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General Category => Off the Record => Gaming HQ => Topic started by: Syt on July 22, 2021, 02:26:03 AM

Title: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Syt on July 22, 2021, 02:26:03 AM
https://news.bloomberglaw.com/daily-labor-report/activision-blizzard-sued-by-california-over-frat-boy-culture

QuoteActivision Blizzard Sued Over 'Frat Boy' Culture, Harassment

Video game giant Activision Blizzard Inc., maker of games including World of Warcraft and Diablo, fosters a "frat boy" culture in which female employees are subjected to constant sexual harassment, unequal pay, and retaliation, according to a lawsuit filed by the California Department of Fair Employment and Housing.

A two-year investigation by the state agency found that the company discriminated against female employees in terms and conditions of employment, including compensation, assignment, promotion, and termination. Company leadership consistently failed to take steps to prevent discrimination, harassment, and retaliation, the agency said.

According to the complaint, filed Tuesday in the Los Angeles Superior Court, female employees make up around 20% of the Activision workforce, and are subjected to a "pervasive frat boy workplace culture," including "cube crawls," in which male employees "drink copious amounts of alcohol as they crawl their way through various cubicles in the office and often engage in inappropriate behavior toward female employees."

The agency alleges male employees play video games during the workday while delegating responsibilities to female employees, engage in sexual banter, and joke openly about rape, among other things.

Female employees allege being held back from promotions because of the possibility they might become pregnant, being criticized for leaving to pick their children up from daycare, and being kicked out of lactation rooms so male colleagues could use the room for meetings, the complaint says.

Female employees working for the World of Warcraft team noted that male employees and supervisors would hit on them, make derogatory comments about rape, and otherwise engage in demeaning behavior, the agency alleges.

The suit also points to a female Activision employee who took her own life while on a company trip with her male supervisor. The employee had been subjected to intense sexual harassment prior to her death, including having nude photos passed around at a company holiday party, the complaint says.

The agency seeks an injunction forcing compliance with workplace protections, as well as unpaid wages, pay adjustments, back pay, and lost wages and benefits for female employees.

"We value diversity and strive to foster a workplace that offers inclusivity for everyone. There is no place in our company or industry, or any industry, for sexual misconduct or harassment of any kind," a spokesperson for Activision Blizzard said in a statement. "We take every allegation seriously and investigate all claims. In cases related to misconduct, action was taken to address the issue."

"The DFEH includes distorted, and in many cases false, descriptions of Blizzard's past. We have been extremely cooperative with the DFEH throughout their investigation, including providing them with extensive data and ample documentation, but they refused to inform us what issues they perceived," the statement continued.

"The picture the DFEH paints is not the Blizzard workplace of today," the company said.

Causes of Action: Employment discrimination because of sex; retaliation; failure to prevent discrimination and harassment; unequal pay.

Relief: Compensatory damages; punitive damages; unpaid wages; injunctive relief; declaratory relief; equitable relief; pre-judgment interest; attorneys' fees; costs.

Attorneys: Internal counsel represents the Department of Fair Employment and Housing.

The case is Calif. Dep't of Fair Emp. & Housing v. Activision Blizzard Inc., Cal. Super. Ct., No. 21stcv26571, 7/20/21.


The court filing: https://aboutblaw.com/YJw

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E63CsCxWUAIKT9s?format=png&name=small)

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E63CsptXEAImUOW?format=png&name=small)

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E63MsZSXEAEaAMe?format=png&name=small)

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E64UgRBXMAAUHXG?format=jpg&name=small)

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E63PqAFXEAoWk7B?format=jpg&name=small)

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E63PcOpXMAU2yFJ?format=png&name=small)

"unaccountable state bureaucrats"
SoCiaLisM!!!11  :rolleyes:

Question to the law people here - would the DFEH file such a high profile case without being reasonably sure they have a leg to stand on? :unsure:
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: The Brain on July 22, 2021, 02:39:05 AM
Quote"The picture the DFEH paints is not the Blizzard workplace of today," the company said.

Even the company doesn't deny that they've been naughty.

If the allegations are essentially correct, then I think that the company and responsible individuals ought to be punished in way that hurts and might make others of their kind reconsider their stance on basic decency.

Edit: now I read the Blizzard statement at the bottom. Wow. They appear to be unhinged. And even if you ignore the insane second paragraph, it's interesting that in the first paragraph they talk about measures they've taken to change the culture, but they tellingly don't say that they've actually changed the culture. Measures mean nothing. Results do.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Syt on July 22, 2021, 02:56:51 AM
Tbf, I don't know in which order the paragraphs were published.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: The Minsky Moment on July 23, 2021, 10:08:47 AM
Quote from: Syt on July 22, 2021, 02:26:03 AM
Question to the law people here - would the DFEH file such a high profile case without being reasonably sure they have a leg to stand on? :unsure:

On the one hand, it's not encouraging that the DFEH refers to "Bill Crosby".  Are they referring to a comedian, a former collaborator with Stephen Stills and Graham Nash, or some chimera of the two?

On the other hand, Brain is right about the bizarre company response, which combines an admission of past guilt with an unrepentant and hysterical attack on the agency.  Reading that makes the DFEH allegations seem plausible.

It could come down to which party proves the most incompetent; at the moment, Blizzard appears to have taken a firm lead but I wouldn't count DFEH out just yet.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: crazy canuck on July 23, 2021, 11:02:11 AM
I don't understand why this is a matter for the court.  Doesn't the state have an administrative body to rule on such things?

This is something that would go before our Human Rights Tribunal or Worksafe (the administrative body which regulates safe workplaces, including being harassment free).  Those decisions would then be subject to judicial review by the court if there was some error in the initial decision or direction.  The court would not be the initial decision maker.

Seems a bit cumbersome to require a court process before meaning remedies can be applied when there is admitted bad behaviour.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Syt on July 24, 2021, 11:18:04 AM
An email by Fran Townsend, an Activision Blizzard compliance executive, to the staff. She joined in March this year.

From 2004-2007 she was Homeland Security Advisor for GWB, and she was on the shortlist to replace Comey at the FBI. :unsure:

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E6_yQTsXoAAUIOG?format=png&name=medium)

The email was apparently not well received.

https://www.pcgamer.com/uk/activision-blizzard-employees-denounce-corporate-statements-we-are-here-angry-and-not-so-easily-silenced/

QuoteActivision Blizzard employees denounce corporate statements: 'We are here, angry, and not so easily silenced'

Over 20 current Activision Blizzard employees, including World of Warcraft lead game designer Jeremy Feasel, have publicly criticized the company's response to the sexual harassment and discrimination lawsuit filed against it earlier this week. Some WoW developers also stopped work today "in solidarity with the women that came forward," Feasel said.

The suit, filed by a California government agency, alleges that women at the company have faced "constant sexual harassment" and discrimination, especially women of color. The response from Activision Blizzard executives has been inconsistent. In its first statement to press, the company called the suit "distorted, and in many cases false" and characterized the agency behind it as a group of "unaccountable bureaucrats." In an internal email, chief compliance officer Fran Townsend also said that the suit "presented a distorted and untrue picture" of Activision Blizzard, and criticized it for "including factually incorrect, old, and out of context stories."

Internal emails from Blizzard president J Allen Brack and Activision president Rob Kostich struck a different tone, calling the behavior alleged in the lawsuit "unacceptable" and "disturbing," although neither affirmed that such behavior has occurred at the company.

On social media, dozens of former employees expressed support for the stories told in the lawsuit and, in some cases, corroborated details. Now over 20 current Activision Blizzard employees have expressed public disapproval of Activision Blizzard's response to the suit, with dozens more showing support by retweeting their coworker's statements.

"Many of us will not be working today in solidarity with the women that came forward," wrote lead game designer Jeremy Feasel. "The statements made by [Activision Blizzard] do not represent us. We believe women, and we will continue to strive to do better and hold others accountable. Actions speak louder than words."

The World of Warcraft team has been "going through a mix of outrage and sorrow and hurt," said narrative designer Steve Danuser, who went on to say that he's interested in fixing the company and industry, not "corporate bullshit statements."

Many more employees expressed similar feelings:

"I'm unhappy with the corporate response up to this point," said game designer Brian Holinka. "I don't feel it represents me or what I believe in. Many of us have said this internally. It feels worth saying publicly."

"These past few days have made me furious at the COMPANY I work for, but so proud of the PEOPLE I work with," tweeted a user named Burk, who works at Blizzard as an associate producer. "Everyone is rallying together, listening, speaking out against the atrocious responses, and demanding action. We are here, angry, and not so easily silenced."

