Abstolutly appealing! :mad:
http://www.economist.com/news/leaders/21571136-politicians-both-right-and-left-could-learn-nordic-countries-next-supermodel?fsrc=scn/tw_ec/the_next_supermodel
QuoteThe next supermodel
Politicians from both right and left could learn from the Nordic countries
Feb 2nd 2013 |From the print edition
SMALLISH countries are often in the vanguard when it comes to reforming government. In the 1980s Britain was out in the lead, thanks to Thatcherism and privatisation. Tiny Singapore has long been a role model for many reformers. Now the Nordic countries are likely to assume a similar role.
That is partly because the four main Nordics—Sweden, Denmark, Norway and Finland—are doing rather well. If you had to be reborn anywhere in the world as a person with average talents and income, you would want to be a Viking. The Nordics cluster at the top of league tables of everything from economic competitiveness to social health to happiness. They have avoided both southern Europe's economic sclerosis and America's extreme inequality. Development theorists have taken to calling successful modernisation "getting to Denmark". Meanwhile a region that was once synonymous with do-it-yourself furniture and Abba has even become a cultural haven, home to "The Killing", Noma and "Angry Birds".
As our special report this week explains, some of this is down to lucky timing: the Nordics cleverly managed to have their debt crisis in the 1990s. But the second reason why the Nordic model is in vogue is more interesting. To politicians around the world—especially in the debt-ridden West—they offer a blueprint of how to reform the public sector, making the state far more efficient and responsive.
From Pippi Longstocking to private schools
The idea of lean Nordic government will come as a shock both to French leftists who dream of socialist Scandinavia and to American conservatives who fear that Barack Obama is bent on "Swedenisation". They are out of date. In the 1970s and 1980s the Nordics were indeed tax-and-spend countries. Sweden's public spending reached 67% of GDP in 1993. Astrid Lindgren, the inventor of Pippi Longstocking, was forced to pay more than 100% of her income in taxes. But tax-and-spend did not work: Sweden fell from being the fourth-richest country in the world in 1970 to the 14th in 1993.
Since then the Nordics have changed course—mainly to the right. Government's share of GDP in Sweden, which has dropped by around 18 percentage points, is lower than France's and could soon be lower than Britain's. Taxes have been cut: the corporate rate is 22%, far lower than America's. The Nordics have focused on balancing the books. While Mr Obama and Congress dither over entitlement reform, Sweden has reformed its pension system (see Free exchange). Its budget deficit is 0.3% of GDP; America's is 7%.
On public services the Nordics have been similarly pragmatic. So long as public services work, they do not mind who provides them. Denmark and Norway allow private firms to run public hospitals. Sweden has a universal system of school vouchers, with private for-profit schools competing with public schools. Denmark also has vouchers—but ones that you can top up. When it comes to choice, Milton Friedman would be more at home in Stockholm than in Washington, DC.
All Western politicians claim to promote transparency and technology. The Nordics can do so with more justification than most. The performance of all schools and hospitals is measured. Governments are forced to operate in the harsh light of day: Sweden gives everyone access to official records. Politicians are vilified if they get off their bicycles and into official limousines. The home of Skype and Spotify is also a leader in e-government: you can pay your taxes with an SMS message.
This may sound like enhanced Thatcherism, but the Nordics also offer something for the progressive left by proving that it is possible to combine competitive capitalism with a large state: they employ 30% of their workforce in the public sector, compared with an OECD average of 15%. They are stout free-traders who resist the temptation to intervene even to protect iconic companies: Sweden let Saab go bankrupt and Volvo is now owned by China's Geeley. But they also focus on the long term—most obviously through Norway's $600 billion sovereign-wealth fund—and they look for ways to temper capitalism's harsher effects. Denmark, for instance, has a system of "flexicurity" that makes it easier for employers to sack people but provides support and training for the unemployed, and Finland organises venture-capital networks.
The sour part of the smorgasbord
The new Nordic model is not perfect. Public spending as a proportion of GDP in these countries is still higher than this newspaper would like, or indeed than will be sustainable. Their levels of taxation still encourage entrepreneurs to move abroad: London is full of clever young Swedes. Too many people—especially immigrants—live off benefits. The pressures that have forced their governments to cut spending, such as growing global competition, will force more change. The Nordics are bloated compared with Singapore, and they have not focused enough on means-testing benefits.
