Brexit and the waning days of the United Kingdom

[crazy canuck]

The minimum wage in the US went from really bad to terrible.  I thought they were raising it in recent years?

[Sheilbh]

The minimum wage in the US went from really bad to terrible.  I thought they were raising it in recent years?

I don't think it's keeping pace with average wages.

[crazy canuck]

The minimum wage in the US went from really bad to terrible.  I thought they were raising it in recent years?

I don't think it's keeping pace with average wages.

Ah, that must it.

[OttoVonBismarck]

The U.S. Federal minimum wage has been $7.25/hr since 2009. But each State also sets its own minimum wage, and within some states specific cities/counties can set their own minimums as well.

[HVC]

Surprised Japan is so low

[PDH]

The U.S. Federal minimum wage has been $7.25/hr since 2009. But each State also sets its own minimum wage, and within some states specific cities/counties can set their own minimums as well.

Yup, it is $14 per hour now in California (for businesses with more than 25 people working for them), and I believe it is slated to go to $15/hour shortly (January 1st 2022 for above businesses, January 1st 2023 for smaller companies).

Locally, places have higher ordinances - in some of the more affluent Bay Area cities, and Berkeley (naturally) it is over $16 per hour now.

[HisMajestyBOB]

I thought the semi conductor shortage did start before the pandemic?

Not in the automotive industry. They reduced forecasts too much in 2020 after Corona hit and then the semiconductor makers shifted capacity away and cannot ramp up easily again. Especially as the type of semiconductors automotive needs are "old" technology, which is not what consumer electronics need - which is a much bigger market than cars.

As someone who is currently car shopping, this whole thing sucks. 

[The Brain]

Sweden doesn't have a minimum wage.

[Zanza]

As someone who is currently car shopping, this whole thing sucks. 

While it will hurt the automotive industry, it is not as bad as it sounds (so far) as it is possible to sell the lower number of cars with much higher margins.

[Josquius]

As things stand a £15 minimum wage is a bit crazily high.
But with brexit and all the price rises going on... It may not be too long before it becomes a perfectly reasonable number.
Sadly I suspect people's perceptions of a sensible level to lag some way behind this.

[Tamas]

As things stand a £15 minimum wage is a bit crazily high.
But with brexit and all the price rises going on... It may not be too long before it becomes a perfectly reasonable number.
Sadly I suspect people's perceptions of a sensible level to lag some way behind this.

And if it got jumped to £15 now it would nicely help inflation too.

We laugh at the far right for living in their crazy bubble but this whole £15 business just reeks of British lefties wanting to be fighting the same fight they enviously watch on US lefties' Twitter feeds.

[Richard Hakluyt]

Setting the minimum wage at a higher rate than the median wage is simply stupid.

[Sheilbh]

We laugh at the far right for living in their crazy bubble but this whole £15 business just reeks of British lefties wanting to be fighting the same fight they enviously watch on US lefties' Twitter feeds.

Yeah I mean it's not the first time - Hackney Council releasing a document that included lots of references to oppressed 'indigenous' communities in a UK context read like something from a weird splinter group from the BNP but had clearly been cut and paste from American progressives

There's a lot of perks to being in America's cultural sphere - but it can cause just an unfiltered flow of content which maybe needs a sense check before applying to the UK.

Edit: Oh no. Just saw my first wild "what Schulz can teach the Labour Party/Starmer" take. We've just got over the Biden wave.

Edit: Also I've been thinking a lot about the 2000 fuel crisis - so I was very happy to see this Guardian piece about it. Turns out it was both worse and more irrational than I remembered:
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/sep/23/autumn-2000-fuel-shortages-uk-standstill-price-protest-panic-buying?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

I've no idea how it actually ended and that doesn't really explain it either, which is a bit idea.

[Sheilbh]

Setting the minimum wage at a higher rate than the median wage is simply stupid.