"I stand with the [Activision Blizzard] victims & believe their stories," tweeted Blizzard UX researcher Nikki Crenshaw. "To claim that these stories are 'factually incorrect' or 'untrue' is a slap in the face to current & former employees, & does not represent my core values."

"Really hope that Blizzard puts out a statement on this situation that I actually agree with and can support, and not more legal defense posturing," wrote Kyle Hartline, a server and live ops producer on World of Warcraft. "Because the stuff said so far is unacceptable and doesn't represent me. And I know I'm not alone in feeling that way here."

"I've heard horror stories all of which I know are true and shouldn't be dismissed," tweeted Elsbeth Larkin, a tools software engineer for World of Warcraft. "The fact that [Activision Blizzard] dismissed it not once but twice is appalling."

In addition to personal statements, many developers are also tweeting statements that read: "This tweet is my own and does not represent the views of my company. I do not support any attempt by AB to diminish the very real damage done to victims of harassment at Blizzard. We absolutely must hear and support the women at our company, both current and past."

At the time of writing, Activision Blizzard has not responded publicly to these expressions of distrust and frustration from employees. We've asked for comment from the company, and will have more as the story develops throughout the next week and beyond.

Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: The Brain on July 24, 2021, 11:29:39 AM
A list of what they have done, but nothing about what they have achieved. What a shocker. Also a shocker that firing people for unacceptable behavior is not on the list of things they've done.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Oexmelin on July 24, 2021, 11:54:43 AM
Having defended the use of torture by the US, Fran Townsend is well-placed to defending the undefendable, I guess.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Razgovory on July 24, 2021, 12:40:25 PM
It is good that employees are standing with their coworkers rather than victim blaming or simply ignoring the problem.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Sheilbh on July 24, 2021, 04:39:50 PM
Quote from: Oexmelin on July 24, 2021, 11:54:43 AM
Having defended the use of torture by the US, Fran Townsend is well-placed to defending the undefendable, I guess.
I don't want to go full anti-woke - but the combination of the security state and corporate "diversity and inclusion" efforts is gross and also a very 21st century thing.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: grumbler on July 24, 2021, 05:19:16 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on July 24, 2021, 04:39:50 PM
Quote from: Oexmelin on July 24, 2021, 11:54:43 AM
Having defended the use of torture by the US, Fran Townsend is well-placed to defending the undefendable, I guess.
I don't want to go full anti-woke - but the combination of the security state and corporate "diversity and inclusion" efforts is gross and also a very 21st century thing.

I can't think of another example of a high-level intel person going to work for a gaming company in HR/Legal, but am willing to see evidence that shows that this is a thing.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Sheilbh on July 24, 2021, 06:13:49 PM
It's not that it's common or to do with personnel, more distinctively 21st century - another example would be things like the CIA pride recruitment videos.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: grumbler on July 24, 2021, 09:51:25 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on July 24, 2021, 06:13:49 PM
It's not that it's common or to do with personnel, more distinctively 21st century - another example would be things like the CIA pride recruitment videos.

I don't know what "distinctively 21st century" even means in this context.  Arbitrary divisions of time only make sense for accounting purposes; they have no prescriptive effects.  Not many CIA recruitment videos in the 20th Century because there was no way to distribute them; YouTube was not founded until 2005, well into the 21st century.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: viper37 on July 26, 2021, 07:52:50 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on July 23, 2021, 11:02:11 AM
I don't understand why this is a matter for the court.  Doesn't the state have an administrative body to rule on such things?
If America was great again, these people would simply meet at dawn and duel it out.
Unfortunately, nowadays, it's a job for the courts.  Nothing is sacred anymore. :(
Seriously, I don't think I've ever heard of this concept (the Worksafe or Administrative tribunal for work related stuff) in the US.   I'm curious...
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: The Minsky Moment on July 26, 2021, 10:50:18 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on July 23, 2021, 11:02:11 AM
I don't understand why this is a matter for the court.  Doesn't the state have an administrative body to rule on such things?

This is something that would go before our Human Rights Tribunal or Worksafe (the administrative body which regulates safe workplaces, including being harassment free).  Those decisions would then be subject to judicial review by the court if there was some error in the initial decision or direction.  The court would not be the initial decision maker.

Seems a bit cumbersome to require a court process before meaning remedies can be applied when there is admitted bad behaviour.

Don't know how it works in California; every state does things their own way.

At the federal level, the EEOC does handle some complaints administratively, but most contested matters are litigated in the courts.  It is common for private disputes to be settled at the agency level, in which case the courts don't get involved.

As a practical matter, no private party that contests the charges, as Blizzard is doing here, would accept the kind of remedies being sought in this case without invoking their right to judicial review.

Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Syt on July 27, 2021, 12:43:37 AM
https://www.pcgamer.com/uk/more-than-1500-activision-blizzard-employees-condemn-company-leadership-call-for-compassion-for-victims/

QuoteMore than 1,500 Activision Blizzard employees condemn company leadership, call for 'compassion for victims'

More than 1,500 current and former employees of Activision Blizzard have signed a letter condemning the company's response to a lawsuit alleging discrimination, sexual harassment, and "frat boy" culture at the company. "The statements from Activision Blizzard, Inc. and their legal counsel ... are abhorrent and insulting to all that we believe our company should stand for," the employee statement reads.

The letter, which according to Kotaku was sent to managers today, was prompted by Activision Blizzard's response to the lawsuit, and in particular an internal memo issued by chief compliance officer Frances Townsend that dismissed the suit. Townsend claimed the lawsuit presented "a distorted and untrue picture of [Activision Blizzard], including factually incorrect, old, and out of context stories—some from more than a decade ago."

"We believe these statements have damaged our ongoing quest for equality inside and outside of our industry," the employee letter says. "Categorizing the claims that have been made as 'distorted, and in many cases false' creates a company atmosphere that disbelieves victims. It also casts doubt on our organizations' ability to hold abusers accountable for their actions and foster a safe environment for victims to come forward in the future. These statements make it clear that our leadership is not putting our values first."

"Our company executives have claimed that actions will be taken to protect us, but in the face of legal action—and the troubling official responses that followed—we no longer trust that our leaders will place employee safety above their own interests. To claim this is a 'truly meritless and irresponsible lawsuit,' while seeing so many current and former employees speak out about their own experiences regarding harassment and abuse, is simply unacceptable."

The letter calls for statements from Activision Blizzard executives that "recognize the seriousness of these allegations," and for Townsend to step down from her position as executive sponsor of the ABK [Activision Blizzard King] Employee Women's Network. The employees also want company leadership to work with them on new efforts to ensure that employees, and also members of the community, "have a safe place to speak out" about misconduct.

The number of signatories is continuing to grow and represents a significant portion of Activision Blizzard, which reported approximately 9,500 employees at the end of 2020. Employees have also been pushing back against the company's response on social media, and former Blizzard leaders including Mike Morhaime and Chris Metzen have apologized for failing to protect its employees.

I've seen criticism of Metzen's and Morhaime's apologies, questioning if they were as ignorant of the stuff as they claim to be.

Jason Schreier over on Bloomberg had another article chronicling the bad launch of the Warcraft 3 remake/remaster, and it basically comes down to: management didn't want to put the necessary resources into it and then cut its losses after release.

He has a more general overview in his newsletter:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/newsletters/2021-07-23/activision-blizzard-s-games-culture-crisis-runs-deep

QuoteBlizzard is one of the biggest names in video games, with a string of hits that made it the envy of the industry. That success has been the result of a unique company culture at the California-based game developer behind Diablo, Warcraft and StarCraft that prioritized great games above all else. But as we learned this week, that culture had a dark side.

On Tuesday, the California Department of Fair Employment and Housing filed a lawsuit against Blizzard's parent company, Activision Blizzard Inc., alleging discrimination against women through intense sexual harassment, unfair pay and retaliation. A spokesperson for Activision Blizzard described many of the claims as distorted or false.

Many of the allegations centered on Blizzard, which led several women who worked there to speak out on social media about their own awful experiences at the company. What was particularly painful for many of them, some said, was that they saw Blizzard as a dream job. They'd grown up admiring masterpieces like Diablo II and StarCraft and hoped to join a company that seemed idyllic, only to experience what they described as sexism and abuse when they arrived. Only a fraction of employees at Blizzard were women, according to the complaint, which made it feel at times like a frat house.

Veteran employees use language like "bleed Blizzard blue" to describe their love for the company. The result was a stream of acclaimed and influential titles, but no game would be worth the sort of treatment described in the lawsuit.