All the same, ever more countries should look to the Nordics. Western countries will hit the limits of big government, as Sweden did. When Angela Merkel worries that the European Union has 7% of the world's population but half of its social spending, the Nordics are part of the answer. They also show that EU countries can be genuine economic successes. And as the Asians introduce welfare states they too will look to the Nordics: Norway is a particular focus of the Chinese.
The main lesson to learn from the Nordics is not ideological but practical. The state is popular not because it is big but because it works. A Swede pays tax more willingly than a Californian because he gets decent schools and free health care. The Nordics have pushed far-reaching reforms past unions and business lobbies. The proof is there. You can inject market mechanisms into the welfare state to sharpen its performance. You can put entitlement programmes on sound foundations to avoid beggaring future generations. But you need to be willing to root out corruption and vested interests. And you must be ready to abandon tired orthodoxies of the left and right and forage for good ideas across the political spectrum. The world will be studying the Nordic model for years to come.
When the US shrinks down to just the population of nyc, sure I could see easy adoption of many of those things.
Quote from: garbon on February 02, 2013, 06:07:18 AM
When the US shrinks down to just the population of nyc, sure I could see easy adoption of many of those things.
I don't follow. The Union of Socialist States of America is a federal republic. Many of the states are smaller than Sweden.
Easier to corral the punier populations of the Nordic countries.
Quote from: garbon on February 02, 2013, 07:27:30 AM
Easier to corral the punier populations of the Nordic countries.
I don't believe in BMI.
Quote from: garbon on February 02, 2013, 06:07:18 AM
When the US shrinks down to just the population of nyc, sure I could see easy adoption of many of those things.
Which of their policies is directly dependent on population size? You always read that it does not work because the US is such a big country but that alone cannot be the reason why these policies don't work in the USA. It must be some other factors....
Especially since Sweden is not exactly like The Netherlands or England when it comes to population density.
Quote from: Zanza on February 02, 2013, 04:15:52 PM
Quote from: garbon on February 02, 2013, 06:07:18 AM
When the US shrinks down to just the population of nyc, sure I could see easy adoption of many of those things.
Which of their policies is directly dependent on population size? You always read that it does not work because the US is such a big country but that alone cannot be the reason why these policies don't work in the USA. It must be some other factors....
I think all of the listed below are harder to do when you have much larger and geographically dispersed populace. And you're right, part of it is political will (and culture) but then again when you have such a large populace, like I said - harder to get everyone in line.
Universal system of school vouchers
Universal standard of measurements for all schools and hospitals
Politicians vilified if taking limousines over bikes
Paying taxes via SMS message
Over 30% of workforce employed in public sector
Resisting temptation to intervene to save companies
Flexicurity
They are ethnically homogeneous.
Quote from: The Brain on February 02, 2013, 07:44:46 PM
Source?
http://languish.org/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=14 (http://languish.org/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=14)
Quote from: Razgovory on February 02, 2013, 09:24:41 PM
Quote from: Scipio on February 02, 2013, 06:22:54 PM
They are ethnically homogeneous.
So?
It's a lot easier to get people who are like you in significant ways to agree to do things in the same way.
So opposition to socialism is rooted in ethnic intolerance? Good to know.
:lol:
Skip don't want to share with black people.
Raz, what you consider to be an obvious and inescapable inference of Skippy's statement actually has virtually no relationship to it.
Fun little factoid i picked up from the article (actually a series of articles): 9% of Sweden's working age population is collecting some form of disability and at any one point in time 6% of Swedish workers are home sick.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on February 03, 2013, 01:50:29 PM
Fun little factoid i picked up from the article (actually a series of articles): 9% of Sweden's working age population is collecting some form of disability and at any one point in time 6% of Swedish workers are home sick.
Well, it is pretty cold up there, and there's a lot of ice on the walkways.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on February 03, 2013, 01:50:29 PM
Fun little factoid i picked up from the article (actually a series of articles): 9% of Sweden's working age population is collecting some form of disability and at any one point in time 6% of Swedish workers are home sick.
Repainting the house, fixing the boat for the summer etc. Lots of stuff to do.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on February 03, 2013, 01:50:29 PM
Raz, what you consider to be an obvious and inescapable inference of Skippy's statement actually has virtually no relationship to it.
Fun little factoid i picked up from the article (actually a series of articles): 9% of Sweden's working age population is collecting some form of disability and at any one point in time 6% of Swedish workers are home sick.