Yeah - and for context the Living Wage foundation puts the London Living Wage at £10.85 and nationally at £9.50. I believe that's based on analysing living costs. Corbyn campaigned in 2019 for a minimum wage of £10.

But now £15 is apparently the bare minimum to work with Starmer and I genuinely think that's just because $15 is the rallying point for progressives in the US

Separately an update from Peter Foster on the ongoing cakeism in Labour. I don't think Europe will be a big issue in the next election (maybe later) but it does feel like the Lib Dems and Tories have basically honest positions on this. The Lib Dems want a roadmap to re-joining (as do the Greens/SNP/Plaid etc), the Tories basically want to keep a skinny deal just a trade agreement and nothing more (with ongoing future divergence. In both cases basically all the factions agree on that. Labour still want something that has, fundamentally, never been an option which I think is a problem - the only thing all the factions agree on is a type of relationship that does not exist with the EU, unless they invent it for us which seems unlikely:

Peter Foster
@pmdfoster
Fascinating (and telling) discussion being chaired by @CER_Grant at #LabourConference on how Labour would rebuild relations with Europe with @hilarybennmp @lisanandy @JennyChapman ...and how quickly it collapses into 2017-style cakeism /1
So @lisanandy says not realistic that labour campaigns on rejoining customs union and single market...and @JennyChapman wants to rebuild the relationship 'bit by bit'...but doesn't want to engage with the 'ratchet' that leads to a 'Norway for Now' relationship./2
Then @hilarybennmp talks about Ukraine agreement as a template -- but that's an agreement predicated on a state moving towards membership.

And as all three dodge specifics, the discussion collapses into an appeal for "good will and flexibility" from the EU. /3
I get the political sensitivities here, but it is eerily reminiscent of the 2017 discussion and the abject failure to understand the European Commission and how it works....and the trade offs that will be involved. /4
On the upside, as @JennyChapman observes, when the time comes -- if it ever comes -- the "toxicity" around that 2017 conversation will have dissipated. The electorate may be more receptive to trade offs needed for vet deal, mobility chapter...and the benefits they'll bring./5
And then @lisanandy ends with a pledge that the conversation will be honest -- "but never again can we be in a situation where we make those choices without involving the public in those decisions" -- because last time the Party failed to level with its public. ENDS

Rachel Reeves (centrist wing - Shadow Chancellor who had some really interesting/impressive ideas on climate/energy in her speech) sort of seems to have a reasonably realistic policy: operate on the terms of current agreement, try to build more cooperation and relations with EU in that context but freedom of movement is kind of the red-line/barrier of how far that relationship can go (with all the consequences from that). It at least seems more realistic than what Benn, Nandy and Chapman are discussing - though, I'd note that if Reeves is speaking for the leadership that goes against one of Starmer's campaign points which was to "make the case for freedom of movement".

Practically speaking Labour are at their lowest ebb since 1983 and it took 14 years from then before they won power again. There were a lot of messy conferences and shifts on policy in that time. But this week is the first time since Corbyn took over that it has actually felt like Labour is fighting those battles again as opposed to just cosplaying. There have been big factional conflicts on conference floor, votes and fringe plus the problem of a leadership that clearly wants to move in one direction still having to operate within confines defined by the last leadership, while the terms/context of the debate are actually changing around them (as happens when you don't have power).

Edit: On the other hand it seems improving pay and conditions do seem to have an effect - apparently the government has a huge pile-up of 56,000 applicants who want to get an HGV driving licence. So now we all just have to rely on the effective operation of the DVLA to get out of this crisis

[Josquius]

The copy and paste from America is an interesting one as in the past few years I've been seeing the far right indulging in some amazing projection moaning about the left doing this, when in reality it was the right you saw importing American culture war bollocks.

Similarly this image has been built up of the militant remainers looking down their nose on working class people (who can only be uneducated idiots who support brexit of course).

For the longest time it was pure fiction invented by the far right... But lately their stories are actually becoming true. Its bizzare.
I suspect it really shows how much influence the fake news machine is starting to have on the left.