Talk about not getting the point.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/8572934.stm
QuoteTurkey threatens to expel 100,000 Armenians
Turkey's prime minister has threatened to deport 100,000 Armenian migrants, amid renewed tensions over Turkish mass killings of Armenians in World War I.
Recent resolutions in the US and Sweden have called the killings "genocide".
Recep Tayyip Erdogan told the BBC that of 170,000 Armenians living in Turkey "70,000 are Turkish citizens".
"We are turning a blind eye to the remaining 100,000... Tomorrow, I may tell these 100,000 to go back to their country, if it becomes necessary."
Thousands of Armenians, many of them women, work illegally in Turkey. Most do low-skilled jobs such as cleaning.
Mr Erdogan was speaking in an interview with the BBC's Turkish Service, in which he was asked about the recent votes by lawmakers in the US and Sweden.
The resolutions, recognising the mass killings of Armenians by Ottoman Turks as "genocide", were passed narrowly, and in both cases Turkey reacted angrily.
Armenian Prime Minister Tigran Sarkisian was quoted as telling parliament on Wednesday that Mr Erdogan's comments only reminded Armenians of the mass killings.
"These kinds of political statements do not help to improve relations between our two states," he said.
"When the Turkish prime minister allows himself to make such statements it immediately for us brings up memories of the events of 1915."
Diplomatic moves to normalise relations between Turkey and Armenia have faltered recently.
Hundreds of thousands of Armenians died in 1915, when they were deported en masse from eastern Anatolia by the Ottoman Empire. They were killed by troops or died from starvation and disease.
Armenia says up to 1.5 million Armenians were killed, but Turkey says the figure is no more than one-third of that and that many Turks died as well.
Turkey accepts that atrocities were committed but argues they were part of the war and that there was no systematic attempt to destroy the Christian Armenian people.
Armenia wants Turkey to recognise the killings as an act of genocide, but successive Turkish governments have refused to do so.
Armenians have campaigned for the killings to be recognised internationally as genocide - and more than 20 countries have done so.
Cleaning house for wealthy Turks: fail?
Wouldn't be easier to kill them and cover up the whole thing under the protection of Turkish Nationalism? It worked for 80 years...
I think if these Armenians want to remain there, they need to ante up , cut ties with the old country and start behaving like good Turks. Otherwise, go back to Armenia?
Hey, maybe the Euros will be more inclined to let the Turks in the EU if the Turks go through with the ethnic cleansing.
Quote from: Razgovory on March 18, 2010, 04:08:45 AM
Hey, maybe the Euros will be more inclined to let the Turks in the EU if the Turks go through with the ethnic cleansing.
This post doesn't make any sense, but then it's your post so it's expected.
Quote from: Sahib on March 18, 2010, 06:09:55 AM
Quote from: Razgovory on March 18, 2010, 04:08:45 AM
Hey, maybe the Euros will be more inclined to let the Turks in the EU if the Turks go through with the ethnic cleansing.
This post doesn't make any sense, but then it's your post so it's expected.
They let in Germany and Poland, so why not Turkey?
I am apalled a politician suggested expelling illegal immigrants. Americans would never tolerate someone who said something like that.
Erdogan and the AKP are doing everything they can to prove Lord Acton right.
Paging queequeg . . .
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on March 18, 2010, 08:45:01 AM
Erdogan and the AKP are doing everything they can to prove Lord Acton right.
Paging queequeg . . .
You don't need to page him. His turko-greek-armenaian-persian alarm (It is made out of olives, gold chains and smells like sweat and feet) is already going off.
Spellus has been there for like a month and he's already annoyed enough people with his Armenian obsession that the country is planning on expelling them. now that's a talent.
Quote from: HVC on March 18, 2010, 09:54:19 AM
Spellus has been there for like a month and he's already annoyed enough people with his Armenian obsession that the country is planning on expelling them. now that's a talent.
The kid's got moxy.
WTF I don't care about 100,000 Armenians.
Enormously disappointing. Even if I agree with his other statement (basically, the Diaspora has managed to fuck over Armenia with this), this is just sabre-rattling horseshit that I'd expect from the CHP (Gul was famously "accused" of being Armenian), but thought the AKP was (generally) above. Looks like I was wrong. I can't vote here, so I'm just going to throw up my hands and hope some sane CHP member comes around.
This makes me so angry that I think I'm going to do my damndest to avoid thinking about this while I'm here. If they actually do deport them, I'm leaving and probably never coming back.