Activision has spent the past few years pushing for changes to Blizzard, though it appeared to be focused on less rotten aspects of the culture. Activision's growing influence has instead impacted the parts of Blizzard that were universally beloved.

I wrote Thursday about how Activision's push for Blizzard to cut costs and focus on big hits helped lead to the company's first ever flop last year— Warcraft III: Reforged, a remake of an earlier classic. The game was smaller and less lucrative than Diablo IV and Overwatch 2, expected to be smash hits, so it became less of a priority at Blizzard. The result was a well-documented disaster.

But the game isn't the only thing Activision has been meddling with at Blizzard.

Look to France

Last year, Blizzard informed employees that it was shutting down its Versailles office, which was largely responsible for localization, marketing and customer service in Europe. This kicked off a lengthy negotiation period with the union that ended last week. As part of this process, the company sent out a letter to affected employees justifying why it had to fire them all. The document, which was reviewed by Bloomberg, is full of criticisms of Blizzard's finances and interesting numbers that reflect Activision's future plans.

A few stats from the letter:

- Blizzard's staff was made up of about 52% game developers as of December 2019. For comparison, the company said, in March 2020, Ubisoft had 85% game developers, and Take-Two was 77%. The conclusion: "Blizzard is therefore lagging behind its competitors."
- In 2019, 40% of Blizzard's revenue came from microtransactions—those in-game purchases that irk players but can significantly boost a game's value. But across the industry, microtransactions made up 78% of video game companies' revenue, the letter said.
- On a similar note, only 12% of Blizzard's 2019 revenue came from mobile games, whereas other companies are making more than half of their revenue from mobile. Activision wants to change that.

This push may be mixed news for Blizzard fans. More development staff could mean more games, which might please players who are accustomed to waiting years between new Blizzard releases. But an emphasis on microtransactions and mobile games won't be welcome news to fans who prefer to play on PCs and consoles or spend money on a game just once.

Plus, big cultural changes can unfold in more subtle ways. One former Blizzard employee recently told me that they knew things were starting to change when a team's sponsored lunches were canceled. Another said they started seeing finance people in meetings where they wouldn't have normally been. These small moves can add up to large shifts as veteran Blizzard employees worry about the company's culture changing from, make great games first and the money will follow to, worry about money—all the time. The company's emphasis on billion-dollar franchises has already led staff to leave and pursue independent development.

"We are grateful to our Versailles employees for their dedicated service in support of our player communities and will continue to support them through the measures agreed," an Activision Blizzard spokesman said.

Great games come first

Under co-founder and former Chief Executive Officer Mike Morhaime, who left the company in 2018, Blizzard's development decisions had always been made with players' best interests in mind. When it became clear in 2012 that Diablo III's controversial "real money" auction house was ruining the game's balance by allowing people to pay for the best gear, Morhaime decided to remove it. When the card game Hearthstone seemed likely to fail and was almost canceled, Blizzard took a risk and stuck with it anyway, leading to a massive hit when it came out in 2014.

But since 2017, with a slow release schedule and World of Warcraft subscribers declining, Blizzard's revenue at times hasn't lived up to Activision's expectations. A few high-profile failures, such as the costly cancelation of the online game Titan, gave Activision's executives a foot in the door to exert more control. And Morhaime's departure left a massive void. His successor, J. Allen Brack, was named president rather than CEO—a reflection of Blizzard's reduced power and autonomy. (Activision boss Bobby Kotick is now the company's one and only CEO.)

In an email to staff last night, Brack called the labor lawsuit's allegations "extremely troubling," adding, "I disdain 'bro culture.'" But internally, some Blizzard staff have resurfaced a 2010 video showing Brack and several other top developers laughing off a question from a woman asking for World of Warcraft's female characters to be less sexualized. Culture issues existed long before Activision began intervening in Blizzard's operations.

Kotick's Activision will look to find a way to maintain the degree of quality Blizzard is known for, while addressing complaints about the culture and, of course, fortifying the bottom line. Blizzard is certainly changing, but perhaps not in the ways it really needs to.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: crazy canuck on July 27, 2021, 11:34:28 AM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on July 26, 2021, 10:50:18 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on July 23, 2021, 11:02:11 AM
I don't understand why this is a matter for the court.  Doesn't the state have an administrative body to rule on such things?

This is something that would go before our Human Rights Tribunal or Worksafe (the administrative body which regulates safe workplaces, including being harassment free).  Those decisions would then be subject to judicial review by the court if there was some error in the initial decision or direction.  The court would not be the initial decision maker.

Seems a bit cumbersome to require a court process before meaning remedies can be applied when there is admitted bad behaviour.

Don't know how it works in California; every state does things their own way.

At the federal level, the EEOC does handle some complaints administratively, but most contested matters are litigated in the courts.  It is common for private disputes to be settled at the agency level, in which case the courts don't get involved.

As a practical matter, no private party that contests the charges, as Blizzard is doing here, would accept the kind of remedies being sought in this case without invoking their right to judicial review.

I agree that judicial review would likely follow if it was an administrative decision but that is a lot more efficient from the perspective of court time.   
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: The Minsky Moment on July 27, 2021, 02:26:07 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on July 27, 2021, 11:34:28 AM
I agree that judicial review would likely follow if it was an administrative decision but that is a lot more efficient from the perspective of court time.   

What DFEH is doing in this case has nothing to do with administrative efficiency.  They are sending a message and not just to Activision.  To the whole industry.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: crazy canuck on July 27, 2021, 02:37:38 PM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on July 27, 2021, 02:26:07 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on July 27, 2021, 11:34:28 AM
I agree that judicial review would likely follow if it was an administrative decision but that is a lot more efficient from the perspective of court time.   

What DFEH is doing in this case has nothing to do with administrative efficiency.  They are sending a message and not just to Activision.  To the whole industry.

And that is part of what I find a bit surprising.  That a government agency can sue in court to enforce its own regulatory framework.  It has a strong stench of abuse of process.  Why not just exercise the statutory power they have?  And if that is lacking - what are are they in court?  As an outside observer this process is odd.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: The Minsky Moment on July 27, 2021, 08:45:50 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on July 27, 2021, 02:37:38 PM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on July 27, 2021, 02:26:07 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on July 27, 2021, 11:34:28 AM
I agree that judicial review would likely follow if it was an administrative decision but that is a lot more efficient from the perspective of court time.   

What DFEH is doing in this case has nothing to do with administrative efficiency.  They are sending a message and not just to Activision.  To the whole industry.

And that is part of what I find a bit surprising.  That a government agency can sue in court to enforce its own regulatory framework.  It has a strong stench of abuse of process.  Why not just exercise the statutory power they have?  And if that is lacking - what are are they in court?  As an outside observer this process is odd.

Employment commissions in the US perform several functions.  On the one hand they investigate and attempt to "conciliate" (settle) individual private employment claims.  This is more of a mediative/neutral function.  Some of them also arbitrate claims by state employees - this an arbitration role.  And finally, they have a prosecutorial-like function - they investigate allegations of pervasive and flagrant violations of discrimination laws and bring cases if they find such violations have occurred.  The stautory framework embraces all of these functions.

This case falls into category 3.  The agency investigated multiple allegations of wrongdoing and found what it believed be widespread and pervasive firm-wide bad conduct.  The case is brought explicitly in the public interest from remedial and deterrence functions.  There is no abuse of process because the agency is authorized by statute to bring such cases and the court system provides a fair and neutral forum.  (at least in theory)
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: viper37 on July 28, 2021, 09:51:12 AM
So Blizzard has seen the light.  Well, a more cynical person would say they no longer have any choice.

QuoteThis has been a difficult and upsetting week.

    I want to recognize and thank all those who have come forward in the past and in recent days. I so appreciate your courage. Every voice matters - and we will do a better job of listening now, and in the future.

    Our initial responses to the issues we face together, and to your concerns, were, quite frankly, tone deaf.

    It is imperative that we acknowledge all perspectives and experiences and respect the feelings of those who have been mistreated in any way. I am sorry that we did not provide the right empathy and understanding.

    Many of you have told us that active outreach comes from caring so deeply for the Company. That so many people have reached out and shared thoughts, suggestions, and highlighted opportunities for improvement is a powerful reflection of how you care for our communities of colleagues and players – and for each other. Ensuring that we have a safe and welcoming work environment is my highest priority. The leadership team has heard you loud and clear.

    We are taking swift action to be the compassionate, caring company you came to work for and to ensure a safe environment. There is no place anywhere at our Company for discrimination, harassment, or unequal treatment of any kind.

    We will do everything possible to make sure that together, we improve and build the kind of inclusive workplace that is essential to foster creativity and inspiration.

