Poll
Question:
If you could upload your consciousness to an immortal robot, would you?
Option 1: In a heartbeat(my last)
votes: 10
Option 2: No, but if I could have eternal youth I'd go for it
votes: 5
Option 3: No, because I'm going to heaven
votes: 2
Option 4: The thought makes me pray to Shiva "Please, let me die"
votes: 4
See sig.
From the moment I understood the weakness of my flesh, I accepted it.
Trippy dude.
How similar to a human body would the robot vessel be on a scale from "indistinguishable from an actual human body" to "box on wheels with a basic webcam and mic/speaker setup to communicate with the outside world"?
Push comes to shove you can just run videogames in your brain. :P
Quote from: celedhring on December 09, 2021, 04:19:40 AM
Push comes to shove you can just run videogames in your brain. :P
Well, you want to avoid a William and Mary (https://www.roalddahlfans.com/dahls-work/short-stories/william-and-mary/) situation. :P
Provided I keep my memory and mental faculties, am in full control and self-reliant, and have the ability to end it when I've had enough, I might consider it.
Is it a copy? If yes then maybe if my family wants me to. Otherwise what's the point? Unless my brain is implanted into a robot body and kept immortal there, it would not be me, just a robot copy of me. I'd still die.
Do I need a deformed pseudo-human in a jar inside my chest?
there was an episode of Sealab 2021 that dealt with just this serious issue.
Quote from: Tamas on December 09, 2021, 04:40:42 AM
Is it a copy? If yes then maybe if my family wants me to. Otherwise what's the point? Unless my brain is implanted into a robot body and kept immortal there, it would not be me, just a robot copy of me. I'd still die.
The copy will be an AI which means it will be indistinguishable from the normal you except that it will be terrible at computer games.
Quote from: Darth Wagtaros on December 09, 2021, 08:40:56 AM
there was an episode of Sealab 2021 that dealt with just this serious issue.
Also a couple of very good Dark Mirror episodes - one with the benefits of doing it and one with the hell of it all.
Quote from: Razgovory on December 09, 2021, 01:12:06 PM
Quote from: Tamas on December 09, 2021, 04:40:42 AM
Is it a copy? If yes then maybe if my family wants me to. Otherwise what's the point? Unless my brain is implanted into a robot body and kept immortal there, it would not be me, just a robot copy of me. I'd still die.
The copy will be an AI which means it will be indistinguishable from the normal you except that it will be terrible at computer games.
:huh: So the copy is going to be exactly like the real Tamas?
:face:
Quote from: Tamas on December 09, 2021, 04:40:42 AM
Is it a copy? If yes then maybe if my family wants me to. Otherwise what's the point? Unless my brain is implanted into a robot body and kept immortal there, it would not be me, just a robot copy of me. I'd still die.
Right. This is the same reason why I contend that Star Trek-style teleporters wouldn't work. You'd be killed the moment of teleportation, and the thing that materializes at the far end is an exact replica of you, but is not
you.
If the copy is indistinguishable from the (destroyed) original and preserves memories and personality and believes itself to be the person in question: does it matter?
Quote from: Syt on December 09, 2021, 11:53:55 PM
If the copy is indistinguishable from the (destroyed) original and preserves memories and personality and believes itself to be the person in question: does it matter?
To the person who is killed? Yes. To observers? Depends on how they felt about the dead guy.
Quote from: Caliga on December 09, 2021, 10:34:47 PM
Quote from: Tamas on December 09, 2021, 04:40:42 AM
Is it a copy? If yes then maybe if my family wants me to. Otherwise what's the point? Unless my brain is implanted into a robot body and kept immortal there, it would not be me, just a robot copy of me. I'd still die.
Right. This is the same reason why I contend that Star Trek-style teleporters wouldn't work. You'd be killed the moment of teleportation, and the thing that materializes at the far end is an exact replica of you, but is not you.
*I* invented that concept!
Star Trek teleporters are mass murder machines. Nobody can tell, of course, since the new person thinks they are the old person, but they are not.
Quote from: Berkut on December 10, 2021, 11:41:27 AM
Quote from: Caliga on December 09, 2021, 10:34:47 PM
Quote from: Tamas on December 09, 2021, 04:40:42 AM
Is it a copy? If yes then maybe if my family wants me to. Otherwise what's the point? Unless my brain is implanted into a robot body and kept immortal there, it would not be me, just a robot copy of me. I'd still die.
Right. This is the same reason why I contend that Star Trek-style teleporters wouldn't work. You'd be killed the moment of teleportation, and the thing that materializes at the far end is an exact replica of you, but is not you.
*I* invented that concept!
Star Trek teleporters are mass murder machines. Nobody can tell, of course, since the new person thinks they are the old person, but they are not.
That concept was well-discussed before you got to it. :P
Quote from: Syt on December 09, 2021, 11:53:55 PM
If the copy is indistinguishable from the (destroyed) original and preserves memories and personality and believes itself to be the person in question: does it matter?
Dramatically. One is an AI and would not feel the same feelings as the human being. Unless the programmer is a lunatic and made AIs that can feel pain and boredom.
