Unless they plan on relegating her to a desk, this is dangerous and reckless.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/may/4/rebecca-wax-to-become-ny-firefighter-despite-faili/
QuoteRebecca Wax to become N.Y. firefighter despite failing crucial fitness test: report
By Jessica Chasmar - The Washington Times - Monday, May 4, 2015
A woman is set to join the New York City Fire Department despite failing a crucial physical fitness test, according to the New York Post.
Rebecca Wax, 33, is expected to graduate Tuesday from the Fire Academy and will become the first firefighter to have failed the Functional Skills Training (FST) test, the Post reported.
The grueling test requires potential recruits to climb six flights of stairs in full gear and drag dummies through tunnels with little visibility, among other tasks, and it's to be completed in under 18 minutes, according to the Post.
Despite many attempts over the academy's 18-week training course, Ms. Wax completed the test just once in more than 22 minutes, the Post reported.
Mayor Bill de Blasio has made the hiring of female firefighters a key issue in his administration — only 44 of the city's 10,500 firefighters are women, the Post reported.
Last December, Fire Commissioner Daniel Nigro told a City Council hearing on the FDNY's efforts to recruit women that he had changed the FST requirements to lower obstacles, the Post reported.
Since Ms. Wax had a high GPA on her academics, officials determined that made up for her FST deficiency, the report said.
Mr. Nigro refused to comment to the Post about Ms. Wax's fitness failure.
"Every one of our 305 probies have passed and will be graduating Tuesday," he said. "She has met the requirements."
Upon graduation, Ms. Wax will be assigned to a firehouse and tasked with the full duties of a firefighter, the Post reported.
She can always cook for them
Who cares, it's not like 4 minutes matter in life and death situations.
Women shouldn't have the vote either.
pics?
SJW! Political correctness gone mad! So on and so forth.
But seriously this is the sort of thing that just cannot be done even in the name of diversity...presuming the article is accurate.
Not really, no.
She can stay outside & operate the crane hose and climb the ladders to get the cats off the trees.
Quote from: Caliga on May 06, 2015, 07:09:08 AM
pics?
Google blocked on your computer?
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.dailymail.co.uk%2Fi%2Fpix%2F2015%2F05%2F04%2F00%2F284997AE00000578-0-Graduation_-a-7_1430694029382.jpg&hash=ab8d7a27b0f26304d726f99fa0b50c4a1ee9fe6e)
Quote from: Valmy on May 06, 2015, 07:13:49 AM
SJW! Political correctness gone mad! So on and so forth.
But seriously this is the sort of thing that just cannot be done even in the name of diversity...presuming the article is accurate.
I agree, but to be devil's advocate, it would require looking at the test in question. Does it represent reasonable requirements for what firefighters should be capable of? Or has the bar been raised with the intention of keeping women, who in general will be physically weaker than men, out? Also, is this used uniformly? I.e. do employed firefighters have to re-do this test regularly, and what happens when they can't make it anymore, e.g. due to age or too many donuts?
Quote from: Syt on May 06, 2015, 07:19:17 AM
Does it represent reasonable requirements for what firefighters should be capable of?
If it isn't then it shouldn't be a requirement. But I will leave it up to the responsible authorities running the Fire Department...er...I mean the Public Employees Union to decide.
Quote from: Syt on May 06, 2015, 07:19:17 AM
I agree, but to be devil's advocate, it would require looking at the test in question. Does it represent reasonable requirements for what firefighters should be capable of? Or has the bar been raised with the intention of keeping women, who in general will be physically weaker than men, out? Also, is this used uniformly? I.e. do employed firefighters have to re-do this test regularly, and what happens when they can't make it anymore, e.g. due to age or too many donuts?
Turns out the test had only, as of December of last year, been required for a total of two classes from the academy, and not at all for the previous 15. http://nypost.com/2014/12/11/fdny-drops-physical-test-requirement-amid-low-female-hiring-rate/ (http://nypost.com/2014/12/11/fdny-drops-physical-test-requirement-amid-low-female-hiring-rate/) that's when this decision was actually made:
QuoteThe Fire Department has stopped requiring probationary firefighters to pass a job-related physical-skills test before getting hired — a move that critics derided as a lowering of standards.
The move by first-year Fire Commissioner Daniel Nigro, which allows probies to fail components of the Functional Skills Training test but still graduate from the Fire Academy, comes amid criticism of the department's low hiring rate of women.
...
After the hearing, Nigro said passing the skills tests had only been required of the two most recent classes — and not for any of the 15 years before.
Quote from: Valmy on May 06, 2015, 07:13:49 AMBut seriously this is the sort of thing that just cannot be done even in the name of diversity...presuming the article is accurate.
i think if i were a fire department chief, i'd be thankful for an intelligent new crew member. not every fire task revolves around carrying near-dead bodies around.
One chick I was working out with was aiming to pass the exam to become a first-line firefighter. She was in really, really great shape. During the exam she had to run and climb stairs with oxygen tanks on her back, but one rolled off. She failed the exam because of that, and had to wait a whole year before trying again.
At least here, the exam for fireghters is the same for everyone, male and female. They require to bench press 135 pounds and do at least one pull-up, which for men is not very hard but for women it can be a real challenge.
