http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=4628040&categoryid=2378529
I saw that earlier today. Very vicious. In men's soccer in Europe she would have gone off with a red card after two or three of theses actions. She better gets a 10+ game suspension.
I blame the referee, he should have gotten control over the game. From my own experience with coaching womens rugby I figured out that girls relish the opportunity to do violence. They love it. Team sports lets them get away with it. Because I'm big they think I don't feel pain, so they feel fully justified in full contact against me when we mix the teams for touch. Then when they have the ball they stick their tits out in full knowledge that I won't touch-tackle them there.
But still, I blame the ref here. He let them get away with it.
Did they hire Tonya Harding as head coach?
This is why Americans suck at soccer. You're not supposed to fight. You're supposed to take a dive any time anyone gets near you.
Quote from: Zanza on November 06, 2009, 03:37:22 PM
I saw that earlier today. Very vicious. In men's soccer in Europe she would have gone off with a red card after two or three of theses actions. She better gets a 10+ game suspension.
QuoteAs a result, New Mexico soccer coach Kit Vela suspended junior defender Elizabeth Lambert indefinitely and is prohibiting her from participating in all team practices, competition and conditioning activities.
The ref only lets people get away with what the ref doesn't see. You cannot call what you don't see, so at the end of the day there is some level of integrity expected out of the players.
When you get someone like this, who is willing to just try to hurt someone, you ahve to hope the ref catches them at it, but it isn't that hard to do it in a way that makes it hard to catch, especially when it is off the ball.
I'd like to hope a referee could be a bit pre-emptive and communicate with the players in order to get the to act straight. Cause the referee should be able at least sense the spirit and emotion on the pitch. Sense the bloodlust on each side to put it another way. The ref could have acted, talked to the players, captains or throw away the yellow card and say the next one is red.
Quote from: Viking on November 06, 2009, 04:07:54 PM
I'd like to hope a referee could be a bit pre-emptive and communicate with the players in order to get the to act straight. Cause the referee should be able at least sense the spirit and emotion on the pitch. Sense the bloodlust on each side to put it another way. The ref could have acted, talked to the players, captains or throw away the yellow card and say the next one is red.
How do you know they didn't do this?
There is only so much preventive stuff you can do - if some douchebag is going to be a douchebag, they are not going to stop because you gave the generic "Lets all just get along and play nice" speech.
You just have to hope you catch them at it. I wonder how many officials they are using on those games?
Berkut's Ref apologism makes me SICK. Ref's are Satan's tools.
Quote from: Ed Anger on November 06, 2009, 04:14:37 PM
Berkut's Ref apologism makes me SICK. Ref's are Satan's tools.
:yeah:
I love being the guy who interjects sanity into the idiocy of fans talking about officiating. It just pisses them off so much.
:)
As for the amount of Ref's, I'd assume it is 1 plus the two line judges.
Quote from: Berkut on November 06, 2009, 04:16:13 PM
Quote from: Ed Anger on November 06, 2009, 04:14:37 PM
Berkut's Ref apologism makes me SICK. Ref's are Satan's tools.
:yeah:
I love being the guy who interjects sanity into the idiocy of fans talking about officiating. It just pisses them off so much.
It must be a pleasant change from your usual posting MO then. :)
Quote from: Berkut on November 06, 2009, 04:12:22 PM
How do you know they didn't do this?
There is only so much preventive stuff you can do - if some douchebag is going to be a douchebag, they are not going to stop because you gave the generic "Lets all just get along and play nice" speech.
You just have to hope you catch them at it. I wonder how many officials they are using on those games?
Not Rodney King, more like Hannibal Lecter. Threaten to send off the next person to misbehave, or just treat the side cheating unfairly.
But then again Rugby referees are omnipotent on the pitch.
They needed "THE MAN" to ref that match.
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.uksport.gov.uk%2Fassets%2FImage%2FnewsArchive%2FPier_C_main.jpg&hash=79ff17e4d16c38df07f77c8a7699013e12f7dc66)
Quote from: Viking on November 06, 2009, 03:39:26 PM
I blame the referee, he should have gotten control over the game. From my own experience with coaching womens rugby I figured out that girls relish the opportunity to do violence. They love it. Team sports lets them get away with it. Because I'm big they think I don't feel pain, so they feel fully justified in full contact against me when we mix the teams for touch. Then when they have the ball they stick their tits out in full knowledge that I won't touch-tackle them there.