    I have asked the law firm WilmerHale to conduct a review of our policies and procedures to ensure that we have and maintain best practices to promote a respectful and inclusive workplace. This work will begin immediately. The WilmerHale team will be led by Stephanie Avakian, who is a member of the management team at WilmerHale and was most recently the Director of the United States Securities and Exchange Commission's Division of Enforcement.

    We encourage anyone with an experience you believe violates our policies or in any way made you uncomfortable in the workplace to use any of our many existing channels for reporting or to reach out to Stephanie. She and her team at WilmerHale will be available to speak with you on a confidential basis and can be reached at [email protected] or 202-247-2725. Your outreach will be kept confidential. Of course, NO retaliation will be tolerated.

    We are committed to long-lasting change. Effective immediately, we will be taking the following actions.

        Employee Support. We will continue to investigate each and every claim and will not hesitate to take decisive action. To strengthen our capabilities in this area we are adding additional senior staff and other resources to both the Compliance team and the Employee Relations team.
        Listening Sessions. We know many of you have inspired ideas on how to improve our culture. We will be creating safe spaces, moderated by third parties, for you to speak out and share areas for improvement.
        Personnel Changes. We are immediately evaluating managers and leaders across the Company. Anyone found to have impeded the integrity of our processes for evaluating claims and imposing appropriate consequences will be terminated.
        Hiring Practices. Earlier this year I sent an email requiring all hiring managers to ensure they have diverse candidate slates for all open positions. We will be adding compliance resources to ensure that our hiring managers are in fact adhering to this directive.
        In-game Changes. We have heard the input from employee and player communities that some of our in-game content is inappropriate. We are removing that content.

    Your well-being remains my priority and I will spare no company resource ensuring that our company has the most welcoming, comfortable, and safe culture possible.

    You have my unwavering commitment that we will improve our company together, and we will be the most inspiring, inclusive entertainment company in the world.

    Yours sincerely,

    Bobby
https://kotaku.com/activision-ceo-bobby-kotick-comments-on-harassment-alle-1847374627
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Grey Fox on July 28, 2021, 10:07:17 AM
Kotick's long con is threaten here so of course he's responding.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Syt on July 28, 2021, 10:14:58 AM
Eh, I'll believe it when meaningful change happens. Until then it's a executive saying what he needs to say in hopes that the stock price stays up (it apparently dropped 9% after news of the walkout).
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: The Brain on July 28, 2021, 10:32:24 AM
From the looks of it a major purge seems necessary (but not sufficient), including removing all senior managers, if the owners actually want to change the company.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: The Minsky Moment on July 28, 2021, 11:18:31 AM
Quote from: viper37 on July 28, 2021, 09:51:12 AM
So Blizzard has seen the light.  Well, a more cynical person would say they no longer have any choice.

The jump off a cliff strategy still attracts some proponents, but for some reason they tend to lack staying power.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Darth Wagtaros on July 28, 2021, 01:45:09 PM
Gaming companies are shit to work for, by damn near every account I've read, seen, or heard.  They grind up young devs looking for a first joba nd then fire them as soon as the time comes to give them a raise.

This is just another aspect of a poisonous industry.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: crazy canuck on July 28, 2021, 02:03:03 PM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on July 27, 2021, 08:45:50 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on July 27, 2021, 02:37:38 PM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on July 27, 2021, 02:26:07 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on July 27, 2021, 11:34:28 AM
I agree that judicial review would likely follow if it was an administrative decision but that is a lot more efficient from the perspective of court time.   

What DFEH is doing in this case has nothing to do with administrative efficiency.  They are sending a message and not just to Activision.  To the whole industry.

And that is part of what I find a bit surprising.  That a government agency can sue in court to enforce its own regulatory framework.  It has a strong stench of abuse of process.  Why not just exercise the statutory power they have?  And if that is lacking - what are are they in court?  As an outside observer this process is odd.

Employment commissions in the US perform several functions.  On the one hand they investigate and attempt to "conciliate" (settle) individual private employment claims.  This is more of a mediative/neutral function.  Some of them also arbitrate claims by state employees - this an arbitration role.  And finally, they have a prosecutorial-like function - they investigate allegations of pervasive and flagrant violations of discrimination laws and bring cases if they find such violations have occurred.  The stautory framework embraces all of these functions.

This case falls into category 3.  The agency investigated multiple allegations of wrongdoing and found what it believed be widespread and pervasive firm-wide bad conduct.  The case is brought explicitly in the public interest from remedial and deterrence functions.  There is no abuse of process because the agency is authorized by statute to bring such cases and the court system provides a fair and neutral forum.  (at least in theory)

We do it a bit differently.  An administrative tribunal separate from the investigative/prosecutorial group performs function 3.  That decision is then subject to judicial review.  It removes a lot of administrative clutter from the court.  Also you get a tribunal that knows its own jurisprudence rather than trying to educate a judge about the issues involved.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: viper37 on July 28, 2021, 07:01:48 PM
Quote from: Syt on July 28, 2021, 10:14:58 AM
Eh, I'll believe it when meaningful change happens. Until then it's a executive saying what he needs to say in hopes that the stock price stays up (it apparently dropped 9% after news of the walkout).
of course, it's the main reason he's doing it.  But I feel like, at this point, Blizzard will have no choice but to implement significant changes.  And hiring that lawyer firm to investigate each case seems like a step in the right direction.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Syt on July 29, 2021, 10:03:43 AM
https://hard-drive.net/bobby-kotick-announces-new-apology-letters-will-be-written-by-alternating-teams-at-treyarch-and-infinity-ward-each-year-for-foreseeable-future/

QuoteBobby Kotick Announces New Apology Letters Will Be Written by Alternating Teams at Treyarch and Infinity Ward Each Year for Foreseeable Future

SANTA MONICA, Calif. — Following a massive employee strike at Activision Blizzard due to years of harsh treatment and sexual harassment, Bobby Kotick has written a letter to employees to apologize for the company's actions and announce that a new apology letter will be released each year, written in alternating years by Treyarch and Infinity Ward.

"We already have these guys on an alternating schedule producing new Call of Duty games each year, so why not have them also work on our new yearly apology letters to employees?" Kotick asked in his letter. "It's a very similar process to making Call of Duty, really. You don't need to recreate the entire letter each time, you just need to work from the base created in the previous letter, updating some language to fit modern events and trends. They just have to make sure that they stick to the core theme of the apology letter series: that we're very sorry, we investigated this ourselves and found no wrongdoing, and that we're committed to some vague change in the future."

In order to make sure that the apology letters stay true to the standards of Activision Blizzard, Kotick has given himself the role of Final Proofreader, a job that comes with a $50 million yearly salary.

:XD:

(In case you find the 50 million p.a. a bit silly ... seems in line with his IRL paycheck: https://www.marketwatch.com/story/activision-blizzard-pulls-out-a-win-on-say-on-pay-proposal-after-delaying-vote-for-a-week-11624299616 )
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Solmyr on July 30, 2021, 03:05:40 AM
Fuck Blizzard.

https://kotaku.com/inside-blizzard-developers-infamous-bill-cosby-suite-1847378762
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Syt on July 30, 2021, 09:56:48 AM
Meanwhile in Ubisoftland:

https://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2021-07-30-ubisoft-group-says-yves-guillemot-has-sidelined-its-demands-as-ceo-responds-to-open-letter

QuoteUbisoft group says Yves Guillemot has "sidelined" its demands as CEO responds to open letter

Over 1,000 current and former staff claim Assassin's Creed publisher "continues to protect and promote known offenders and their allies"

The group behind the open letter to Ubisoft's management has criticised CEO Yves Guillemot for failing to address their points and demands.

The original letter was published earlier this week, and called for the Assassin's Creed publisher to remove all offenders from the company and for industry-wide collaboration on new reporting processes.

GamesIndustry.biz has been told that, at the time of writing, over 1,000 current and former Ubisoft staff from 32 of the publisher's global studios have signed the letter.

CEO Yves Guillemot reacted to this letter in an email sent to all Ubisoft staff, as shared by Axios' Stephen Totilo on Twitter. GamesIndustry.biz has verified the contents of this email.

The letter mostly reiterated previous statements from Guillemot -- in particular the one he released in the wake of the Télégramme article -- saying that the company "made important progress over the past year." It also repeated Ubisoft's initial statement following the open letter about taking "the issues it raises seriously."

The statement also listed changes at the company over the past year, once again mostly reiterating measures that had been previously announced. It did add that a "new company wide survey" will be launched by the end of 2021 and that the company is currently looking for a new VP of global employee relations.

