Yesterday I was taking apart one of the sheds, needed to recondition it, put new roofing-felt and found the 6-8 ft battens were secured by 8 or so 2" screws.
Damn what overkill for tiny pieces of wood, what's it going to be like taking the roof off, I thought; yet it transpired that was just held on by 6 screws fixed to a really weak central roof support, based on the above experience I'd have though the guy would have put literally dozens of screws in all over the place.
The other thing that puzzled me, was every screw was 'over-driven' into the wood by about 2-3mm, so the head was part buried by surrounding wood, is that a good idea, I'd have thought it would weaken the bond between the two pieces of timber. What do you think?
So what's you policy on screw use when building something ?
I can't help but thing the guy used a power tool and put so many screws in on the vissible outside of the shed and somewhat skimpt on the interior , because it looked like he was doing a lot of work to impress the customer.
Personally, I'm less keen on screwing and more likely to hammer away at nailing things. :cool:
I pay someone for these things.
Quote from: Monoriu on June 11, 2013, 08:16:21 AM
I pay someone for these things.
I enjoy doing things that requires some physical effort and an amount of problem solving; a good all-round workout. :)
Quote from: mongers on June 11, 2013, 07:53:54 AM
The other thing that puzzled me, was every screw was 'over-driven' into the wood by about 2-3mm, so the head was part buried by surrounding wood, is that a good idea, I'd have thought it would weaken the bond between the two pieces of timber. What do you think?
It's exactly the opposite of what you thought.
Quote from: Grey Fox on June 11, 2013, 08:29:03 AM
Quote from: mongers on June 11, 2013, 07:53:54 AM
The other thing that puzzled me, was every screw was 'over-driven' into the wood by about 2-3mm, so the head was part buried by surrounding wood, is that a good idea, I'd have thought it would weaken the bond between the two pieces of timber. What do you think?
It's exactly the opposite of what you thought.
I always thought the purpose of counter-sinking the screwheads was so that you could cover them, not to give the structure more stability.
I don't screw, I have a machine to do that for me.
Seriously, every woman who sets up house alone should have a cordless drill/screwdriver combo.
Quote from: merithyn on June 11, 2013, 08:47:48 AM
Quote from: Grey Fox on June 11, 2013, 08:29:03 AM
Quote from: mongers on June 11, 2013, 07:53:54 AM
The other thing that puzzled me, was every screw was 'over-driven' into the wood by about 2-3mm, so the head was part buried by surrounding wood, is that a good idea, I'd have thought it would weaken the bond between the two pieces of timber. What do you think?
It's exactly the opposite of what you thought.
I always thought the purpose of counter-sinking the screwheads was so that you could cover them, not to give the structure more stability.
Yup, my impression as well. Don't want screwheads sticking out.
That might be it but I was always thought that it needs to go 2/3 of the way in(in wood). That's overkill for simply cover.
The last time I built something out of wood was a long time ago. I might have a drill but I don't frequently use it.
edit: -_-
Ideally you want to sink the screw to where the head is flush, but not so deep the head breaks through the fibers on the surface.
If you are going to fill the holes you may need it deeper though, depending on the filler.
Quote from: mongers on June 11, 2013, 07:53:54 AM
The other thing that puzzled me, was every screw was 'over-driven' into the wood by about 2-3mm, so the head was part buried by surrounding wood, is that a good idea, I'd have thought it would weaken the bond between the two pieces of timber. What do you think?
As others have said, they should be flush unless they're going to be filled/covered with something.
QuotePersonally, I'm less keen on screwing and more likely to hammer away at nailing things. :cool:
The nice thing about screws is that they're easily removable but provide considerable structure when they're in. Whether screws or nails are preferable really depends on the purpose of the thing you're trying to build, I'd say.
Counter sink screws, drill pilot holes for screws on finishing projects, always use Robertson screws and fuck Phillips.
Quote from: PRC on June 11, 2013, 11:18:27 AM
Counter sink screws, drill pilot holes for screws on finishing projects, always use Robertson screws and fuck Phillips.
Preach it, brother.
Pilot holes are essential, unless you like wood that's split.
Quote from: PRC on June 11, 2013, 11:18:27 AM
Counter sink screws, drill pilot holes for screws on finishing projects, always use Robertson screws and fuck Phillips.
Amen Brother PRC!
katmai knows all about filler material.
Quote from: Monoriu on June 11, 2013, 08:16:21 AM
I pay someone for these things.
That doesn't seem like you at all. :hmm:
Isnt having just one technique a bit boring?
Long and hard. OH!
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F0.tqn.com%2Fd%2Fanimatedtv%2F1%2F0%2Ff%2Fp%2FfGuyQuagmireArt_v1fa.jpg&hash=2aa16b895138ddadceb4c09b024436763da66600)
Quote from: Ideologue on June 11, 2013, 02:58:22 PM
Quote from: Monoriu on June 11, 2013, 08:16:21 AM
I pay someone for these things.
That doesn't seem like you at all. :hmm:
I suck at physical labour :blush:
Quote from: mongers on June 11, 2013, 07:53:54 AM
Yesterday I was taking apart one of the sheds, needed to recondition it, put new roofing-felt and found the 6-8 ft battens were secured by 8 or so 2" screws.
Damn what overkill for tiny pieces of wood, what's it going to be like taking the roof off, I thought; yet it transpired that was just held on by 6 screws fixed to a really weak central roof support, based on the above experience I'd have though the guy would have put literally dozens of screws in all over the place.
The other thing that puzzled me, was every screw was 'over-driven' into the wood by about 2-3mm, so the head was part buried by surrounding wood, is that a good idea, I'd have thought it would weaken the bond between the two pieces of timber. What do you think?
So what's you policy on screw use when building something ?
I can't help but thing the guy used a power tool and put so many screws in on the vissible outside of the shed and somewhat skimpt on the interior , because it looked like he was doing a lot of work to impress the customer.
Personally, I'm less keen on screwing and more likely to hammer away at nailing things. :cool:
Determined not to let my degree in mechanical engineering go completely to waste...
The purpose of a screw is not to take the force exerted on the structure. The purpose is to join two parts of the structure together letting the friction between the two parts take the force. It relatively easy to pull a screw out by force compared to the force needed to sheer apart the two pieces that are joined.
By your description above I'm thinking the battens are somehow fastened by the screws alone, if it was fastened with only a few screws the forces upon the batten could rip the screw right out of the wood.
The fastening of the rafters to the beam on the other hand uses the second principle of friction. You only need a few screws to keep the pressure between two parts and friction will do the work.
Countersinking a screw will have no effect when the force is perpendicular to the axis of the screw and only possibly a minute effect when the force is along the axis of the screw.
Quote from: DontSayBanana on June 11, 2013, 03:19:56 PM
Long and hard. OH!
Any other forum I've been to, there'd be 3 or 4 comments about how the thread title was misleading by now. On Languish we know better. :D
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on June 11, 2013, 03:42:25 PM
Any other forum I've been to, there'd be 3 or 4 comments about how the thread title was misleading by now. On Languish we know better. :D
Sure. My options were 1) ignore it and make a serious response, or 2) take it and run. I chose the path of most fun. :D
Quote from: The Brain on June 11, 2013, 12:05:56 PM
katmai knows all about filler material.
:pinch: :lmfao:
You make reality tv, don't you? Whole episodes are filler.
I thought he meant cranially.
Quote from: Ideologue on June 12, 2013, 01:12:41 AM
I thought he meant cranially.
I thought he meant anally.
I always think anally.