But still, I blame the ref here. He let them get away with it.
...I...have to play with you guys sometime.
Quote from: Tyr on November 06, 2009, 06:22:34 PM
...I...have to play with you guys sometime.
You are welcome any time. Talk to your Erasmus adviser about NTNU in trondheim.
In both of the blatant ones, the BYU chick actually "hit" first---sorta passive-aggressive. The punch was in retaliation for an elbow jab and the hair-yank came as the other chick was grabbing at her shorts and pulling them. No excuse, obviously.
Quote from: MadImmortalMan on November 06, 2009, 07:14:15 PM
In both of the blatant ones, the BYU chick actually "hit" first---sorta passive-aggressive. The punch was in retaliation for an elbow jab and the hair-yank came as the other chick was grabbing at her shorts and pulling them. No excuse, obviously.
BYU, men and women's teams, deserve to be beaten up and butt-raped all the time. I think the UNM girl should get a medal.
When I first clicked the link, I thought you were talking about 1:0 score, which would also be an accurate description of American woman soccer style.
Quote from: Zanza on November 06, 2009, 03:37:22 PM
I saw that earlier today. Very vicious. In men's soccer in Europe she would have gone off with a red card after two or three of theses actions. She better gets a 10+ game suspension.
Yeah, I saw this earlier and couldn't believe that all she got was a yellow card. But as Berkut said, the officials can only call what they see. And given how bad the officiating is, even at the pro level, in American-style football and in baseball--the sports most Americans actually care about--I can only imagine how bad it must be in college-level women's soccer.
Damn, hardcore.
That's why women should never play when they have their period.
She is so forceful and dominant. :wub:
Oh, and to the video: The referee sucks
Quote from: MadImmortalMan on November 06, 2009, 03:41:18 PM
This is why Americans suck at soccer. You're not supposed to fight. You're supposed to take a dive any time anyone gets near you.
:lol:
Actually there's a lot of pushing, pulling, elbowing and the like in soccer. The thing is, you have to be subtle about it. This chick looks as if she's lost control, which is something you don't want to happen to one of your players.
http://deadspin.com/5400583/girls-soccer-is-now-the-ultimate-combat-sport
Video is HOTT.
You know what is odd?
I officiate high school football and basketball - and I see a lot more fights or near fights in basketball than I do in football.
I wonder if the fact that football is so violent during play makes it less likely to have a fight - you can just take it out on the guy in the course of play?
Quote from: Berkut on November 09, 2009, 04:35:20 PM
You know what is odd?
I officiate high school football and basketball - and I see a lot more fights or near fights in basketball than I do in football.
I wonder if the fact that football is so violent during play makes it less likely to have a fight - you can just take it out on the guy in the course of play?
I would think that a large part of it is that punching a helmet hurts.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on November 09, 2009, 04:37:14 PM
Quote from: Berkut on November 09, 2009, 04:35:20 PM
You know what is odd?
I officiate high school football and basketball - and I see a lot more fights or near fights in basketball than I do in football.
I wonder if the fact that football is so violent during play makes it less likely to have a fight - you can just take it out on the guy in the course of play?
I would think that a large part of it is that punching a helmet hurts.
True - it is funny to watch though.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on November 09, 2009, 04:37:14 PM
Quote from: Berkut on November 09, 2009, 04:35:20 PM
You know what is odd?
I officiate high school football and basketball - and I see a lot more fights or near fights in basketball than I do in football.
I wonder if the fact that football is so violent during play makes it less likely to have a fight - you can just take it out on the guy in the course of play?
I would think that a large part of it is that punching a helmet hurts.
But fighting is an significant and accepted part of hockey. There they tend to go for body blows.
Quote from: Berkut on November 09, 2009, 04:35:20 PM
You know what is odd?
I officiate high school football and basketball - and I see a lot more fights or near fights in basketball than I do in football.
