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Sergio Leone has created the two top entries in the spaghetti western genre:

The Good, The Bad and the Ugly, culmination of the Dollar Trilogy that propelled Eastwood to stardom.

Once Upon a Time in the West, the epic about a killer and a man seeking revenge.


GBU: the movie has more action and is a lot more lighthearted. It's a series of episodic scenes culminating in what is probably the best shootout scene in westerns.

OUATITW: Much more focus on the characters and their relation to one another: Charles Bronson as Harmonica, the nameless stranger seeking revenge. Jason Robards as Cheyenne, the romantic outlaw caught between the lines. Claudia Cardinale as the saintly whore. Henry Fonda as Frank, the coldblooded killer.

I think they're both pretty close in quality, but I give Once Upon . . . the edge - the story is more complex, the characters more interesting. It's slower, more deliberately paced - kind of like the 2001 - A Space Odyssey of spaghetti western. Someone called it "an opera of violence" and that's pretty spot on in my opinion.

Quote from: Syt on June 28, 2011, 01:21:52 PMClaudia Cardinale

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That said, GB&U was the better film.

GBU is the better spaghetti western.

TGtBatU is the better Spaghetti Western, as I understand the term, but WUaTitW is the better movie.

The latter is better classed with Leone's Once Upon a Time in Americaas an ode to an art form and isn't as light-hearted (as you note) nor as deliberately cheaply made/anachronistic as the movies I think of as spaghetti westerns (like Navajo Joe or the Hill and Spencer movies).

Quote from: grumbler on June 28, 2011, 01:42:42 PM
TGtBatU is the better Spaghetti Western, as I understand the term, but WUaTitW is the better movie.

That's a good point.  :hmm:

Supposedly, Leone was "forced" to make the movie - he wanted to do Once Upon A Time In America, but the studio insisted he make another Western first.

TGTBTU was both a better western and a better movie. Once upon a time was a good movie but definitely overindulgent in parts(the opening scene with the flies for one).

Quote from: Peter Wiggin on June 28, 2011, 01:56:54 PM
TGTBTU was both a better western and a better movie. Once upon a time was a good movie but definitely overindulgent in parts(the opening scene with the flies for one).

:blink:

The opening scene is great.

Quote from: Peter Wiggin on June 28, 2011, 01:56:54 PM
TGTBTU was both a better western and a better movie. Once upon a time was a good movie but definitely overindulgent in parts(the opening scene with the flies for one).

I rather enjoyed the over-indulgences, but can see why others wouldn't.  I feel the same way about Once Upon a Time in America and Miller's crossing.

Other: For a few Dollars More

There seems to be a family resemblance

L.

Once Upon A Time In America is a snorefest only broken up by multiple rape scenes.

Quote from: The Brain on June 28, 2011, 05:09:20 PM
Once Upon A Time In America is a snorefest only broken up by multiple rape scenes.

Yup.

My avatar would suggest The Good, the Bad and the Ugly but I actually think Once Upon a Time in the West is the better movie overall. They're both amazing, but two things edge OUTW out as the leader for me:

1. Henry Fonda is a very good villain, better than Lee Van Cleef which says a lot because in TGTB&TU he's one of the best villains ever.

2. Charles Bronson in OUTW as the protagonist slightly edges out Clint Eastwood in TGTB&TU.

I think Eli Wallach is better than Jason Robards as the third, ambiguous anti-hero, but with OUTW having the better lead villain and the better main protagonist I think it wins out overall.

I think the pacing of both movies is more personal preference, I enjoy both and I sort of find them mutually exclusive in that if I'm in the mood to watch OUTW it's a totally different mood than when I want to watch TGTB&TU.

Best spaghetti westerns?

The ones with Trence Hill and Bud Spencer.
They were extremely popular in Israel.

Quote from: grumbler on June 28, 2011, 01:42:42 PM
TGtBatU is the better Spaghetti Western, as I understand the term, but WUaTitW is the better movie.

The latter is better classed with Leone's Once Upon a Time in Americaas an ode to an art form and isn't as light-hearted (as you note) nor as deliberately cheaply made/anachronistic as the movies I think of as spaghetti westerns (like Navajo Joe or the Hill and Spencer movies).

I tend to agree with this.

Quote from: The BrainOnce Upon A Time In America is a snorefest only broken up by multiple rape scenes.

Have you seen the director's cut?  My understanding is that the studio forced cuts that chopped up the theatrical release so badly that all the dramatic tension got leeched out.  The director's cut is supposed to be much better, but I've not seen it.  OTOH, the director's cut is well over 4 hours long, so...

Quote from: Siege on June 28, 2011, 06:48:16 PM
Best spaghetti westerns?

The ones with Trence Hill and Bud Spencer.
They were extremely popular in Israel.

You know, I always thought Westerns would work well in Israel.  Desert, settlers, angry natives.

Anyway, GBU.  Eli Wallach is great.

I've gotten to the point where I dislike the spaghetti western.

Quote from: Ed Anger on June 28, 2011, 07:49:21 PM
I've gotten to the point where I dislike the spaghetti western.

Yeah, was never the biggest fan of them.  I'd switch over to a noir detective thriller in a heartbeat.

I'd rather watch John Wayne overact than watch another wop film.

Quote from: Siege on June 28, 2011, 06:48:16 PM
Best spaghetti westerns?

The ones with Trence Hill and Bud Spencer.
They were extremely popular in Israel.

Ahh those were funny and good.

G,B,U for the original question

Quote from: dps on June 28, 2011, 07:17:55 PM

Quote from: The BrainOnce Upon A Time In America is a snorefest only broken up by multiple rape scenes.

Have you seen the director's cut?  My understanding is that the studio forced cuts that chopped up the theatrical release so badly that all the dramatic tension got leeched out.  The director's cut is supposed to be much better, but I've not seen it.  OTOH, the director's cut is well over 4 hours long, so...

That's the one I've seen AFAIK.

Of those two I prefer "Once Upon A Time In The West".

I agree with what Otto says above wholeheartedly.

Also in need of more respect is "Duck You Sucker" AKA A Fistful Of Dynamite.

Restored to it's Non American release cut, it's a genius piece of Spaghetti Western/Melodrama. Gorgeous, The David Lean Film Of Spaghetti Westerns if there can be such a thing.