Total War: Warhammer is coming

[katmai]

You've tainted it, and it is TW.

[Lettow77]

It's got four (five if you pre-order!) out of over a dozen factions. They are introducing a new system in which you can only conquer cities of your "nemesis race", doing a lot to undermine sandbox total war gameplay where you paint the map.

We still haven't seen anything about the vampire counts, although we've seen the full roster of the DLC race they evidently are sufficiently far along with to put in the official game trailers but not include in the finished product.

They stated Athel Loren can't be entered, so that rules out any chance of interacting with Wood Elves. Silent on beastmen, which should also be all around the empire and a major force in the Old World that's being depicted.

There's really not much to get excited about.

[jimmy olsen]

It's got four (five if you pre-order!) out of over a dozen factions. They are introducing a new system in which you can only conquer cities of your "nemesis race", doing a lot to undermine sandbox total war gameplay where you paint the map.

You can also conquer members of your own race and you can raze the settlements of everyone else.

As the Empire or the Dwarves, painting the map is definitely not the name of the game in this setting.

Also, we've seen the vampires on the map spreading corruption in Bretonia.

[Lettow77]

 More straightjacketed by the confines of what's "realistic for your faction" than the games that are based on actual history.

Time was you could conquer all Europe as the Aragonese, or sack Cairo as the Scots Ascendant. I remember unifying the British Isles as the picts..with their crossbowmen.

But we wouldn't want the Dwarves to start a new hold in Bretonnia. That wouldn't be realistic.

If this is their tune, what do they plan to do for the Wood Elves, who are basically a one-province wonder whose crowning strategic goal is to stay innawoods?

[jimmy olsen]

More straightjacketed by the confines of what's "realistic for your faction" than the games that are based on actual history.

Time was you could conquer all Europe as the Aragonese, or sack Cairo as the Scots Ascendant. I remember unifying the British Isles as the picts..with their crossbowmen.

But we wouldn't want the Dwarves to start a new hold in Bretonnia. That wouldn't be realistic.

If this is their tune, what do they plan to do for the Wood Elves, who are basically a one-province wonder whose crowning strategic goal is to stay innawoods?

You can liberate the settlements of allies as well.

As for the rest, quests. There's going ti be quests upon quests and that is where the game will succeed or fail.

[Lettow77]

Noted. I will look forward to fighting my own faction and or returning allies' provinces. The game is nothing if goblin peacekeepers can't return occupied Sylvania to its rightful owners, the Von Carsteins.

But, quests? Who plays Total War for the quests?

In fact, who plays Warhammer for the quests?

A bunch of scripted battles and arbitrary requirements sounds like its the opposite of what makes Total War fun.

[Iormlund]

It's got four (five if you pre-order!) out of over a dozen factions. They are introducing a new system in which you can only conquer cities of your "nemesis race", doing a lot to undermine sandbox total war gameplay where you paint the map.

We still haven't seen anything about the vampire counts, although we've seen the full roster of the DLC race they evidently are sufficiently far along with to put in the official game trailers but not include in the finished product.

They stated Athel Loren can't be entered, so that rules out any chance of interacting with Wood Elves. Silent on beastmen, which should also be all around the empire and a major force in the Old World that's being depicted.

There's really not much to get excited about.

That sounds like something easily fixed by a mod, to be honest.

[jimmy olsen]

Bretonians vs. Orks

Looks absolutely beautiful.

https://youtu.be/p_AD4gHVrWU

[jimmy olsen]

Vampire Counts!

https://youtu.be/uj605sogy3I

[Lettow77]

 I wondered what occasioned the lack of TimReporting about the latest updates.

The Bretonnia battle is very odd because it has no knights in it whatsoever, when knights are the core of a Bretonnian force with peasants as a supporting afterthought. It's concerning that the enemy had a legion of mounted peasants who suicided themselves against the orc line far in advance of the main Bretonnian battle line, doubly so as the Bretonnians were on the defense and had a massive ranged advantage with several units of Trebuchets and many longbowmen.

The Vampire Counts reveal has been more overtly troubling, though; the Undead have fatigue and morale for some terrible reason. I assume CA was not willing to make the leap and abandon the system they've been using since Shogun 1.

Either way, we now have zombies that get scared stiff and skeletons that can become dead tired. It's very bad. The fact that they've been very constraining and conservative with how much resurrecting you can do, or that all Undead can run at any time (but it tires them!) would be more concerning if it wasn't for the glaring problem of fatigue/morale.

Of the factions released so far, Vampire Counts are the furthest removed from "traditional" total war, but rather than expanding the mold to accommodate them, they've been lazily shoehorned into it.

They recently announced they'd be greatly simplifying sieges and doing away with 360-degree surrounding of cities, replacing it with a more direct attack on one wall, and that they've widened the streets and ramparts for more room for maneuver. This will help the hobbled AI, but I might have hoped they'd raise the AI to meet its problems rather than lower the bar.

[jimmy olsen]

The Vampire Counts reveal has been more overtly troubling, though; the Undead have fatigue and morale for some terrible reason. I assume CA was not willing to make the leap and abandon the system they've been using since Shogun 1.

Either way, we now have zombies that get scared stiff and skeletons that can become dead tired. It's very bad. The fact that they've been very constraining and conservative with how much resurrecting you can do, or that all Undead can run at any time (but it tires them!) would be more concerning if it wasn't for the glaring problem of fatigue/morale.

You got a link for that? I heard that only the Vampires themselves had morale, not their undead minions.

[Lettow77]

 I don't know how you heard that one- Morale is the cornerstone for Total War's interpretation of the Crumble mechanic.

When their morale is low, instead of routing, they start crumbling.

Fatigue is the cornerstone of Total War's interpretation of Total War's fatigue mechanic.

https://forums.totalwar.com/discussion/169878/info-from-the-vampire-counts-stream/p1

This thread has most of what you need. In this image we can see that Black Guard are less prone to scaring than mere Skeletons and thus crumble much less, which would make sense if we were dealing with another race's elite and standard infantry, but is contrary to how the Vampire Counts have always worked up until now.



Edit: Viewer discretion is advised, but the following is a graphic depiction of spooked, weary bones:

[Queequeg]

lol can i be: kislev

[Lettow77]

 No. Also, they use generic german-esque Empire graphics and have no special units that would distinguish them from being another principality of the Empire.

You may be given the opportunity to buy them in a DLC at some point down the road, maybe.

[jimmy olsen]

Everywhere I look says something similar

https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2016/03/23/total-war-warhammer-preview/

Undead units don't have morale, presumably because they're the unconscious puppets of the necromancer who raised them, so they'll never flee. But they will crumble. It's the perfect verb to describe their performance, crumbling. They're like biscuits assaulted by too-hot tea, their rotten flesh resolving into clots and crumbs.