Review on RPS:
http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2011/12/06/wot-i-think-achtung-panzer-operation-star/
Doesn't look too bad. Anyone tried this?
Very Pretty.
Trying to find details, but I can't...is multi-player supported?
Well, broke down.
I guess this was what Combat Mission: Campaigns was supposed to be. You have your units, move them Platoon-wise across an operational map and if you meet an enemy the battle is played out. Game covers fighting near Kharkov in Feb/Mar 1943.
Only that the maps are rather large. In my first attempt I had an infantry platoon and an infantry gun attack a square from two different "corners" and it took me almost 15 minutes to bring the gun anywhere near the infantry platoon.
The uncertainty about enemy strength and movement is interesting, as you don't quite know what opponents you will have in any given battle. Fresh reserves? Depleted units on the retreat?
Anyways, I've started the scenario for the 2nd SS Panzer who have to force a breakthrough. Scenario length is 10 turns, and I think 1 turn is one hour? Each turn can have any number of tactical battles. Combat is real time pausable. Not sure I'm always happy with pathfinding (e.g. StuGs trying to get past buildings), but I've seen worse; and your units have some bit of autonomy (think, again, Combat Mission). Tactical combat will typically feature several platoons, so small scale.
I think the engine would lend itself very well to a Battle of the Bulge setting.
Anyways, here's two SdKfz with SS Pioniere and a StuG advancing over a field strewn with still warm Ivans.
All SdKfz's have different unit numbers on their hull. It's a small detail, but a nice touch.
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg17.imageshack.us%2Fimg17%2F2264%2Fadvancek.jpg&hash=3c517f8e64e9267d0cc785053981de8c7206dbe4)
This was not part of my brilliant plan. :blush:
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg853.imageshack.us%2Fimg853%2F37%2Fdeadpeople.jpg&hash=2cf10ee3b5e6072b1476e493d7579863a28e753c)
Doctor! Doctor! Can't you see I'm burning burning?
Looks pretty good, worth it?
Can't say yet. Feels like Combat Mission, tactically, with some campaigning thrown in (moving battalions/platoons around on an operational map, replenishing/resting units). Also, as the campaigns are dynamic, every encounter will be a little bit different. One time you may run into a lonely rifle brigade, another time into tanks and arty. So far I'm enjoying it, though. I'm not a strategic mastermind, however. :P
Read the review I linked - it covers most points.
Are there other units on your side you can't control? One infantry gun + one platoon sounds like a pretty meager battle.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on December 08, 2011, 01:29:33 PM
Are there other units on your side you can't control? One infantry gun + one platoon sounds like a pretty meager battle.
Well, it depends on what units you have nearby.
The game's strat map is divided into squares. Each square holds a platoon or brigade or company, depending on unit type. Combat happens, when a unit from one side tries to enter a square occupied by a unit from the other side. The attacker can actually attack with units from more than one square. However, the defender also has access to adjacent units.
The wholw skirmish map looks something like this. Each letter is a square on the strat map. X is the combat square. A is squares with attacker units, D is squares with defender units. O is empty.
OOD
AXD
AAO
In this case the attacker has 3 units on the attack, the defender also (one in the X, and the two Ds). You won't see superhuge battles with hundreds of tanks, but small scale unit action representing bits of the whole battle. If you have attacks along several squares during one turn, this would represent several small combats that take place simultaneously, and if a unit can take part in two different skirmishes you will have to economize, I guess.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on December 08, 2011, 01:29:33 PM
Are there other units on your side you can't control? One infantry gun + one platoon sounds like a pretty meager battle.
well, that's much better on this scale than the micro-hell you can found in the CM games.
Well in my recent battle I had four platoons of halftracks with engineers and a platoon of 4 StuGs. It was very manageable. The maps are HUGE, though, so there's a lot of room for maneuver and recon/probing is actually useful.
Tamas, why is your English turning to shit? :lol:
Quote from: Admiral Yi on December 08, 2011, 02:18:36 PM
Tamas, why is your English turning to shit? :lol:
I am tired :P
Quote from: Syt on December 08, 2011, 01:54:26 PM
Well in my recent battle I had four platoons of halftracks with engineers and a platoon of 4 StuGs. It was very manageable. The maps are HUGE, though, so there's a lot of room for maneuver and recon/probing is actually useful.
Do you control the tanks/halftracks individually, or as a platoon?
I played the first incarnation, was bored to death when searching for an enemy platoon or two on those huge maps.