Now I kind of feel bad about rubbing it in. :Embarrass:
Quote from: Queequeg on March 18, 2010, 01:19:49 PM
sabre-rattling horseshit
This seriously calls for more fiber.
If we expel all the Armenians off the board, can we get the same deal?
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on March 18, 2010, 04:34:04 PM
Now I kind of feel bad about rubbing it in. :Embarrass:
Not like Erdooan. The cunt responds to threats to recognize the Genocide of the Armenians (carried out under the false pretence of
deporting Armenians) by
threatening to deport Armenians. Even if I think the diaspora's role in this has been catastrophic, Erdooan went out of his way to be as incredibly insulting as possible.
Quote from: Jaron on March 18, 2010, 04:48:26 PM
If we expel all the Armenians off the board, can we get the same deal?
I'm not Armenian. My background is as English as sodomy on a ship.
Quote from: Queequeg on March 18, 2010, 04:52:45 PM
Not like Erdooan.
He'e just a politician, and one facing election soon. Simple as that. Your mistake was thinking that he might be something else.
Erdogan played nice when he needed to shore up his international cred and appear non-threatening to the domestic liberals and their press organs. Now that the generals are on the run he doesn't need to pretend anymore.
All that happened is that secular wannabe authoritarians got replaced with religious wannabe authoritarians.
Quote from: Queequeg on March 18, 2010, 04:26:57 PM
This makes me so angry that I think I'm going to do my damndest to avoid thinking about this while I'm here. If they actually do deport them, I'm leaving and probably never coming back.
Hold your breath too. That'll show them Turkish dogs.
Quote from: Queequeg on March 18, 2010, 04:26:57 PM
This makes me so angry that I think I'm going to do my damndest to avoid thinking about this while I'm here. If they actually do deport them, I'm leaving and probably never coming back.
Dude, chill out.
Quote from: HVC on March 18, 2010, 09:54:19 AM
Spellus has been there for like a month and he's already annoyed enough people with his Armenian obsession that the country is planning on expelling them. now that's a talent.
:lol:
Quote from: Queequeg on March 18, 2010, 04:53:44 PM
Quote from: Jaron on March 18, 2010, 04:48:26 PM
If we expel all the Armenians off the board, can we get the same deal?
I'm not Armenian. My background is as English as sodomy on a ship.
Bloody Churchill wannabe... :glare:
Quote from: Queequeg on March 18, 2010, 04:52:45 PM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on March 18, 2010, 04:34:04 PM
Now I kind of feel bad about rubbing it in. :Embarrass:
Not like Erdooan. The cunt responds to threats to recognize the Genocide of the Armenians (carried out under the false pretence of deporting Armenians) by threatening to deport Armenians. Even if I think the diaspora's role in this has been catastrophic, Erdooan went out of his way to be as incredibly insulting as possible.
Is there any reason that he wouldn't want to be insulting? These people are his enemies, after all.
QuoteIs there any reason that he wouldn't want to be insulting? These people are his enemies, after all.
Not to mention the housekeepers. :D
Quote from: citizen k on March 18, 2010, 09:15:08 PM
QuoteIs there any reason that he wouldn't want to be insulting? These people are his enemies, after all.
Not to mention the housekeepers. :D
Will Turkey begin importing Mexicans or Filipinos?
I thought Spellus said he was 1/4 Armenian awhile back.
Quote from: Neil on March 18, 2010, 06:37:44 AM
Quote from: Sahib on March 18, 2010, 06:09:55 AM
Quote from: Razgovory on March 18, 2010, 04:08:45 AM
Hey, maybe the Euros will be more inclined to let the Turks in the EU if the Turks go through with the ethnic cleansing.
This post doesn't make any sense, but then it's your post so it's expected.
They let in Germany and Poland, so why not Turkey?
German Cheques and not even Poland is muslim.
Quote from: Pitiful Pathos on March 19, 2010, 01:47:50 AM
I thought Spellus said he was 1/4 Armenian awhile back.
He was. He got better.
Paternal grandmother's ancestry is unsure. Adopted by somewhat crazy-ass hill folk in Idaho in the Depression. We've thought Armenian previously (my dad looks part or wholly Jewish or Armenian, so does a lot of that side), now we are thinking Basque, or some particularly dark Welsh or Irish.
That said, always claimed the majority of my stock was Anglo.
If someone looks Jewish/Armenian/Welsh/Irish/Basque I think that it is safe to say that he could just as well be any other European heritage.