Guillemot added that Ubisoft will provide an update on these matters in Q3, "including next steps on the Values Project, D&I and [its] HR roadmap."

"Yesterday's letter expresses concern from employees who want to make Ubisoft a better place," Guillemot said. "We have heard clearly from this letter that not everyone is confident in the processes that have been put in place to manage misconduct reports. This is a top priority for Anika [Grant, chief people officer], who continues to ensure they are robust and independent."

Guillemot concluded by offering for any member of staff to reach out to him personally, or other members of management.

However, the group behind the original letter has reached out to GamesIndustry.biz with a final response, in which it says the "majority of our demands were sidelined and few of our points seem to have been addressed."

"We are aware that the company has made some improvements, and we are happy to hear that Yves and the leadership team agree that it is not enough," the group continued.

"However, Ubisoft continues to protect and promote known offenders and their allies. We see management continuing to avoid this issue. It is also worth clarifying that an invitation to reach out to company management personally is not the same as having a collective seat at the table."

The group said it "[looks] forward to a full response" and reiterated the issues and demands the letter raised, emphasising the need for cross-industry collaboration on ground rules and processes for how these offences should be handled in future.

"By being the first to start this collaboration Ubisoft has the opportunity to be at the forefront of creating a better future for the games industry," the letter concluded. "We demand that this work be done in collaboration with employees at all levels.

"We want to see real, fundamental change within Ubisoft and across the industry, for the sake of our members. Again, we look forward to a response that addresses all the issues raised and properly acknowledges our demands."

Additionally, a member of the group told us: "Even though change has been happening and there seems to be a major restructuring happening internally, it's hypocritical of management to say that they're working on it while still harboring, protecting, permitting, and shuffling around known toxic and abusive people to other positions of power. Morale and trust is low.

"It's exhausting, frustrating and it counters the messaging they give us. We cannot be happy or satisfied with this hypocrisy. For the one person who signed there are countless others who simply were too terrified. Do better or keep losing good people."


In its original letter, the group also showed support for the Activision Blizzard group that has been protesting over the company's response to the lawsuit regarding alleged discrimination and harassment of its employees.

Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Valmy on July 31, 2021, 09:24:09 PM
Ok after reading all of this I feel like not even frat boys deserve to be associated with the crazy shit video game companies do. The name of douchebags everywhere is being dragged through the mud here.

It is pretty ridiculous that this kind of thing would ever be tolerated in a business environments. I hope people stop buying their games but it seems like too much to expect consumers to police this stuff. The courts and law enforcement and the institutions are really failing the employees at these companies.

They should really consider forming a video game developers union, nobody else is likely to help them if these kind of conditions keep getting tolerated even years after outright scandals occur.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Valmy on July 31, 2021, 09:25:19 PM
Quote from: Syt on July 29, 2021, 10:03:43 AM
(In case you find the 50 million p.a. a bit silly ... seems in line with his IRL paycheck: https://www.marketwatch.com/story/activision-blizzard-pulls-out-a-win-on-say-on-pay-proposal-after-delaying-vote-for-a-week-11624299616 )

Kotick is notorious for paying himself huge amounts of money to do nothing while firing actual productive developers. I am not sure why share holders put up with it.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Syt on August 02, 2021, 02:55:45 AM
PC Gamer have a summary of the issues at Blizzard of the last 3 years: https://www.pcgamer.com/uk/how-blizzards-reputation-collapsed-in-just-3-years/

It seems after the hits that were Hearthstone and Overwatch they've gone downhill a fair bit.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Tonitrus on August 02, 2021, 03:47:19 AM
Is WoW not raking in the steady cash that it used to, or does that just pay their minimum wage now? :P
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Syt on August 02, 2021, 04:49:59 AM
Probably. But a lot of big WoW streamers have switched to Final Fantasy 14 recently because of how tired they were of WoW, and took a chunk of their viewers with them. Remains to be seen if they stay with FF14 or not.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Grey Fox on August 02, 2021, 05:45:08 AM
Quote from: Syt on August 02, 2021, 02:55:45 AM
PC Gamer have a summary of the issues at Blizzard of the last 3 years: https://www.pcgamer.com/uk/how-blizzards-reputation-collapsed-in-just-3-years/

It seems after the hits that were Hearthstone and Overwatch they've gone downhill a fair bit.

It's a lot like Bioware. The people who made the company the darling success it was have moved on to other ventures.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Berkut on August 02, 2021, 09:28:04 AM
All that being said, these kind of letter writing campaigns are kind of problematic.

I mean....a thousand people sign a letter. OK. That means how many did not sign the letter?

These "articles" from journalists quote anonymous sources making statements as statements of fact. You cannot (or should not) fire people based on some letter that someone convinced some people to sign. Is employment a popularity contest? If I can find X people at my company who will sign a letter saying they don't like someone, should I fire them on that basis alone?

Shit like this:

QuoteAdditionally, a member of the group told us: "Even though change has been happening and there seems to be a major restructuring happening internally, it's hypocritical of management to say that they're working on it while still harboring, protecting, permitting, and shuffling around known toxic and abusive people to other positions of power. Morale and trust is low.

A "member of the group" told "us" that management is "shuffling around known toxic and abusive people". WTF does that actually mean? What people? Who? How are the "known"? Is there a paper trail? What does "toxic" and "abusive" mean here, specifically to the particule people in question?

There is no way to know, and nothing that can or should be actioned based on this kind of bullshit. There is an awful lot of smoke here, so I am confident there is certainly a fire going, but this reporting is basically just gossip and mob pressure to get people fired some minority of workers have decided ought to be fired.

Maybe those people in question really do deserve to be fired for good reasons. But I sure as hell cannot tell because some thousand people signed a letter. According to wikipedia, they ahve about 18,000 employees. That means 17000 of them did NOT sign a letter demanding that "known toxic and abusive people" (presumably the letter writers have a list?) be fired. What does that mean?
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: The Brain on August 02, 2021, 09:38:22 AM
I don't see the problem. The person quoted says that the company should get rid of known abusers. I would be surprised if the person quoted or the people signing the letter want the company to get rid of people based on just the letter or the person's statement to the press.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Berkut on August 02, 2021, 10:10:12 AM
Quote from: The Brain on August 02, 2021, 09:38:22 AM
I don't see the problem. The person quoted says that the company should get rid of known abusers. I would be surprised if the person quoted or the people signing the letter want the company to get rid of people based on just the letter or the person's statement to the press.

The problem is that hiring and firing people is a legal process, not a political one. And this kind of public mob shaming campaigns turn it into a farce, and it seems pretty clear to me that the goal of this exposure is to generate outrage and clicks, which makes careful investigation and reasoned response to what is (or ought to be) a pretty careful, thoughtful process basically impossible.

"The person quoted says the company should get rid of known abusers".

OK - but that is true whether some person is quoted or not. And the fact that 1/18 employees signed a letter doesn't tell us much of anything about whether or not the company is in fact doing that or not.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Oexmelin on August 02, 2021, 12:21:51 PM
I think the dynamics of a work place such as those documented re: Afribisi at Blizzard or Ubisoft make it pretty clear this isn't about a popularity contest. I am likely not convinced at all this is all about clickbait. And having been in work places prior to "me two* movement that bent over backwards to transfer people rather than fire them, despite clearly abusive or predatory behavior, this rings a lot truer than some sort of witch hunt based on vague rumors about unpleasant people.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: The Brain on August 02, 2021, 12:22:30 PM
Quote from: Berkut on August 02, 2021, 10:10:12 AM
Quote from: The Brain on August 02, 2021, 09:38:22 AM
I don't see the problem. The person quoted says that the company should get rid of known abusers. I would be surprised if the person quoted or the people signing the letter want the company to get rid of people based on just the letter or the person's statement to the press.

The problem is that hiring and firing people is a legal process, not a political one. And this kind of public mob shaming campaigns turn it into a farce, and it seems pretty clear to me that the goal of this exposure is to generate outrage and clicks, which makes careful investigation and reasoned response to what is (or ought to be) a pretty careful, thoughtful process basically impossible.

"The person quoted says the company should get rid of known abusers".

OK - but that is true whether some person is quoted or not. And the fact that 1/18 employees signed a letter doesn't tell us much of anything about whether or not the company is in fact doing that or not.

I still don't really understand what the problem is here. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: The Minsky Moment on August 02, 2021, 12:48:04 PM
Quote from: Berkut on August 02, 2021, 09:28:04 AM
Maybe those people in question really do deserve to be fired for good reasons. But I sure as hell cannot tell because some thousand people signed a letter. According to wikipedia, they ahve about 18,000 employees. That means 17000 of them did NOT sign a letter demanding that "known toxic and abusive people" (presumably the letter writers have a list?) be fired. What does that mean?