I wonder if the fact that football is so violent during play makes it less likely to have a fight - you can just take it out on the guy in the course of play?
My personal experience with Rugby is that in a contact sport you quickly either learn to play "safe" or you are kept out of the game. Sensible people will not play contact sports with people who can't control their tempers on the pitch. If you play soccer, volleyball or basketball you don't have this permission to hit while in Gridiron you would hit regularly and you would sort the sensible people from the crazies by seeing what they do with adrenaline and license to hit.
Quote from: Viking on November 09, 2009, 05:24:12 PM
Quote from: Berkut on November 09, 2009, 04:35:20 PM
You know what is odd?
I officiate high school football and basketball - and I see a lot more fights or near fights in basketball than I do in football.
I wonder if the fact that football is so violent during play makes it less likely to have a fight - you can just take it out on the guy in the course of play?
My personal experience with Rugby is that in a contact sport you quickly either learn to play "safe" or you are kept out of the game. Sensible people will not play contact sports with people who can't control their tempers on the pitch. If you play soccer, volleyball or basketball you don't have this permission to hit while in Gridiron you would hit regularly and you would sort the sensible people from the crazies by seeing what they do with adrenaline and license to hit.
True, but rugby is also a sport where the referee is respected. ;)
Berkut--when I was a kid some old guy who played football in the 1920s tried teaching us to block punts: come in from the side so you don't hit the punter, unless you know you are going to get the punt: then take a step to the inside to come in straight on to go through the punter's leg.
Is crap like that still legal? Have you ever seen something like that, and what would you do if you did?
Quote from: Barrister on November 09, 2009, 04:47:49 PM
But fighting is an significant and accepted part of hockey. There they tend to go for body blows.
Fighting in hockey developed in the pre-helmet era. Plus you're both on skates so you have to grab jersey and hold each other up or you plop on the ice like dorks. That's more conducive to ritualized stomach punch exchanges than standing on terra firma.
If you get a piece of the punt, then contact with the punter is ignored unless it is deemed excessive.
I once got myself in trouble because in a youth game I flagged someone for roughing the kicker when he blocked the kick. IMO, he pretty much creamed the guy just because he knew he was going to block the kick. Shrug. The coach was mighty pissed.
Berk, how much authority does the umpire in a Gridiron game have? Does he have any general catch all ability to penalize or control like rugby referees can use "dangerous play" for anything and give any penalty he might choose within the rules. And can a Gridiron umpire be found legally liable for action on the field?
Quote from: Viking on November 09, 2009, 05:51:08 PM
Berk, how much authority does the umpire in a Gridiron game have? Does he have any general catch all ability to penalize or control like rugby referees can use "dangerous play" for anything and give any penalty he might choose within the rules. And can a Gridiron umpire be found legally liable for action on the field?
Refs can order a player off the field.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on November 09, 2009, 05:54:32 PM
Quote from: Viking on November 09, 2009, 05:51:08 PM
Berk, how much authority does the umpire in a Gridiron game have? Does he have any general catch all ability to penalize or control like rugby referees can use "dangerous play" for anything and give any penalty he might choose within the rules. And can a Gridiron umpire be found legally liable for action on the field?
Refs can order a player off the field.
As Tommy Harris learned this weekend when he punched a dude in the head on the ground. RIGHT IN FRONT OF THE REF.
DA BEARS.
Quote from: Ed Anger on November 09, 2009, 06:10:04 PM
As Tommy Harris learned this weekend when he punched a dude in the head on the ground. RIGHT IN FRONT OF THE REF.
DA BEARS.
I got punched once during a game. The ref blew the whistle and ran over giving a penalty to the other side. Being the punchee I obviously thought the ref had his hand up the wrong way and would change it. So I ran and picked up the ball to try and take advantage of the disorder the the other side's defense. I quick tapped and ran forwards, the ref blew again so I had to wait for the ref to make the mark. Now during this time he didn't change his hand signals, signalling a penalty to the other side. When the referee arrived he marked the spot and marked a penalty against us. I asked if he was sure, he said yes, I said, "but he punched me!", and he replied "yes, and you must have done something to deserve being punched". This being rugby all I could do was say "I'm sorry sir" and get 10 yards back to form the defensive line.