Actually I really don't know what he was getting at. Skips statement seems to preclude any economic and goverment system for a country that isn't homogenous.
Quote from: Razgovory on February 03, 2013, 04:04:45 PM
Actually I really don't know what he was getting at.
I see. So when you post "Good to know," it means "I don't know what you're getting at."
I'll try to keep that in mind, but it would be a lot easier if you just spoke English like a normal person.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on February 03, 2013, 04:11:04 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on February 03, 2013, 04:04:45 PM
Actually I really don't know what he was getting at.
I see. So when you post "Good to know," it means "I don't know what you're getting at."
I'll try to keep that in mind, but it would be a lot easier if you just spoke English like a normal person.
Eh, I was kinda ribbing him and Dorsey made a very similar argument though his was more overtly racist.
Quote from: Scipio on February 02, 2013, 07:21:36 PM
Quote from: The Brain on February 02, 2013, 07:07:54 PM
Quote from: Scipio on February 02, 2013, 06:22:54 PM
They are ethnically homogeneous.
Who?
Fucking Swedes.
For the most part.
As opposed to Americans.
Oh how Slargos would laugh.
Sweden has a pretty comparable percentage of its population foreign born as the USA.
Slargos would also differentiate between "Swedes" and "people living in Sweden" however.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on February 02, 2013, 11:36:27 PM
:lol:
I thought this article would make you happy when you read it. Weren't you one of the big school voucher people? This article suggests we should all have them.
Quote from: Razgovory on February 03, 2013, 04:04:45 PM
Quote from: Admiral Yi on February 03, 2013, 01:50:29 PM
Raz, what you consider to be an obvious and inescapable inference of Skippy's statement actually has virtually no relationship to it.
Fun little factoid i picked up from the article (actually a series of articles): 9% of Sweden's working age population is collecting some form of disability and at any one point in time 6% of Swedish workers are home sick.
Actually I really don't know what he was getting at. Skips statement seems to preclude any economic and goverment system for a country that isn't homogenous.
And then you wonder why Eastern Europeans are such big fans of ethnic cleansing.
I kinda love this argument (even if took a while to unfold):
Americans: We don't want to be socialist as we would end up as shitty as Sweden
The Economist: Well, actually, Sweden is better than you
Americans: Ok, but that's because they don't have blacks
:hmm:
Quote from: Martinus on February 04, 2013, 02:27:54 AM
The Economist: Well, actually, Sweden is better than you
That's because Brits and Swedes both don't care about freedom. :P
Quote from: Scipio on February 02, 2013, 10:35:03 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on February 02, 2013, 09:24:41 PM
Quote from: Scipio on February 02, 2013, 06:22:54 PM
They are ethnically homogeneous.
So?
It's a lot easier to get people who are like you in significant ways to agree to do things in the same way.
Translation: we have black people. :ph34r:
Quote from: Admiral Yi on February 03, 2013, 01:50:29 PM
Raz, what you consider to be an obvious and inescapable inference of Skippy's statement actually has virtually no relationship to it.
Bullshit.
Quote from: The Brain on February 02, 2013, 05:34:08 AM
Sweden has a universal system of school vouchers, with private for-profit schools competing with public schools. Denmark also has vouchers—but ones that you can top up.
We do, but the voucher system has completely undermined the public school system and are at the moment turning the public schools into a school for 2nd class children i.e. the physcially disabled, the mediocre, the children with special needs (e.g. dyslectic kids) etc. Not to mention the rampant grade inflation within the private owned schools (come to us, we'll give you good grades, wheter you deserve them or not! ) or even outright bribes to children (come to us, you get a "free" laptop)
No the Swedish school system has been in a decline ever since the economic crisis in the early nineties.
Quote from: Ape on February 05, 2013, 05:10:21 PM
We do, but the voucher system has completely undermined the public school system and are at the moment turning the public schools into a school for 2nd class children i.e. the physcially disabled, the mediocre, the children with special needs (e.g. dyslectic kids) etc. Not to mention the rampant grade inflation within the private owned schools (come to us, we'll give you good grades, wheter you deserve them or not! ) or even outright bribes to children (come to us, you get a "free" laptop)
No the Swedish school system has been in a decline ever since the economic crisis in the early nineties.
The Swedish public schools or the schools in general? :hmm:
Anyway the US schools have been in a decline ever since July 5th 1776 it seems like.
