So I was reading about this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snaefell_Mountain_Course#Safety
This race is held every year on the Isle of Man. It is high end superbike motorcycle racing.
On average, 2.5 people die per year. Last year in 2016 there were six fatalities.
You can watch YouTube videos of cams on the racers. It is...incredible. They are doing 200+ mph on this course, and of course when they crash, the result is often fatal.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IzQLl9cLt6A&ab_channel=Maddnes
On the one hand, I am stunned and impressed at the skill and balls to do this.
On the other hand, what a fucking waste of human life. I could never imagine voluntarily doing something that has such a high chance of injury or death. I don't think I am a coward, I enjoy skiing, skydiving, scuba, plenty of stuff with a bit higher chance of injury than most.
But if someone told me that the next time I go skiing I will have a 1% chance of dying, there is no fucking way I am going no matter how much I love skiing.
I don't know what local health and safety legislation has to say on this. Well obviously it's legal there but for instance if one of the riders is employed by someone (as a rider) I can't see it passing Swedish standards for worker safety.
Quote from: Berkut on November 26, 2016, 09:14:50 PM
So I was reading about this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snaefell_Mountain_Course#Safety
This race is held every year on the Isle of Man. It is high end superbike motorcycle racing.
On average, 2.5 people die per year. Last year in 2016 there were six fatalities.
You can watch YouTube videos of cams on the racers. It is...incredible. They are doing 200+ mph on this course, and of course when they crash, the result is often fatal.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IzQLl9cLt6A&ab_channel=Maddnes
On the one hand, I am stunned and impressed at the skill and balls to do this.
On the other hand, what a fucking waste of human life. I could never imagine voluntarily doing something that has such a high chance of injury or death. I don't think I am a coward, I enjoy skiing, skydiving, scuba, plenty of stuff with a bit higher chance of injury than most.
But if someone told me that the next time I go skiing I will have a 1% chance of dying, there is no fucking way I am going no matter how much I love skiing.
This Guy has a good explanation:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guy_Martin (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guy_Martin)
Next year he's going to attempt to break the motorcycle landspeed record of 400+mph:
http://www.channel4.com/programmes/speed-with-guy-martin/episode-guide (http://www.channel4.com/programmes/speed-with-guy-martin/episode-guide)
People continue to attempt to climb Mount Everest even though something like 12% of the people who have tried it have died in the attempt.
I keep waking up each morning even though life ends with mortality 100% of the time.
Quote from: PDH on November 26, 2016, 11:22:30 PM
I keep waking up each morning even though life ends with mortality 100% of the time.
:rolleyes: Past results cannot predict the future.
Quote from: grumbler on November 26, 2016, 11:19:51 PM
People continue to attempt to climb Mount Everest even though something like 12% of the people who have tried it have died in the attempt.
Those numbers sound fishy.
Quote from: Eddie Teach on November 26, 2016, 11:26:35 PM
Quote from: grumbler on November 26, 2016, 11:19:51 PM
People continue to attempt to climb Mount Everest even though something like 12% of the people who have tried it have died in the attempt.
Those numbers sound fishy.
My wording was poor. That was the number of fatalities per successful summit. 90% of the climbers turn back, so it isn't 12% of attempts. Those numbers don't include guides.
I think people seek stimulation, for some a good book or film is all that is needed, for others it has to be more real. I'm on the book side of the spectrum but I have met people from the other side, they live for their mountaineering/bunjee jumping/extreme scuba/car racing times and find everyday life unbearably dull.
Quote from: grumbler on November 26, 2016, 11:19:51 PM
People continue to attempt to climb Mount Everest even though something like 12% of the people who have tried it have died in the attempt.
I was about to post something similar. People make conscious decisions that can potentially shorten their lifespan all the time. Doing so for one's passion seems like not the worst motivation.
Definitely beats doing it for money.
Quote from: Richard Hakluyt on November 27, 2016, 03:42:56 AM
I think people seek stimulation, for some a good book or film is all that is needed, for others it has to be more real. I'm on the book side of the spectrum but I have met people from the other side, they live for their mountaineering/bunjee jumping/extreme scuba/car racing times and find everyday life unbearably dull.
I don't think riding a book down a country road at 200 mph is very safe either.
Quote from: The Brain on November 27, 2016, 04:14:56 AM
Quote from: Richard Hakluyt on November 27, 2016, 03:42:56 AM
I think people seek stimulation, for some a good book or film is all that is needed, for others it has to be more real. I'm on the book side of the spectrum but I have met people from the other side, they live for their mountaineering/bunjee jumping/extreme scuba/car racing times and find everyday life unbearably dull.
I don't think riding a book down a country road at 200 mph is very safe either.
:lol:
Quote from: The Brain on November 27, 2016, 04:14:56 AM
Quote from: Richard Hakluyt on November 27, 2016, 03:42:56 AM
I think people seek stimulation, for some a good book or film is all that is needed, for others it has to be more real. I'm on the book side of the spectrum but I have met people from the other side, they live for their mountaineering/bunjee jumping/extreme scuba/car racing times and find everyday life unbearably dull.
I don't think riding a book down a country road at 200 mph is very safe either.