Quote from: Drakken on May 06, 2015, 08:03:38 AM
One chick I was working out with was aiming to pass the exam to become a first-line firefighter. She was in really, really great shape. During the exam she had to run and climb stairs with oxygen tanks on her back, but one rolled off. She failed the exam because of that, and had to wait a whole year before trying again.
At least here, the exam for fireghters is the same for everyone, male and female. They require to bench press 135 pounds and do at least one pull-up, which for men is not very hard but for women it can be a real challenge.
That sounds like the test all NYC firefighters (male and female) have to pass just to get into the academy. The Functional Skills Test is above and beyond (and far more difficult than) that.
Quote from: LaCroix on May 06, 2015, 07:56:26 AM
i think if i were a fire department chief, i'd be thankful for an intelligent new crew member. not every fire task revolves around carrying near-dead bodies around.
Maybe. I don't claim to know how to run a fire department. I was speaking generally.
Quote from: Syt on May 06, 2015, 07:19:17 AM
Quote from: Valmy on May 06, 2015, 07:13:49 AM
SJW! Political correctness gone mad! So on and so forth.
But seriously this is the sort of thing that just cannot be done even in the name of diversity...presuming the article is accurate.
I agree, but to be devil's advocate, it would require looking at the test in question. Does it represent reasonable requirements for what firefighters should be capable of? Or has the bar been raised with the intention of keeping women, who in general will be physically weaker than men, out? Also, is this used uniformly? I.e. do employed firefighters have to re-do this test regularly, and what happens when they can't make it anymore, e.g. due to age or too many donuts?
just like in the army, they have physical evaluation to pass, and when they fail, they need to train harder and retake it. I don't think there's an automatic suspension for the first failure of a general fitness test, but if you can't get back in shape, you are assigned to a desk job or forced to retire.
No females (of the 29 participating) passed the Marine Infantry Officer Course this past month. So naturally DoD is putting pressure on the Marines to lower the standards.
Quote from: derspiess on May 06, 2015, 09:10:54 AM
No females (of the 29 participating) passed the Marine Infantry Officer Course this past month. So naturally DoD is putting pressure on the Marines to lower the standards.
Chicks. :rolleyes:
Just create an admin position for her when she fails on the job.
Quote from: Valmy on May 06, 2015, 07:13:49 AM
SJW! Political correctness gone mad! So on and so forth.
But seriously this is the sort of thing that just cannot be done even in the name of diversity...presuming the article is accurate.
Funny remember having this debate with my ex back in the early 90s at the height of political correctness. She was a bit of a feminist affirmative action junkie, and I used to tell her, that if she were ever in a fire I'm sure she'd want the best, strongest fireman to save her, and not someone who meets the quota.
Quote from: Legbiter on May 06, 2015, 09:13:44 AM
Just create an admin position for her when she fails on the job.
And by admin, you mean restroom cleaner.
Quote from: derspiess on May 06, 2015, 09:10:54 AM
No females (of the 29 participating) passed the Marine Infantry Officer Course this past month. So naturally DoD is putting pressure on the Marines to lower the standards.
i think the military would prefer a larger applicant pool. after all, jacksons and pattons are a dime a dozen. so, the more applicants, the better.
Quote from: derspiess on May 06, 2015, 09:10:54 AM
No females (of the 29 participating) passed the Marine Infantry Officer Course this past month. So naturally DoD is putting pressure on the Marines to lower the standards.
There never were 29 women in the course that graduated this past month. There were, in fact, two of them. Twenty-seven women tried to take the IOC as part of a thirty-month experiment (two more to qualify as combat intel officers). Only four passed the Combat Endurance Test at the start of IOC. None completed IOC.
Of course, the women who entered IOC did so only for fun and challenge; they couldn't hope to achieve anything but a positive comment on their next fitness report, and were losing out on experience in their Marine "day job."
Not sure how Spicey knows about DoD pressures on the Marine Corps that even Marines don't know exist.
Tim, can you stop posting alarmist clickbait articles for morons? If I wanted that, I would re-follow buzzfeed on my Facebook. Thanks.
Quote from: Martinus on May 06, 2015, 10:10:31 AM
Tim, can you stop posting alarmist clickbait articles for morons? If I wanted that, I would re-follow buzzfeed on my Facebook. Thanks.
Yeah I think you may be on to something here. The Washington Times website seems to be nothing but clickbait crap.
Quote from: Valmy on May 06, 2015, 10:17:29 AM
Quote from: Martinus on May 06, 2015, 10:10:31 AM
Tim, can you stop posting alarmist clickbait articles for morons? If I wanted that, I would re-follow buzzfeed on my Facebook. Thanks.
Yeah I think you may be on to something here. The Washington Times website seems to be nothing but clickbait crap.
Indeed. Turns out that this "crucial" test has only been crucial for two academy classes. I don't think better performance on a test would have saved any of the 341 firefighters killed on 9/11, and they represent more than 90% of the firefighter deaths in the 21st century.
Seems like a test designated as "crucial" was only made mandatory after a record number of female firefighters (four) graduated in 2012.
Quote from: LaCroix on May 06, 2015, 09:21:18 AM
Quote from: derspiess on May 06, 2015, 09:10:54 AM
No females (of the 29 participating) passed the Marine Infantry Officer Course this past month. So naturally DoD is putting pressure on the Marines to lower the standards.
i think the military would prefer a larger applicant pool. after all, jacksons and pattons are a dime a dozen. so, the more applicants, the better.
Lowering the standards only lead to failures on the field of battle.