Our universities are pretty good. :showoff:
Quote from: garbon on February 05, 2013, 09:53:41 PM
Our universities are pretty good. :showoff:
Higher education is a bit of an abortion these days but yeah our main Universities are still carrying the torch :)
Quote from: Ape on February 05, 2013, 05:10:21 PM
We do, but the voucher system has completely undermined the public school system and are at the moment turning the public schools into a school for 2nd class children i.e. the physcially disabled, the mediocre, the children with special needs (e.g. dyslectic kids) etc. Not to mention the rampant grade inflation within the private owned schools (come to us, we'll give you good grades, wheter you deserve them or not! ) or even outright bribes to children (come to us, you get a "free" laptop)
The British version of school vouchers includes a 'premium', so schools get more money for disabled children, children with special needs, children from poor backgrounds etc. The idea is to avoid social dumping. We'll also keep external exam boards and they're regulated. Exams are normally marked externally in the UK (often by other schools I think) and are moderated externally. So a big problem we had was exam boards (who sell their product to schools) basically showing teachers how to teach the exam. But hopefully that can be addressed, generally I'm a fan of the reforms - though there are issues.
I do find the American reaction a bit odd though. We're too big and homogenous for socialism! We're too big and homogenous for liberalism! :lol:
Maybe you mean heterogeneous?
Quote from: Sheilbh on February 05, 2013, 10:02:42 PM
I do find the American reaction a bit odd though. We're too big and homogenous for socialism! We're too big and homogenous for liberalism! :lol:
That is the knee jerk reaction whenever somebody says something good about the Scandis. Nevermind that most of the ideas in that article are ideas alot of Americans have supported.
Quote from: Valmy on February 05, 2013, 09:57:23 PM
Quote from: garbon on February 05, 2013, 09:53:41 PM
Our universities are pretty good. :showoff:
Higher education is a bit of an abortion these days but yeah our main Universities are still carrying the torch :)
Lololololololololol ok.
Quote from: Ideologue on February 05, 2013, 10:09:23 PM
Quote from: Valmy on February 05, 2013, 09:57:23 PM
Quote from: garbon on February 05, 2013, 09:53:41 PM
Our universities are pretty good. :showoff:
Higher education is a bit of an abortion these days but yeah our main Universities are still carrying the torch :)
Lololololololololol ok.
Have you attended one of our main universities? :unsure:
Yes.
Oh, the Trojans?
Stop that. I went to the flagship university of my state and one of the oldest law schools in the U.S.
If you want to say that Ivies, Stanford, Chicago, and and two or three of the UCLA system schools are pretty good, whatever, but "our" universities include a lot more than ten or twelve top schools that actually provide value (or, rather, signal value--even Ivy League educations aren't worth very much in and of themselves).
And taken altogether "our universities" are in trouble deep.
I don't think I was talking about law schools but rather universities in general. Additionally I'm not sure your USC does particularly well in world rankings - though I've never looked.
Also I think you might mean the UC system. :P
Quote from: garbon
I don't think I was talking about law schools but rather universities in general. Additionally I'm not sure your USC does particularly well in world rankings - though I've never looked.
I doubt it does, it sucks. But we're both confusing the issue. (Also, I was talking about universities in general too--some Ivies don't have an LS, Princeton doesn't, at least.)
Look, when people talk about primary and secondary schools, they're not talking about the third best public school in the country and its peers, even if you happened to go there and are understandably proud of doing so. They're talking about the system as a whole. Likewise, when people talk about the American post-secondary education system, I've always understood it to mean Harvard, Yale, Stanford... and the hundreds or thousands of other, shittier universities that dot our country like human landfills. After decades of open admissions, tuition inflation due to bungled government intervention, tenure turned to a shield for the lazy and inept, preposterously wasteful physical plant improvements and empire building, and most importantly declining intrinsic and signaling value of their degrees on the market, our universities are not doing terribly well.
Quote from: garbon on February 05, 2013, 10:41:21 PM
Also I think you might mean the UC system. :P
Oops. :D
Quote from: Ideologue on February 05, 2013, 10:49:27 PM
Quote from: garbon
I don't think I was talking about law schools but rather universities in general. Additionally I'm not sure your USC does particularly well in world rankings - though I've never looked.
I doubt it does, it sucks. But we're both confusing the issue. (Also, I was talking about universities in general too--some Ivies don't have an LS, Princeton doesn't, at least.)