It means that they have a very serious personnel problem, if 1000 of their people are angry or desperate enough to put their names on a public letter criticizing management.  Whatever the truth of the accusations may be. it is not a good sign for management.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: The Minsky Moment on August 02, 2021, 12:52:29 PM
Quote from: Valmy on July 31, 2021, 09:24:09 PM
Ok after reading all of this I feel like not even frat boys deserve to be associated with the crazy shit video game companies do. The name of douchebags everywhere is being dragged through the mud here.

"Frat" being shorthand here for industries traditionally dominated by men and with a distinctive culture.

This has always been a problem in the banking industry but because of the sheer amounts of money involved and the social pretensions of the bankers (you don't see a lot video game designers on the board of the Metropolitan Opera) the banking firms have been more aggressive blanketing their firms with professional compliance people then it appears the gaming industry has.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Sheilbh on August 02, 2021, 01:12:07 PM
Quote from: Oexmelin on August 02, 2021, 12:21:51 PM
I think the dynamics of a work place such as those documented re: Afribisi at Blizzard or Ubisoft make it pretty clear this isn't about a popularity contest. I am likely not convinced at all this is all about clickbait. And having been in work places prior to "me two* movement that bent over backwards to transfer people rather than fire them, despite clearly abusive or predatory behavior, this rings a lot truer than some sort of witch hunt based on vague rumors about unpleasant people.
Yeah - I also think there's a particular issue with industries people are desperate to be often the more creative/"calling" sectors: journalism, fashion, arts, charities etc - or where there's huge financial rewards: finance (especially I think the asset management/PE sort of world).

I think in more "normal" sectors - especially ones without a "rainmaker" culture as well - things are normally different. But the combination of "talent" that need tolerating or special treatment and a huge pool of potential juniors desperate to get in is very dangerous.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Berkut on August 02, 2021, 01:59:15 PM
I think I made it pretty clear that there is definitely something wrong. Note my comment about smoke and fires.

I just don't like the idea that just BECAUSE there is smoke, we must assume there is fire, and start firing people without bothering to actually investigate, which is what seems to be demanded here, in that people are bitching about action not being taken.

Maybe action IS being taken, but that action takes time when taken with the deliberation and care that is due.

Or maybe they are doing fuck all and hoping it all blows over. It's pretty much impossible to tell.

What I can tell though it that the reporting is pretty clearly one sided and intended to get people to click on articles rather then inform anyone or try to actually understand what is going on.

The mob sells clicks, for sure.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: The Brain on August 02, 2021, 02:02:45 PM
I don't see how you fire known abusers without investigating.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Sheilbh on August 02, 2021, 02:04:36 PM
Quote from: Berkut on August 02, 2021, 01:59:15 PMMaybe action IS being taken, but that action takes time when taken with the deliberation and care that is due.

Or maybe they are doing fuck all and hoping it all blows over. It's pretty much impossible to tell.
This isn't related to abuse per se. But based on my interactions with HR on literally any subject - I have my suspicions which is more likely :lol:
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Syt on August 03, 2021, 08:55:31 AM
Blizzard pres J.Allen Brack is out.

https://www.pcgamer.com/uk/blizzards-president-is-out-studio-to-be-co-led-by-a-woman-for-first-time-in-its-history/

QuoteBlizzard's president is out, studio to be co-led by a woman for first time in its history

By Rich Stanton about 1 hour ago

J. Allen Brack will be replaced by Jen Oneal and Mike Ybarra as co-heads.

On July 20th, California's Department of Fair Employment and Housing filed a lawsuit against Activision Blizzard collecting "numerous complaints about unlawful harassment, discrimination, and retaliation" at the company. Shortly afterwards, more than 3,000 Activision Blizzard employees signed an open letter to management speaking up for victims and making a call for "official statements that recognize the seriousness of the allegations and demonstrate compassion for victims of harassment and assault."

Activision Blizzard CEO Bobby Kotick promised a rapid response. Today Blizzard has announced that J. Allen Brack is leaving his position as the president of the studio, to be replaced by Jen Oneal and Mike Ybarra as co-heads of the studio.

Jen Oneal has been at Blizzard since January, before which she was the studio head of Vicarious Visions. Mike Ybarra was a longtime Xbox employee, holding various positions there, before joining Blizzard in 2019 as an executive vice president. Blizzard's statement says: "Jen and Mike have more than three decades of gaming industry experience between them. Moving forward, they will share responsibilities over game development and company operations."

Brack had been named in the California lawsuit, specifically concerning how he'd dealt with allegations made against Alex Afrasiabi drinking too much and harassing female employees at company events. It's alleged Brack's punishment for Afrasiabi, verbal counseling, amounted to little more than a slap on the wrist for such behaviour.

Brack was also on-stage during a 2010 Blizzcon Q&A panel where the various developers' responses to a question about the over-sexualisation of characters is simply embarrassing.

Today's statement from Blizzard goes on to make explicit that this change is related to working culture:

"Both leaders are deeply committed to all of our employees; to the work ahead to ensure Blizzard is the safest, most welcoming workplace possible for women, and people of any gender, ethnicity, sexual orientation, or background; to upholding and reinforcing our values; and to rebuilding your trust. With their many years of industry experience and deep commitment to integrity and inclusivity, Jen and Mike will lead Blizzard with care, compassion, and a dedication to excellence."

As journalist and former Kotaku EIC Stephen Totilo pointed out, the timing of this seems tied to a quarterly earnings call today on which Brack would have been expected to field questions.

Here is a statement from J. Allen Brack, Blizzard's departing president:

"I am confident that Jen Oneal and Mike Ybarra will provide the leadership Blizzard needs to realize its full potential and will accelerate the pace of change. I anticipate they will do so with passion and enthusiasm and that they can be trusted to lead with the highest levels of integrity and commitment to the components of our culture that make Blizzard so special.

"Finally, thank you all for being a part of the Blizzard community, and for your passion and determination for safety and equality for all."

The discrimination lawsuit is just the latest in a long string of controversies involving Blizzard's management in recent times (here's a timeline of how the company's reputation has collapsed over the last three years). Between massive layoffs, numerous reports on its toxic workplace, and highly anticipated launches reportedly sabotaged by mismanagement, the perception of what used to be PC gaming's darling developer has changed utterly.

The Californian state's proceedings against Blizzard are still pending, and could last for months or years: here's everything we know about the current situation.



PC Gamer also has a handy timeline summary of the last two weeks (in reverse order):

https://www.pcgamer.com/uk/activision-blizzard-lawsuit-controversy-timeline-explained/

QuoteFriday, July 30: Vice publishes an article about Blizzard recruiters at a 2015 hacker conference harassing a security researcher who asked about a penetration testing (cybersecurity auditing) position. "One of them asked me when was the last time I was personally penetrated, if I liked being penetrated, and how often I got penetrated," she said.

On the same day, Waypoint writes about an Activision Blizzard IT worker at the company's Minnesota office who installed spy cameras in the unisex bathroom. He pleaded guilty in 2018 to "interference with privacy."

IGN also publishes a report based on interviews with seven current and former employees who speak to a number of issues, including women being evaluated differently than men inside Blizzard and breastfeeding rooms not having locks, at one point. One employee characterized the company's attempts to fix its culture as "putting lipstick on it."

Thursday, July 29: The New York Times publishes an investigation into Activision Blizzard with newly public accounts of sexual harassment and discrimination. An employee who worked at the company from 2014 to 2017 said she was paid less than her boyfriend, who joined the company at the same time doing the same work, and that a manager messaged her on Facebook asking what kind of porn she watched.

Another woman, who joined Activision in 2011 as a vice president, said that an executive "pressured her to have sex with him because she 'deserved to have some fun' after her boyfriend had died weeks earlier."

Wednesday, July 28: Employees hold a walkout at Blizzard HQ, while others participate in the work stoppage remotely. Employees also respond to CEO Bobby Kotick's letter saying they are "pleased to see that our collective voices... have convinced leadership to change the tone of their communications," but that Kotick "fails to address critical elements at the heart of employee concerns." The response reiterates the four demands from Tuesday. "Today's walkout will demonstrate that this is not a one-time event that our leaders can ignore. We will not return to silence; we will not be placated by the same processes that led us to this point," the letter says.

Game developers across the industry share messages of solidarity with the walkout.

