QuoteA billionaire businessman at the heart of a $2.6 billion state bank scam, the largest fraud case since the country's 1979 Islamic Revolution, was executed Saturday, state television reported.
Authorities put Mahafarid Amir Khosravi, also known as Amir Mansour Aria, to death at Evin prison, just north of the capital, Tehran, the station reported. The report said the execution came after Iran's Supreme Court upheld his death sentence.
http://www.haaretz.com/news/middle-east/1.592510
Sounds awesome, indeed. Here's the thing: stealing can be worse than killing. Defrauding folks out of $2.6 billion is worth about a thousand average persons' entire working lives. If they are never made whole (and often even if they are, given the costs and inefficiencies imposed in seeking justice) isn't that actually much worse than knifing one guy in an alley and taking his wallet?
My point is that you can define financial crimes in terms of hours of destroyed value--the hours of someone's mortal existence. It is very much akin to murder. The death penalty is appropriate if the amounts are large enough, because even if they amount to spreading a dozen or a hundred or a thousand deaths out over millions, it is stealing from us the time we have on this Earth.
Money isn't time. :rolleyes:
Iran and China sentence them to death, the US gives them a lifetime supply of handjobs from Yi. And they're the bad guys?
Ide and Seeds be whack yo.
Zombie Sulla approves of this method of finding businesses for the New President's Oligarch cronies to take over for a pittance.
Quote from: CountDeMoney on May 25, 2014, 08:11:36 AM
Iran and China sentence them to death, the US gives them a lifetime supply of handjobs from Yi. And they're the bad guys?
:face:
Quote from: Ideologue on May 25, 2014, 02:38:47 AM
Sounds awesome, indeed. Here's the thing: stealing can be worse than killing. Defrauding folks out of $2.6 billion is worth about a thousand average persons' entire working lives. If they are never made whole (and often even if they are, given the costs and inefficiencies imposed in seeking justice) isn't that actually much worse than knifing one guy in an alley and taking his wallet?
My point is that you can define financial crimes in terms of hours of destroyed value--the hours of someone's mortal existence. It is very much akin to murder. The death penalty is appropriate if the amounts are large enough, because even if they amount to spreading a dozen or a hundred or a thousand deaths out over millions, it is stealing from us the time we have on this Earth.
Now without looking it up, tell us exactly what Khosravi did that caused harm to others.
I think I was clearly making an argument about the application of the death penalty for economic crimes, following a full and fair public trial.
Quote from: Ideologue on May 25, 2014, 02:22:13 PM
I think I was clearly making an argument about the application of the death penalty for economic crimes, following a full and fair public trial.
Here, you get a full and fair public trial too, but then the Federal prosecutor is eventually hired by the defendants as counsel.
Quote from: Ideologue on May 25, 2014, 02:22:13 PM
I think I was clearly making an argument about the application of the death penalty for economic crimes, following a full and fair public trial.
Such as, for example, failing to pay sales tax on internet purchases.
I paid my sales taxes for 2012.
As far as I can tell, you're the only one that does.
The more important question, the one that Seedy is incapable of answering, is what constitutes an "economic crime."
Quote from: Admiral Yi on May 25, 2014, 03:12:54 PM
The more important question, the one that Seedy is incapable of answering, is what constitutes an "economic crime."
Cratering the economy of the western world and walking away with the spoils. Answered, shitbag.
Quote from: CountDeMoney on May 25, 2014, 03:14:33 PM
Cratering the economy of the western world and walking away with the spoils. Answered, shitbag.
Let's see. The shareholders and management Lehman Brothers, Washington Mutual, IndyBank, Merryl Lynch, AIG, Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, Countrywide, and others lent money that didn't get repaid (or sold default insurance they couldn't pay), so that could be described as cratering the economy. However they all went under, so it's hard to say they walked away with the spoils. However, by that logic anyone who lent money that wasn't repaid could be said to have contributed to cratering the economy.
Shitbag.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on May 25, 2014, 03:12:54 PM
As far as I can tell, you're the only one that does.
The more important question, the one that Seedy is incapable of answering, is what constitutes an "economic crime."
Fraud is an economic crime. Violating securities regulations would be an economic crime. Wage theft would be an economic crime. Hiring illegal workers would be an economic crime. Failing to adhere to OSHA guidelines would be an economic crime. There are already many economic crimes. They are not, however, sufficiently prosecuted or carry sufficient punishments.
Wage theft?
So to be clear, are you in favor of the death penalty for all those things?
Depends on the severity of the harm, reversibility of the harm, mitigating factors, and all sorts of other nuanced questions that would be considered by a sentencing judge.
Plus, the type of white collar criminal we're talking about is generally not the impulsive and desperate street criminal against whom the death penalty holds comparatively little deterrent value (there was an interesting thought piece I read about how a lot of stereotypically poor behaviors, including criminality, could be explained by a framework that they value the utility of their continued existence as negative, and I think this has some predictive power).
We're talking about generally intelligent people who can do rational cost-benefit calculations and fear can in fact keep them in line.
It seems that your line is somewhat different than Seedy's "death to bankers."
Are there people who you think have committed white collar crimes and gotten off too easily?
Ken Lay. Bernie Madoff. Erwin Chemerinsky.
You think Bernie Madoff's 3,000 year sentence was too light?
Well, I don't believe in prisons.
Quote from: Ideologue on May 25, 2014, 02:38:47 AM
Sounds awesome, indeed. Here's the thing: stealing can be worse than killing. Defrauding folks out of $2.6 billion is worth about a thousand average persons' entire working lives. If they are never made whole (and often even if they are, given the costs and inefficiencies imposed in seeking justice) isn't that actually much worse than knifing one guy in an alley and taking his wallet?