Look, when people talk about primary and secondary schools, they're not talking about the third best public school in the country and its peers, even if you happened to go there and are understandably proud of doing so. They're talking about the system as a whole. Likewise, when people talk about the American post-secondary education system, I've always understood it to mean Harvard, Yale, Stanford... and the hundreds or thousands of other, shittier universities that dot our country like human landfills. After decades of open admissions, tuition inflation due to bungled government intervention, tenure turned to a shield for the lazy and inept, preposterously wasteful physical plant improvements and empire building, and most importantly declining intrinsic and signaling value of their degrees on the market, our universities are not doing terribly well.
I think that's why I agree with what Valm said. System is a mess but we still have a lot of good main universities.
Quote from: Sheilbh on February 05, 2013, 10:02:42 PM
The British version of school vouchers includes a 'premium', so schools get more money for disabled children, children with special needs, children from poor backgrounds etc. The idea is to avoid social dumping. We'll also keep external exam boards and they're regulated. Exams are normally marked externally in the UK (often by other schools I think) and are moderated externally. So a big problem we had was exam boards (who sell their product to schools) basically showing teachers how to teach the exam. But hopefully that can be addressed, generally I'm a fan of the reforms - though there are issues.
I do find the American reaction a bit odd though. We're too big and homogenous for socialism! We're too big and homogenous for liberalism! :lol:
Exams aren:t marked by other schools are they? They:re marked by the exam board. Or is that SATS? Not sure how they:re done.
I hate the British system, its way too focussed on exams. Very little gets actually learned in British schools due to them only caring about tests.
Exams in general are a pretty outdated way of approaching education. Back in the day when books were rare and cramming knowledge in your head was a much more valuable skill they had some validity, with the internet those days are long gone though. There does tend to be a bit of a correlation between doing well in exams and actually being clever/hard working but its not a perfect one, exams have little relationship to the real world generally.
Quote from: Valmy on February 05, 2013, 09:51:27 PM
Quote from: Ape on February 05, 2013, 05:10:21 PM
We do, but the voucher system has completely undermined the public school system and are at the moment turning the public schools into a school for 2nd class children i.e. the physcially disabled, the mediocre, the children with special needs (e.g. dyslectic kids) etc. Not to mention the rampant grade inflation within the private owned schools (come to us, we'll give you good grades, wheter you deserve them or not! ) or even outright bribes to children (come to us, you get a "free" laptop)
No the Swedish school system has been in a decline ever since the economic crisis in the early nineties.
The Swedish public schools or the schools in general? :hmm:
Both, we now have for the first time since the thirties kids that leave 9th grade without being able to read and write (few, but still they exist) wich is mainly due to savings into special classes that kids with reading or some other kind of learning disorder need to be able to learn at the same rate as other kids. And it is escalating and has spread into other subjects as well, many kids that finish 9th grade can't place the european contries or capitals anymore on a blank map.
Which has lead our current school minister (who is an complete idiot btw) to come to the wrong conclusion that we need discipline in school. Which we don't, we need more teachers and we need a smaller workload on the teachers, as it is they have to be theraptists, teachers and administrators at the same time.
Now don't get me wrong there are some really outstanding private schools in Sweden, in the town I live in, the best 10-12th grade school is a private one owned by a teachers collective (now I hear all yanks screaming: Communism! :D ). On the other hand the absolutely worst one is also a private one. But the main problem is that all the private schools are eroding the public shools of funds that ensures that the better and brighter kids leave for private schools leaving the mediocre or disabled even further behind.
Employee owned companies are the antithesis of Communism. :)
Quote from: Ape on February 06, 2013, 11:37:01 AM
Now don't get me wrong there are some really outstanding private schools in Sweden, in the town I live in, the best 10-12th grade school is a private one owned by a teachers collective (now I hear all yanks screaming: Communism! :D ). On the other hand the absolutely worst one is also a private one. But the main problem is that all the private schools are eroding the public shools of funds that ensures that the better and brighter kids leave for private schools leaving the mediocre or disabled even further behind.
Heh no we have plenty of employee owned companies. We actually like that setup, when the employees have more of a stake in the company they work harder...or so the theory goes. Anyway thanks for the feedback this confirms my concerns about the impact of school vouchers.