Kotaku publishes a report on Blizzard's "Cosby Suite," a recurring convention party room that Afrasiabi and other employees texted about bringing "hot chixx" to. Greg Street, a former World of Warcraft lead systems designer and current VP of MMO R&D at Riot, who is seen in a photo, claims that the hotel room was "a green room at Blizzcon that many of us at the time used to take a break and relax during the convention" and that "hot chixx" was a joke.

Activision Blizzard confirms to Kotaku that Alex Afrasiabi was terminated in 2020 "for his misconduct in his treatment of other employees."

Tuesday, July 27: The World of Warcraft team announces that it plans to remove references from WoW that are "not appropriate," likely including NPCs and items related to Alex Afrasiabi.

Employees state they plan to walk out on Wednesday to protest the company's response to the lawsuit. The open letter passes 3,000 signatories (Activision Blizzard has approximately 9,500 employees). The plans for the work stoppage come with four demands:

- An end to mandatory arbitration in employee contracts
- More diverse recruiting and hiring practices
- Publication of compensation data, promotion rates and salary ranges
- A company-wide Diversity, Equity & Inclusion task force empowered to hire a third party company to audit Activision Blizzard

Late Tuesday afternoon, CEO Bobby Kotick writes a public note to employees calling the company's initial response "tone deaf," and says "We are taking swift action to be the compassionate, caring company you came to work for and to ensure a safe environment. There is no place anywhere at our company for discrimination, harassment, or unequal treatment of any kind."

Kotick's letter announces immediate steps to investigate claims, hold listening sessions, make personnel changes, enforce diverse hiring practices and change inappropriate in-game content.

"Anyone found to have impeded the integrity of our processes for evaluating claims and imposing appropriate consequences will be terminated."

Monday, July 26: Activision holds an "all-hands" meeting that only has room for 500 staff. Executive Joshua Taub reportedly attempts to address the lawsuit, saying that there's "zero tolerance" for the behavior described in the lawsuit, and that Activision Blizzard works with employees and the accused to "work on a resolution." Taub also says that Fran Townsend's response "wasn't the right communication."

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More than 1,000 current and former Activision Blizzard employees sign an open letter to management calling Townsend's statement "abhorrent and insulting to all that we believe our company should stand for." The employee statement continues "Our values as employees are not accurately reflected in the words and actions of our leadership... Categorizing the claims that have been made as 'distorted, and in many cases false' creates a company atmosphere that disbelieves victims... Immediate corrections are needed from the highest level of our organization."

The letter ends with a statement that the employees "stand with all our friends, teammates, and colleagues, as well as the members of our dedicated community, who have experienced mistreatment or harassment of any kind."

Signatures from current and former continue to roll in.

Saturday, July 24: Former Blizzard senior vice president Chris Metzen tweets a response to the lawsuit, beginning with "We failed, and I'm sorry."


Friday July 23: Activision Blizzard chief compliance officer Fran Townsend sends a very different message to staff, calling the lawsuit's depiction of AB "distorted and untrue" and that Activision Blizzard "truly values equality and fairness." Townsend says that when she joined the executive leadership team in March 2021 she was certain she "was joining a company where I would be valued, treated with respect ,and provided opportunities equal to those afforded to the men of the company." Townsend reiterates the initial response that the lawsuit's claims were inaccurate.

Blizzard co-founder and former president Mike Morhaime publishes "My thoughts," stating "I wanted to acknowledge the women who had awful experiences. I hear you, I believe you, and I am so sorry to have let you down."

A video from BlizzCon 2010 goes viral on Twitter. During a WoW panel Q&A, a woman asks about the possibility of less sexualized female characters. The panelists, including Alex Afrasiabi and now-president J. Allen Brack, laugh and make jokes in response.

Thursday, July 22: Blizzard president J. Allen Brack emails staff to say that the behavior detailed in the suit is "completely unacceptable." Activision president Rob Kostich emails staff calling the allegations "deeply disturbing" and says that "we, as a company, take every allegation seriously."

Wednesday, July 21: News breaks that the lawsuit has been filed. In a statement sent to PC Gamer and other press outlets, an Activision Blizzard spokesperson said that the lawsuit includes "distorted, and in many cases false, descriptions of Blizzard's past" and that the DFEH was "required by law to adequately investigate and to have good faith discussions with us to better understand and to resolve any claims or concerns before going to litigation, but they failed to do so. Instead, they rushed to file an inaccurate complaint, as we will demonstrate in court."

Tuesday, July 20: California Department of Fair Employment and Housing files a lawsuit against Activision Blizzard alleging discrimination and sexual harassment against women in the workplace. The lawsuit mentions "cube crawls" in which drunk male employees subjected women to unwanted advances; a lack of women in leadership positions; unequal pay for women; and a lack of action from HR around many of these complaints. The suit also specifically calls out the actions of former WoW senior creative director Alex Afrasiabi, who was "permitted to engage in blatant sexual harassment with little to no repurcussions."

What should we expect from the lawsuit itself?
The Department of Fair Employment and Housing's lawsuit has started a public maelstrom for Activision, but a court hearing could be weeks or months off—if the case goes to a trial at all.

"I don't see either case as going to an actual trial," lawyer Kellen Voyer tells PC Gamer, referring to the DFEH's case against Activision Blizzard as well as one it filed against Riot Games. "Typically the parties will settle out once the defendant has a better idea of the evidence being brought by the state and the strength of its case. The current negative press... is another reason why the companies will not want to go through a long, public trial."

The DFEH's news page shows a number of settlements from the past three years to resolve discrimination and harassment cases, for sums ranging from $50,000 to $6.2 million. Voyer points out that a sexual harassment case brought by the state is stronger than a case from an individual, partially becasue it's public rather than private arbitration. (Ending mandatory arbitration in Activision Blizzard contracts is one of the demands listed by employees who participated in the July 28 work stoppage.)

Because the DFEH's investigation into Activision Blizzard must have been ongoing for some time, Voyer says the lawsuit is a way to publicly push Activision Blizzard into a settlement. The DFEH filing does request a jury trial, but this is standard practice and doesn't rule out the likely possibility of a settlement before trial begins.

"Activision Blizzard will fight tooth and nail to avoid [a trial] as I would expect a jury (especially in California) to come down hard on the company," Voyer says. " A settlement is likely before it gets to that stage."

Going after a company as big as Activision Blizzard gives the DFEH a chance to make a public spectacle; even if it doesn't have strong enough evidence to push the company into a multi-million dollar settlement, it could have significant ramifications.

"To make an example of a company, even through the filing of the case and the negative PR that results for the company, will hopefully effectuate change through deterrence: by putting companies on notice that there are real, material, ramifications for failing to address toxic culture," Voyer says.

It's still possible that this case goes to trial. If it does, the DFEH will likely be pushing for big monetary penalties and for Activision Blizzard to open itself up to oversight as it enacts plans to repair its workplace issues.

If Blizzard won at trial, it would likely push for no monetary damages and, in Voyer's words, "the usual corporate, general promise of 'we will change and do better.'"
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Syt on August 03, 2021, 08:56:24 AM
Quote from: Sheilbh on August 02, 2021, 02:04:36 PM
Quote from: Berkut on August 02, 2021, 01:59:15 PMMaybe action IS being taken, but that action takes time when taken with the deliberation and care that is due.

Or maybe they are doing fuck all and hoping it all blows over. It's pretty much impossible to tell.
This isn't related to abuse per se. But based on my interactions with HR on literally any subject - I have my suspicions which is more likely :lol:

Considering how in the Ubisoft case, one of the accused harasser's was married to the head of HR at the time ...

Meanwhile, outside reviewers say Ubisoft have done little to address the issues brought forth last year besides giving some people a golden ass kick.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: viper37 on August 03, 2021, 10:05:56 AM
Quote from: Berkut on August 02, 2021, 01:59:15 PM
I just don't like the idea that just BECAUSE there is smoke, we must assume there is fire, and start firing people without bothering to actually investigate, which is what seems to be demanded here, in that people are bitching about action not being taken.
I would agree with you about firing people just because there's smoke.

However, reading between the lines, I get the feeling that we are at this point now because there were many complaints & investigations, internals, than external by the California agency, and, the problem not only persists, but Blizzard seemed intent on sweeping it under the rug.  The 1000 employees who signed the letter are reacting to Blizzard's internal e-mail from the GOP waterboarding expert lady..

We can not presume anything about the 16 000 others.  Maybe they are fine with what's happening.  Maybe they are not.  Maybe they've never witnessed anything wrong.  Maybe they think Blizzard is exemplary. Maybe they think they will be retaliated against if they speak and they can't afford to loser their job, even temporarily.  Or maybe they think they'll be branded as difficult to work with for most video game companies in the US.  We do not know that.

