wander through darkness in eternal damnation.

Jet: So what kind of woman is she? What's Julia like?
Faye: Ordinary. The kind of beautiful, dangerous ordinary that you just can't leave alone.
Jet: I see.
Faye: Like an angel from the underworld. Or a devil from Paradise.
--------------------------------------------
1 Karma Chameleon point

DontSayBanana

Quote from: Faeelin on November 24, 2009, 01:32:27 PM
I don't see how you can call yourself planned parenthood when one of your services is to make sure she doesn't end up a parent.

I don't see how you can call yourself a law student and miss the conditional introduced by the word "planned." :contract: :P

Even the most conservative legislation being bandied about in Congress regarding abortion makes exceptions for medical necessity, rape, or incest.  Some of these "clinics" try to badger the girl that they should try to be parents and only go the adoption route in those cases.  I can think of one right in my county that does this.

It actually sounds like a pretty moderate option to me.  A lot of these fake clinics operate on the basis of volunteers who don't have the credentials to make medical judgments or even provide counseling.
Experience bij!