Quote from: Ape on February 06, 2013, 11:37:01 AM
Quote from: Valmy on February 05, 2013, 09:51:27 PM
Quote from: Ape on February 05, 2013, 05:10:21 PM
We do, but the voucher system has completely undermined the public school system and are at the moment turning the public schools into a school for 2nd class children i.e. the physcially disabled, the mediocre, the children with special needs (e.g. dyslectic kids) etc. Not to mention the rampant grade inflation within the private owned schools (come to us, we'll give you good grades, wheter you deserve them or not! ) or even outright bribes to children (come to us, you get a "free" laptop)
No the Swedish school system has been in a decline ever since the economic crisis in the early nineties.
The Swedish public schools or the schools in general? :hmm:
Both, we now have for the first time since the thirties kids that leave 9th grade without being able to read and write (few, but still they exist) wich is mainly due to savings into special classes that kids with reading or some other kind of learning disorder need to be able to learn at the same rate as other kids. And it is escalating and has spread into other subjects as well, many kids that finish 9th grade can't place the european contries or capitals anymore on a blank map.
Which has lead our current school minister (who is an complete idiot btw) to come to the wrong conclusion that we need discipline in school. Which we don't, we need more teachers and we need a smaller workload on the teachers, as it is they have to be theraptists, teachers and administrators at the same time.
Now don't get me wrong there are some really outstanding private schools in Sweden, in the town I live in, the best 10-12th grade school is a private one owned by a teachers collective (now I hear all yanks screaming: Communism! :D ). On the other hand the absolutely worst one is also a private one. But the main problem is that all the private schools are eroding the public shools of funds that ensures that the better and brighter kids leave for private schools leaving the mediocre or disabled even further behind.
We have a variant of your system that would seem to address your problem with private schools. The Province funds all public schools based on student population. Private schools also get a per child subsidy but it is a small fraction of the contribution public schools recieve.
However, our model has different problems. Students may attend the school of their choice and and so schools compete for those students...er funding dollars. Good thing you might say. The very thing a voucher type system should encourage. But of course the knowledge of the consumer is imperfect. Some schools become preferred not because of the qaulity of the education they will provide but because of the neighbourhood in which they are located. As a result schools in the City's more affluent areas are jammed to capacity (and beyond) while schools in poorer areas have suffered a flight of students and are closing because they can no longer afford to operate.
After about a decade of this approach we are facing significant overcrowding issues in public school classrooms.
Given your situation, the great irony is that the private school system which didnt get the government subsidy becomes the big winner because there is so much demand from people fleeing the overcrowded public school system. Here private schools consistently top the list of school rankings in the province.
I dont know who Ape is, but apparently he doesnt know what he is talking about when it comes to swedish schools. He seems to be going through the talking points for the left wing opposition here though.
I don't know who you are either.
Quote from: Tyr on February 05, 2013, 11:07:39 PM
I hate the British system, its way too focussed on exams. Very little gets actually learned in British schools due to them only caring about tests.
I disagree. As Ian Leslie recently pointed out there are very respected, modern academics in the US especially who argue that knowledge is a precondition for 'skills'. So you need to learn things before you can learn skills (something I think our curriculum has the wrong way round). They also suggest that tests are a good way to assess knowledge but also inspire pupils to do better than they do on coursework. They're not overly ideological and aren't always sure about Gove's policies, but I think his grounding's pretty solid. Here's one response to his recent speech:
http://www.danielwillingham.com/1/post/2013/02/the-science-in-goves-speech.html
As I say the UK's current education reforms are inspired by Sweden's. They're different in that they do try to address the issues Ape mentions (the pupil premium), but also the money can't go to private schools - yet.
Quote from: Bluebook on February 06, 2013, 05:25:46 PM
I dont know who Ape is, but apparently he doesnt know what he is talking about when it comes to swedish schools. He seems to be going through the talking points for the left wing opposition here though.
Who the fuck are you?
And no I do know what I am talking about. I am a teacher.
Quote from: Ape on February 06, 2013, 08:12:01 PM
Quote from: Bluebook on February 06, 2013, 05:25:46 PM
I dont know who Ape is, but apparently he doesnt know what he is talking about when it comes to swedish schools. He seems to be going through the talking points for the left wing opposition here though.
Who the fuck are you?
And no I do know what I am talking about. I am a teacher.
:lol:
So you are a member of the most retarded profession in Sweden that hasn't attracted a bright person since the 70s? You are a left wing nut who wouldn't know good education if it took a dump on your face.
ABBAtard fight!! :w00t:
Quote from: Ape on February 06, 2013, 08:12:01 PM
And no I do know what I am talking about. I am a teacher.
:secret: So are Tim and Josquius.