The referees in norway know me too well.
:lol:
Quote from: Ed Anger on November 09, 2009, 06:10:04 PM
Quote from: Admiral Yi on November 09, 2009, 05:54:32 PM
Quote from: Viking on November 09, 2009, 05:51:08 PM
Berk, how much authority does the umpire in a Gridiron game have? Does he have any general catch all ability to penalize or control like rugby referees can use "dangerous play" for anything and give any penalty he might choose within the rules. And can a Gridiron umpire be found legally liable for action on the field?
Refs can order a player off the field.
As Tommy Harris learned this weekend when he punched a dude in the head on the ground. RIGHT IN FRONT OF THE REF.
DA BEARS.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EipxEJbKfrQ
What a jackass. :lol:
Quote from: Viking on November 09, 2009, 06:19:21 PM
Quote from: Ed Anger on November 09, 2009, 06:10:04 PM
As Tommy Harris learned this weekend when he punched a dude in the head on the ground. RIGHT IN FRONT OF THE REF.
DA BEARS.
I got punched once during a game. The ref blew the whistle and ran over giving a penalty to the other side. Being the punchee I obviously thought the ref had his hand up the wrong way and would change it. So I ran and picked up the ball to try and take advantage of the disorder the the other side's defense. I quick tapped and ran forwards, the ref blew again so I had to wait for the ref to make the mark. Now during this time he didn't change his hand signals, signalling a penalty to the other side. When the referee arrived he marked the spot and marked a penalty against us. I asked if he was sure, he said yes, I said, "but he punched me!", and he replied "yes, and you must have done something to deserve being punched". This being rugby all I could do was say "I'm sorry sir" and get 10 yards back to form the defensive line.
The referees in norway know me too well.
:lmfao:
Quote from: Viking on November 09, 2009, 05:51:08 PM
Berk, how much authority does the umpire in a Gridiron game have? Does he have any general catch all ability to penalize or control like rugby referees can use "dangerous play" for anything and give any penalty he might choose within the rules. And can a Gridiron umpire be found legally liable for action on the field?
No, not really.
I mean, I cannot imagine something someone can do that isn't covered by some specific rule though. Maybe I am not really understanding your question though.
Quote from: Berkut on November 09, 2009, 07:01:51 PM
Quote from: Viking on November 09, 2009, 05:51:08 PM
Berk, how much authority does the umpire in a Gridiron game have? Does he have any general catch all ability to penalize or control like rugby referees can use "dangerous play" for anything and give any penalty he might choose within the rules. And can a Gridiron umpire be found legally liable for action on the field?
No, not really.
I mean, I cannot imagine something someone can do that isn't covered by some specific rule though. Maybe I am not really understanding your question though.
In Rugby the referees can use his or her judgement to penalize any activity that might not be covered by the rules but might still be dangerous. For example hitting the above mentioned punter in the knee when it is carrying his weight when tackling him in on the thigh will be sufficient to tackle him would be considered dangerous play but on the surface legal.
Not to mention, in the scrum where 8 players from each side with 3 players in the front row bind on to each other and push against each other. With that many players pushing as hard as possible into the backs of other players.
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.whatisrugby.com%2Fimages%2Frugby_scrum_01.gif&hash=170bc1bac2f17188ce7cec50578075ccda3239af)
There are too many ways to break necks in a scrum. So it is important that there are no loopholes. The referees dictatorial powers are there primarily to prevent anybody from exploiting those loopholes to his own advantage while increasing the hazards.
Quote from: MadImmortalMan on November 06, 2009, 07:14:15 PM
In both of the blatant ones, the BYU chick actually "hit" first---sorta passive-aggressive. The punch was in retaliation for an elbow jab and the hair-yank came as the other chick was grabbing at her shorts and pulling them. No excuse, obviously.
That elbow "hit" by the BYU player was in retaliation for a previous series of suckerpunchs she got at the ball, and the New Mexico player continuing to fuck with her.
Berk, I think that what Viking is getting at is stuff that can come under the heading of "unnecessary roughness". But I'm not that familiar with rugby, so I'm not quite sure it's similar.