YMMV
I interviewed a guy that works in motorcycling race organization this summer, and he passingly mentioned this race. He considered it a blight to the sport, because of how unsafe it is. Moreover, apparently it is stopping a lot of sponsors from getting into superbikes.
When it comes to motorsports, it's an aberration, and probably a defiant reaction against the general trend. Pretty much everywhere else you go to the other extreme: "safety is absolutely the most important goal in motorsports". In which case why does the sport still exist? :unsure: No matter how safe racing is, it's even safer to just not race at all.
Of course, most everyone who makes decisions is too politically correct to say that racing is meaningless without the possibility of things occasionally going wrong, and like all political correctness, the inability to say the truth out loud leads to a lot of confused thinking and decision-making.
Quote from: DGuller on November 27, 2016, 10:37:08 AM
like all political correctness, the inability to say the truth out loud leads to a lot of confused thinking and decision-making.
Quoted for posterity.
I'm not sure what's "politically correct" about striving to reduce deaths in sport. It's just correct.
Quote from: celedhring on November 27, 2016, 11:20:08 AM
I'm not sure what's "politically correct" about striving to reduce deaths in sport. It's just correct.
I think the point he is making is that political correctness forbids mentioning the truth that it is the possibility of a crash (not a death, but a crash) that makes motor sports thrilling for many, if not most, of its fans.
Quote from: DGuller on November 27, 2016, 10:37:08 AM
When it comes to motorsports, it's an aberration, and probably a defiant reaction against the general trend. Pretty much everywhere else you go to the other extreme: "safety is absolutely the most important goal in motorsports". In which case why does the sport still exist? :unsure: No matter how safe racing is, it's even safer to just not race at all.
I've no idea.
Quote from: Berkut on November 27, 2016, 10:51:12 AM
Quote from: DGuller on November 27, 2016, 10:37:08 AM
like all political correctness, the inability to say the truth out loud leads to a lot of confused thinking and decision-making.
Quoted for posterity.
:unsure: Have I ever said anything different in that regard?
Quote from: grumbler on November 27, 2016, 11:26:46 AM
Quote from: celedhring on November 27, 2016, 11:20:08 AM
I'm not sure what's "politically correct" about striving to reduce deaths in sport. It's just correct.
I think the point he is making is that political correctness forbids mentioning the truth that it is the possibility of a crash (not a death, but a crash) that makes motor sports thrilling for many, if not most, of its fans.
Exactly.
Quote from: DGuller on November 27, 2016, 10:37:08 AM
When it comes to motorsports, it's an aberration, and probably a defiant reaction against the general trend. Pretty much everywhere else you go to the other extreme: "safety is absolutely the most important goal in motorsports". In which case why does the sport still exist? :unsure: No matter how safe racing is, it's even safer to just not race at all.
They're getting paid, and in some cases exorbitant amounts of money, to engage in an activity risking an outcome that we engage in on a daily basis for free.
Nobody's sponsoring my ass to get put into the wall by a Vietnamese bikini wax technician in a Nissan Murano on New Hampshire Avenue. I'd sell space on a quarter panel for that.
Quote from: grumbler on November 27, 2016, 11:26:46 AM
Quote from: celedhring on November 27, 2016, 11:20:08 AM
I'm not sure what's "politically correct" about striving to reduce deaths in sport. It's just correct.
I think the point he is making is that political correctness forbids mentioning the truth that it is the possibility of a crash (not a death, but a crash) that makes motor sports thrilling for many, if not most, of its fans.
Fair enough.
Sponsors are terrified of those, though. So it's not just PC, it's business.
Quote from: DGuller on November 27, 2016, 11:32:15 AM
Quote from: Berkut on November 27, 2016, 10:51:12 AM
Quote from: DGuller on November 27, 2016, 10:37:08 AM
like all political correctness, the inability to say the truth out loud leads to a lot of confused thinking and decision-making.
Quoted for posterity.
:unsure: Have I ever said anything different in that regard?
Nope.
Quote from: Berkut on November 27, 2016, 02:24:24 PM
Quote from: DGuller on November 27, 2016, 11:32:15 AM
Quote from: Berkut on November 27, 2016, 10:51:12 AM
Quote from: DGuller on November 27, 2016, 10:37:08 AM
like all political correctness, the inability to say the truth out loud leads to a lot of confused thinking and decision-making.
Quoted for posterity.
:unsure: Have I ever said anything different in that regard?
Nope.
:unsure: Usually people say that when they expect to use someone's words against them down the road.
Quote from: DGuller on November 27, 2016, 02:41:24 PM
Quote from: Berkut on November 27, 2016, 02:24:24 PM
Quote from: DGuller on November 27, 2016, 11:32:15 AM
Quote from: Berkut on November 27, 2016, 10:51:12 AM
Quote from: DGuller on November 27, 2016, 10:37:08 AM
like all political correctness, the inability to say the truth out loud leads to a lot of confused thinking and decision-making.
Quoted for posterity.
:unsure: Have I ever said anything different in that regard?
Nope.
:unsure: Usually people say that when they expect to use someone's words against them down the road.
True, but that was not my intent in this particular case.