Quote from: Kleves on December 08, 2011, 03:58:00 PM
Quote from: Syt on December 08, 2011, 01:54:26 PM
Well in my recent battle I had four platoons of halftracks with engineers and a platoon of 4 StuGs. It was very manageable. The maps are HUGE, though, so there's a lot of room for maneuver and recon/probing is actually useful.
Do you control the tanks/halftracks individually, or as a platoon?
Individually, but infantry squads as one unit (though the scale is 1:1, i.e. each soldier is represented).
I'm not quite happy with the pathfinding, though I guess it'll mean I need to babysit my troops some more.
I asked StuGs in the battle above to move to cover between buildings. Two of them crashed into the buildings immobilizing themselves.
Also, sometimes single soldiers of a squad go a bit astray and end up 30m or so from their squad - though you might argue that this can happen in combat.
Quote from: szmik on December 08, 2011, 04:40:41 PM
I played the first incarnation, was bored to death when searching for an enemy platoon or two on those huge maps.
Actually, I find that intriguing, because it adds suspense and forces you to recon and be on your toes. The Eastern Front wasn't an unbroken line of men and tanks from the Baltic to the Black Sea.
How long do the tactical battles take?
So, Syt, recommended?
I've owned Achtung Panzer: Kharkov for about a year and haven't really touched it. :blush:
Quote from: Kleves on December 20, 2011, 05:37:39 PM
So, Syt, recommended?
I ahven't really continued playing, what with The Old Republic being out. :blush:
Quote from: Syt on December 22, 2011, 12:53:05 PM
Quote from: Kleves on December 20, 2011, 05:37:39 PM
So, Syt, recommended?
I ahven't really continued playing, what with The Old Republic being out. :blush:
Looking at this, but on the fence.
Haven't played recently. I would need to patch the game, I guess, which is a bit - cumbersome. Download patch, install it to a special directory, import it from within the game as mod or some such. The interface is kinda cryptic as well.
A plus of the game is its campaign persistence - losses, battlefields etc. However, you usually have up to three units per side participating in battles on huge terrain which makes it feel rather smallscale. YMMV.
I'll probably pull the trigger on it. Havent really seen a bad review.
It appears very focused and not as broad as CM. The user vids I've seen look real good.
Holy thread necromancy, Batman!
I'm currently in a bit of a wargaming mood, so I decided to give Mius Front, the successor to Operation Star, a try. Played the tutorials, and then thought I might want to give Operation Star another try for comparison. Apparently they updated their interface at some point, because symbols make more sense now, and there's actually tool tips telling you what each button does.
I got into turn three of a "Defending Kharkiv" (one of the DLCs) campaign on stream yesterday and actually had quite some fun.
The uncertainty going into each combat is quite interesting. You will have a rough idea where the enemy might be, or what their equipment is (or not), and are left to your own devices. My first skirmish had my recon unit decimated because they ran into a group of T-34s. A later one had me decimate Soviet infantry when they tried to take the woods my PzGren company was holding. And one attack had me going nearly unopposed from objective to objective (you still approach carefully, because you have no idea what you into in the woods) - talk about wasted artillery assets.
Combat still feels mostly small scale and intimate, I think Mius Front and Tank Warfare: Tunisia1943 rectify that a bit.
The interface between turns where you repair/reinforce your units remains weird, though.
Interesting. Thanks.
I've had Mius on my Steam wishlist forever, but so far I haven't felt like pulling the trigger. I probably won't now either, but interesting.
It did have some frustrating bits. I ordered one SdKfz to cross at a frozen bit of river. The doofus took a bad angle and drove into the river, losing the vehicle. Another SdKfz did the same at a different crossing. Though I guess in the pitch black Russian winter night it's somewhat excusable.
While reading the HistWar review over on Wargamer: https://www.wargamer.com/articles/accuracy-vs-overkill-an-overview-of-histwar-napoleon/
The reviewer is amazed at some of the detail in the game, and it made me think of this game again, because it can be similarly insane.
Each shot at a vehicle is tracked and you can look at the ricochets/penetration and what was damaged (if anything), with arrows showing you all hits. Destroyed vehicles may trundle on for a bit. I once took out a KV-I and it kept rolling two hundred meters till it ran into the river bank. And I thought I had come across a glitch when I noticed that weapons visuals and sounds were out of sync. Nope, just the game accounting for the time it takes for the sound to reach where your camera is. Go right up to the weapon and all is fine.