This reminds me that earlier (like, my great grandpa) my family's last name had the part in it which translates to "Czech Priest" now, the story my grandpa told my father was that this was actually attached because of an actual czech priest who came and settled here.
My grandma's version, however, and it does sound more probable, is that simply one of my (not that distant) ancestors had parents named "Czech" and "Priest" hence the name :P
In other words, you don't need to be American to have family legends of exotic ancestry :P
Quote from: Zanza on March 19, 2010, 08:10:14 AM
If someone looks Jewish/Armenian/Welsh/Irish/Basque I think that it is safe to say that he could just as well be any other European heritage.
Clearly you don't know enough about Mormon obsession with ancestry. Family and roots are invented and hypothesized if they do not exist. I liked the Armenian theory for obvious reasons.
:huh: The Mormons are indeed obsessed with ancestry (ancestral baptism :bleeding: ^ :bleeding: ), but I didn't think they were known for making shit up if they hit dead ends as part of their meticulous research...
Quote from: Queequeg on March 19, 2010, 07:30:56 AM
Paternal grandmother's ancestry is unsure. Adopted by somewhat crazy-ass hill folk in Idaho in the Depression. We've thought Armenian previously (my dad looks part or wholly Jewish or Armenian, so does a lot of that side), now we are thinking Basque, or some particularly dark Welsh or Irish.
That said, always claimed the majority of my stock was Anglo.
Squeelus is Melungian!!
Quote from: Caliga on March 19, 2010, 08:34:18 AM
Mormons ... I didn't think they were known for making shit up
:lol:
<_<
Quote from: Caliga on March 19, 2010, 08:34:18 AM
:huh: The Mormons are indeed obsessed with ancestry (ancestral baptism :bleeding: ^ :bleeding: ), but I didn't think they were known for making shit up if they hit dead ends as part of their meticulous research...
In retrospect, the fact that my grandmother is a disturbed individual likely has more to do with it than her creed. Always kind of thought it was the Mormon thing, though.
In my current Armenia game in EU: Rome, a scythian dude grabbed the throne in civil war :perv:
His grandson has armenian culture however, so things should be back to normal in two generations.
Quote from: Queequeg on March 19, 2010, 07:30:56 AM
Paternal grandmother's ancestry is unsure. Adopted by somewhat crazy-ass hill folk in Idaho in the Depression. We've thought Armenian previously (my dad looks part or wholly Jewish or Armenian, so does a lot of that side), now we are thinking Basque,
I'm familiar with Idaho history and the Basque ancestry is entirely plausible.
http://www.basquemuseum.com/museum.asp (http://www.basquemuseum.com/museum.asp)
Quote from: Tamas on March 20, 2010, 04:05:09 PM
In my current Armenia game in EU: Rome, a scythian dude grabbed the throne in civil war :perv:
His grandson has armenian culture however, so things should be back to normal in two generations.
Happens in all my Armenian games in EU:Rome. That shouldn't be that surprising; both Turkey and Hungary are located bordering the Steppe zone, and have pockets of Steppe ecosystem (I was recently very surprised by just how steppe-like the country around modern Konya is-no wonder the Seljuks liked it so much!). They were probably homes to the first Indo-European settlers of those corners of the European continent (in the case of Anatolia, this would be the Hittites, in the Pannonian basin we'd see some of the peoples who would eventually become Celts and Italians, maybe mixed with Germans and now assimilated peoples), and not coincidentally they were home to the first non-Indo-European invaders from the steppe.
Traditionally this was one of the great advantages of the Armenian and Georgian kingdoms; they were able to draw simultaneously on native, semi-Roman/Celt style heavy infantry traditions, as well as steppe archery, both mounted and dismounted. On a few occasions the Georgians purposefully settled pagan Turks in his kingdom so as to have the best possible antidote to Seljuk raids. Russians did something pretty similar several different times.
For the record, I do believe we are finno-ugric and not some scythian/persian offshoots, but the culture (most of it was destroyed by force-converting to christianity anyways) had to come from the scythians. Even serious researchers of the topic note that much (evidence points to us leaving the Urals for the steppes when the Scythians ruled it, so it had to be them from whom we learned the ropes).
Spellus feels free to alter his family's origins to whatever seems convenient? I'm shocked. Hymen-mania, my ass.