My point is that you can define financial crimes in terms of hours of destroyed value--the hours of someone's mortal existence. It is very much akin to murder. The death penalty is appropriate if the amounts are large enough, because even if they amount to spreading a dozen or a hundred or a thousand deaths out over millions, it is stealing from us the time we have on this Earth.
Congratulations, you just described the economy from that terrible Justin Timberlake movie. :P
We all agree Friends with Benefits was awful, but it wasn't a Stalinist dystopia.
Quote from: Sheilbh on May 25, 2014, 10:35:56 PM
We all agree Friends with Benefits was awful, but it wasn't a Stalinist dystopia.
:lol:
Quote from: Sheilbh on May 25, 2014, 10:35:56 PM
We all agree Friends with Benefits was awful, but it wasn't a Stalinist dystopia.
Actually, I was talking about this particular gem:
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fen%2Fe%2Fe0%2FIntimefairuse.jpg&hash=f7b8bc45e4a2d34f31382410f420b9015a992471)
Hey that movie wasn't so bad. At least not in a day drinking in a beach house whilst sunburnt sort of way. :blush:
It's not Andrew Niccol's worst movie... -_-
I have a friend who's made everyone he knows watch Lord of War at least twice :mellow:
Lord of War is not Nicolas Cage's worst movie. I doubt it's even in the bottom half.
It actually had some passable moments. Namely, all the scenes with the African warlord.
I like Lord of War quite a bit. Uneven, but filled with great moments throughout. The opening credits from the POV of a bullet are great, for example.
Simone and The Host are far worse Niccol films, for example. Heck, I don't think Lord of War is nowhere near his worst films, it's probably in the middle of the pack.
Nicolas Cage's worst movie? Easy, The Wicker man. It's also one of the worst remakes ever.
It can't be that easy, he also starred in Knowing.
You're both wrong. Windtalkers. Holy fucking shit.
In Time is a masterpiece.
Quote from: Siege on May 26, 2014, 10:35:44 AM
In Time is a masterpiece.
That's not a Nick Cage movie.
Quote from: Siege on May 26, 2014, 10:35:44 AM
In Time is a masterpiece.
About Time? Yes. In Time? Not so much.
Quote from: CountDeMoney on May 26, 2014, 09:39:15 AM
You're both wrong. Windtalkers. Holy fucking shit.
Ugh. I went to the theater to see that one. :x
Quote from: Razgovory on May 26, 2014, 05:36:40 PM
Quote from: CountDeMoney on May 26, 2014, 09:39:15 AM
You're both wrong. Windtalkers. Holy fucking shit.
Ugh. I went to the theater to see that one. :x
Windtalkers was so bad, even Native Americans came out of that movie, saying, "fuck, even when they
try to be complimentary, the White Man still shits on us."
I saw Leaving Las Vegas recently. It was a startling reminder of a time when Nicolas Cage was an exciting actor. Sort of like when an elderly relative makes a racist remark and you have to remember the past was a very different place.
Quote from: Sheilbh on May 26, 2014, 05:42:57 PM
I saw Leaving Las Vegas recently.
Worst. First. Date. Movie. EVER.
Quote from: CountDeMoney on May 26, 2014, 05:48:07 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on May 26, 2014, 05:42:57 PM
I saw Leaving Las Vegas recently.
Worst. First. Date. Movie. EVER.
I have a friend who went on a first date to see Shame.
Never saw him again. Overall I think he's made better choices.
Great Sheryl Crow song though! :w00t:
Quote from: Sheilbh on May 26, 2014, 05:50:58 PM
Quote from: CountDeMoney on May 26, 2014, 05:48:07 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on May 26, 2014, 05:42:57 PM
I saw Leaving Las Vegas recently.
Worst. First. Date. Movie. EVER.
I have a friend who went on a first date to see Shame.
Never saw him again. Overall I think he's made better choices.
That does seem like a very bad idea. haha.
Quote from: Sheilbh on May 26, 2014, 05:50:58 PM
Quote from: CountDeMoney on May 26, 2014, 05:48:07 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on May 26, 2014, 05:42:57 PM
I saw Leaving Las Vegas recently.
Worst. First. Date. Movie. EVER.
I have a friend who went on a first date to see Shame.
Never saw him again. Overall I think he's made better choices.
Lol wow.
Could be worse, could be Irreversible.
'...So. Fancy a nightcap?'
'No. And fuck off.'
Worst first date movie I ever went to was Sophie's Choice.
I saw 2046 on a date which was lovely. He decided to follow it up though by showing me Dogville in his apartment. He then wondered why I wasn't feeling particularly amorous.
Also, btw, you all go on some snobby-ass dates. Steve McQueen? Wong Kar-Wai? Lars von Trier?
Maybe I do need to move to the city.
Quote from: Ideologue on May 26, 2014, 08:01:01 PM
Maybe I do need to move to the city.
Yes you do. You really really really do :) :contract:
Also you might like Ryan Avent's Kindle single, 'The Gated City'.
Quote from: Ideologue on May 26, 2014, 08:01:01 PM
Maybe I do need to move to the city.
Yes, yes you do.
By the way, having done a quick survey I will say that if you like skinny Asian girls, Seoul seems to be the place to be. Personally, I'm finding Taipei more comfortable and Tokyo more exciting, but Seoul seems to have a higher ratio of skinny-and-pretty girls (and a higher frequency of advertisement for plastic surgery as well).
Certainly, the dating and cultural opportunities are better than what North Dakota is likely to offer.