Well in the case of the transporter it is a biological clone.
There was a sci fi series where a transporter would create a clone on the other end but also leave the original version so every time you beamed around you created another copy of yourself. I thought that was interesting.
Quote from: Caliga on December 09, 2021, 10:34:47 PM
Quote from: Tamas on December 09, 2021, 04:40:42 AM
Is it a copy? If yes then maybe if my family wants me to. Otherwise what's the point? Unless my brain is implanted into a robot body and kept immortal there, it would not be me, just a robot copy of me. I'd still die.
Right. This is the same reason why I contend that Star Trek-style teleporters wouldn't work. You'd be killed the moment of teleportation, and the thing that materializes at the far end is an exact replica of you, but is not you.
but what is
you? if its just a collection of memories then copy you is still you.
Continuity.
Though I don't see reason why a robot transplant can't have that. Link you to the robot so you're in both at once then turn off the bio body.
Quote from: Valmy on December 10, 2021, 11:59:27 AM
Well in the case of the transporter it is a biological clone.
There was a sci fi series where a transporter would create a clone on the other end but also leave the original version so every time you beamed around you created another copy of yourself. I thought that was interesting.
That was the prestige right?
You already died when the first cell divided into two.
Quote from: HVC on December 10, 2021, 12:17:03 PM
Quote from: Caliga on December 09, 2021, 10:34:47 PM
Quote from: Tamas on December 09, 2021, 04:40:42 AM
Is it a copy? If yes then maybe if my family wants me to. Otherwise what's the point? Unless my brain is implanted into a robot body and kept immortal there, it would not be me, just a robot copy of me. I'd still die.
Right. This is the same reason why I contend that Star Trek-style teleporters wouldn't work. You'd be killed the moment of teleportation, and the thing that materializes at the far end is an exact replica of you, but is not you.
but what is you? if its just a collection of memories then copy you is still you.
But the memories are not real. They are memories of events did not happen to the clone. Imagine that before you went to into the teleporter I cheated you out of a bunch of money. You go into the teleporter and the clone comes out and tries to sue me. Would it have a case? What about if three clones came out instead of one? Would they all have cases, or each have a third of a case? I say no, because it/they are different entities with false memories. If it/they tried to testify about its experiences they could not without making a false statement.
I will live this life the best I can, and try to help others along on the way. That's it. We will all die, which is sad, but it is what keeps us human. I will never lose my humanity and join the Borg. I will just say Good Night.
Quote from: Habbaku on December 10, 2021, 11:49:04 AM
Quote from: Berkut on December 10, 2021, 11:41:27 AM
*I* invented that concept!
Star Trek teleporters are mass murder machines. Nobody can tell, of course, since the new person thinks they are the old person, but they are not.
That concept was well-discussed before you got to it. :P
Nonsense, Berkut is a time traveler from ancient Greece (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_Theseus).
Quote from: Caliga on December 09, 2021, 10:34:47 PM
Quote from: Tamas on December 09, 2021, 04:40:42 AM
Is it a copy? If yes then maybe if my family wants me to. Otherwise what's the point? Unless my brain is implanted into a robot body and kept immortal there, it would not be me, just a robot copy of me. I'd still die.
Right. This is the same reason why I contend that Star Trek-style teleporters wouldn't work. You'd be killed the moment of teleportation, and the thing that materializes at the far end is an exact replica of you, but is not you.
Yes. They had plots where transporter clones show up and go about their business, becoming independent people. Makes me wonder why they never used it as a plot device to have some form of immortality. THey just 'record you' every now and then and then use the transporter to make a new copy if something happens. THey'd not go through nearly as many Red Shirts.
Quote from: Razgovory on December 10, 2021, 05:40:00 PM
But the memories are not real. They are memories of events did not happen to the clone. Imagine that before you went to into the teleporter I cheated you out of a bunch of money. You go into the teleporter and the clone comes out and tries to sue me. Would it have a case? What about if three clones came out instead of one? Would they all have cases, or each have a third of a case?
You've convinced me, I am now in favor of rapid development and use of transporter technology.
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on December 10, 2021, 07:58:05 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on December 10, 2021, 05:40:00 PM
But the memories are not real. They are memories of events did not happen to the clone. Imagine that before you went to into the teleporter I cheated you out of a bunch of money. You go into the teleporter and the clone comes out and tries to sue me. Would it have a case? What about if three clones came out instead of one? Would they all have cases, or each have a third of a case?
You've convinced me, I am now in favor of rapid development and use of transporter technology.
Except that the one lawyer hired to represent all of them would just clone himself and collect all the lawyers fees.
In fact, cloned lawyers would have the advantage that no one would ask which of them had the human soul.
Didn't Next Generation have an episode where Riker was copied in a transporter malfunctions years ago and they happen upon his clone?
Quote from: Threviel on December 11, 2021, 07:16:18 AM
Didn't Next Generation have an episode where Riker was copied in a transporter malfunctions years ago and they happen upon his clone?
Yeah, and he showed up on DS9.