Quote from: Tamas on March 19, 2010, 08:22:53 AM
This reminds me that earlier (like, my great grandpa) my family's last name had the part in it which translates to "Czech Priest" now, the story my grandpa told my father was that this was actually attached because of an actual czech priest who came and settled here.
My grandma's version, however, and it does sound more probable, is that simply one of my (not that distant) ancestors had parents named "Czech" and "Priest" hence the name :P
In other words, you don't need to be American to have family legends of exotic ancestry :P
Having a Czech ancestor is exotic for a Hungarian? :huh:
For a Hungarian gypsy, yes.
Quote from: Zanza on March 19, 2010, 08:10:14 AM
If someone looks Jewish/Armenian/Welsh/Irish/Basque I think that it is safe to say that he could just as well be any other European heritage. should be on a no-fly list
FYP :P
Slavs really have no business looking down on Celts. :scots:
Quote from: Zanza on March 22, 2010, 01:54:05 AM
Quote from: Tamas on March 19, 2010, 08:22:53 AM
This reminds me that earlier (like, my great grandpa) my family's last name had the part in it which translates to "Czech Priest" now, the story my grandpa told my father was that this was actually attached because of an actual czech priest who came and settled here.
My grandma's version, however, and it does sound more probable, is that simply one of my (not that distant) ancestors had parents named "Czech" and "Priest" hence the name :P
In other words, you don't need to be American to have family legends of exotic ancestry :P
Having a Czech ancestor is exotic for a Hungarian? :huh:
Nah but there was some exotic story made up for it like political/religious refugee or somesuch
Anyway, I think it's a sensible move on the Turkish prime minister's part.
Next, Poland should threaten to put all remaining Jews into camps if people don't stop accusing us of antisemitism.
Quote from: Martinus on March 22, 2010, 04:59:42 AM
Anyway, I think it's a sensible move on the Turkish prime minister's part.
Next, Poland should threaten to put all remaining Jews into camps if people don't stop accusing us of antisemitism.
Now, THAT would be a shitstorm. The US would be all over Poland for that. Mass outrage, possibly even military action. Siege would be on the front line of the invasion.
But Armenians... they're not Jewish, so America doesn't care.
Heck, the proposal to consider what the Ottomans did to the Armenians as a "genocide" won't even pass the House, and US business leaders are against it.
Lucianus shows his true identity again.
Joooooos!
Quote from: Tamas on March 21, 2010, 01:41:33 PM
For the record, I do believe we are finno-ugric and not some scythian/persian offshoots, but the culture (most of it was destroyed by force-converting to christianity anyways) had to come from the scythians. Even serious researchers of the topic note that much (evidence points to us leaving the Urals for the steppes when the Scythians ruled it, so it had to be them from whom we learned the ropes).
Artistically, culturally, materially, spiritually and in no small part genetically the Turks, Mongols and Magyars were descendants of the previous Indo-European peoples. This is particularly true of the Hungarians, thanks in part to the Jassic people.
Basically, every non-Basque linguistic group in West and Central Eurasia north of Arab Iraq were, at some point, pastoralists on the Steppe who came off and settled. The Turks and Magyars were just late to the game.
The Celts came off of the steppes? I thought they were in southern Europe at least as far back as the end of the last ice age. :huh:
Hey Squeelus, when did the gypsies show up?
Quote from: Caliga on March 22, 2010, 07:22:30 PM
The Celts came off of the steppes? I thought they were in southern Europe at least as far back as the end of the last ice age. :huh:
Didn't they find ancient redhead remains in China?
Quote from: citizen k on March 22, 2010, 08:16:14 PM
Didn't they find ancient redhead remains in China?
Tocharians != Celts, though both are Indo-European.
Quote from: Caliga on March 22, 2010, 08:28:41 PM
Quote from: citizen k on March 22, 2010, 08:16:14 PM
Didn't they find ancient redhead remains in China?
Tocharians != Celts, though both are Indo-European.
:scots:
Quote from: Caliga on March 22, 2010, 07:22:30 PM
The Celts came off of the steppes? I thought they were in southern Europe at least as far back as the end of the last ice age. :huh:
All Indo-European peoples have roots on the Caspain steppe, at the very least linguistically and, to a certain extent, culturally. The Celts in particular appear to have had quite a bit in common with the Scythians artistically.
Now genetics are a different story. Obviously, the Assamese and Irishmen have different genetic background, however. \
Gypsies? By the year 1000 I think they were turning up in Byzantine records. No one is exactly sure when they came from India, though.