I do not see the email as mob pressure to fire a list of specific someones.  More like an answer to that bullshit email saying everything was fine under California's sun.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Razgovory on August 03, 2021, 11:18:12 AM
Quote from: Syt on August 03, 2021, 08:55:31 AM
Blizzard pres J.Allen Brack is out.


When they hired him I thought he might not be the guy for the job.  Very immature.


(https://i.imgur.com/Qs0TGeL.jpg)
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: garbon on August 04, 2021, 03:15:59 AM
Looks like head of HR is out too.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Darth Wagtaros on August 04, 2021, 03:19:50 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on August 03, 2021, 11:18:12 AM
Quote from: Syt on August 03, 2021, 08:55:31 AM
Blizzard pres J.Allen Brack is out.


When they hired him I thought he might not be the guy for the job.  Very immature.




Pfft. I support Moltar would have been better?
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Syt on November 03, 2021, 07:06:06 AM
https://www.pcgamer.com/activision-blizzard-q3-2021-earnings/

QuoteBlizzard morale takes a hit following co-leader's surprise resignation
By Tyler Wilde about 6 hours ago

Activision Blizzard reported big earnings, but the consequences of high-profile exits may continue to manifest.

On Tuesday, Activision Blizzard announced its financial results for the period that includes the July filing of California's discrimination and sexual harassment lawsuit and the immediate aftermath. The headline for investors is that the company's revenue outlook for the end of the year is weaker than analysts projected, but it beat its third quarter forecast with net revenue of $2.07 billion, improving year-over-year with help from Diablo 2: Resurrected.

Finances felt like the call's secondary topic, however, as Activision Blizzard's leaders reiterated plans to overhaul recruiting and HR practices, and surprised employees with the news that Blizzard co-leader Jen Oneal is stepping down. The resignation came as a shock, and according to some has wounded morale at Blizzard just as it was starting to improve.

Last week, Activision Blizzard finally responded to a list of demands issued in July by the employees who organized a walkout. The company partially conceded to the demand to remove mandatory arbitration from employment contracts, agreeing to strike it for "individual sexual harassment and discrimination claims." Among a number of other things, Activision Blizzard has also promised increased pay transparency, recruiting policies that foster diversity, and a "zero-tolerance harassment policy," which will result in immediate firing and "forfeiture of future compensation."

A source inside Activision Blizzard told PC Gamer this week that they witnessed an overall positive response to last week's announcement. The timing was seen as suspect—the demands were acknowledged just in time to become talking points during Tuesday's investor call—but the partial win on arbitration was seen as a clear accomplishment, and the diverse recruiting policies reflect what individual Activision Blizzard teams have already been implementing without waiting for a corporate mandate. One thing still seen as missing is third-party oversight of hiring and HR practices, including by a committee chosen by employees, but the mood leading into the earnings call was certainly better than it was following a mistrusted email from executive Fran Townsend earlier in October.

However, the news that Oneal is stepping down as Blizzard co-leader just three months after taking the role has "killed" any morale boost from last week's concessions, according to that employee. Oneal and Mike Ybarra replaced former Blizzard boss J Allen Brack, who exited in August in the aftermath of the California lawsuit. With Oneal's resignation, Ybarra is now Blizzard's sole leader.

For some, Oneal's leadership was one of the best reasons they had to believe in a better future for Blizzard. They're now left wondering why Oneal would choose to leave so quickly, leading to speculation that something isn't being said.

"I am doing this not because I am without hope for Blizzard, quite the opposite—I'm inspired by the passion of everyone here, working towards meaningful, lasting change with their whole hearts," wrote Oneal in a letter to employees. "This energy has inspired me to step out and explore how I can do more to have games and diversity intersect, and hopefully make a broader industry impact that will benefit Blizzard (and other studios) as well."

Former Blizzard technical director Amy Dunham, who also announced her departure this week, pointed out that Blizzard's three most senior women all left this year.

"Before you make commitments to recruit more women (usually at entry level, where people have less choice to turn down opportunities), figure out and fix why all of your senior women choose to leave," she wrote on Twitter.

The past three months have seen a number of other resignations, as well as over 20 departures as the result of HR investigations and new, stricter policies. According to Tuesday's earnings report, the bottom line has been unscathed for now: Call of Duty's userbase is holding steady on PC and console, while Call of Duty Mobile has seen "double digit growth in the West" with a big jump in revenue. Blizzard's revenue grew 20% year-over-year due to the release of Diablo 2: Resurrected, Hearthstone enjoys stable popularity, and World of Warcraft is "on track" to have its best non-expansion year in a decade.

However, while Call of Duty: Vanguard releases this month and the next big Warzone update will be released in December, it was revealed during the earnings call that the next two big games from Blizzard are going to take longer than expected: Overwatch 2 and Diablo 4 didn't have public release dates, but we learned that their internal development timelines have been extended.

Activision Blizzard partially attributed the delays to the departures of company leaders. Diablo 4 game director Louis Barriga left the company for unspecified reasons following the July allegations, though a corporate statement about ensuring "a safe, productive work environment" implied a connection. Overwatch executive producer Chacko Sonny left Blizzard in September for reasons unrelated to the lawsuit, and back in April, Overwatch director Jeff Kaplan also left the company.

Attrition isn't a new issue for Activision Blizzard: A former employee recently told PC Gamer that they witnessed waves of employees leaving voluntarily alongside the 2019 and 2020 layoffs. Beyond the Overwatch 2 and Diablo 4 delays, other long-term consequences of the company's recent rate of employee turnover may still emerge.

"Our opportunities for growth have never been better, but we won't be able to realize all that growth potential without talent," said Activision Blizzard CEO Bobby Kotick during Tuesday's earnings call. "And to retain and attract the talent we need, we obviously have to be recognized as the very best place to work. This means we have to be the most welcoming and inclusive environment."

According to Kotick, the changes and initiatives announced so far are "just the beginning" of the company's plans, and employees and shareholders will receive quarterly updates on progress.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Grey Fox on November 03, 2021, 07:16:04 AM
In unrelated news, I have been invited to the Diablo Immortal closed beta.

I played 5 mins, it's fine. I don't usually play games on my phone so I have no basis of comparison. It made my phone very hot.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Jacob on November 03, 2021, 09:42:48 PM
Bobby... Activision is very far from being recognized as the best place to work. You fucking shitheel.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: viper37 on November 04, 2021, 09:53:31 AM
Quote from: Jacob on November 03, 2021, 09:42:48 PM
Bobby... Activision is very far from being recognized as the best place to work. You fucking shitheel.
That's his goal, as stated to shareholders anyway, to be recognized as the best place to work. He does not say they are there yet.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Jacob on November 05, 2021, 07:48:07 PM
Quote from: viper37 on November 04, 2021, 09:53:31 AM
That's his goal, as stated to shareholders anyway, to be recognized as the best place to work. He does not say they are there yet.

I'm telling him... or rather, more realistically, I'm telling you... that he has a long way to go because he's a shitheel and he's created and maintained a company that has a reputation for being shitty to work for.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: viper37 on November 06, 2021, 06:17:33 PM
Quote from: Jacob on November 05, 2021, 07:48:07 PM
Quote from: viper37 on November 04, 2021, 09:53:31 AM
That's his goal, as stated to shareholders anyway, to be recognized as the best place to work. He does not say they are there yet.

I'm telling him... or rather, more realistically, I'm telling you... that he has a long way to go because he's a shitheel and he's created and maintained a company that has a reputation for being shitty to work for.
Of course, and he may realize it, now.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: The Minsky Moment on November 09, 2021, 10:20:28 AM
Quote from: viper37 on November 06, 2021, 06:17:33 PM
Of course, and he may realize it, now.

The accuracy of that conclusion depends on how prevalent you think the capacity for honest self-critical evaluation is among corporate leaders.

The alternative is he is just saying whatever the PR guy is telling him to say until the immediate crisis blows over.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Syt on November 17, 2021, 03:08:00 AM
https://www.pcgamer.com/uk/more-shocking-activision-blizzard-revelations-bobby-kotick-once-told-an-assistant-he-was-going-to-have-her-killed/#comment-jump

QuoteMore shocking Activision Blizzard revelations: Bobby Kotick once told an assistant he was going to have her killed

A new report in the Wall Street Journal paints an unflattering picture of Activision-Blizzard

A new report in the Wall Street Journal details further incidents of harassment and sexual harassment at Activision-Blizzard, some dating back to 2006. The report, which Activision characterized as "inaccurate" in its own statement today, details Jen Oneal's short reign as Blizzard co-head, and why she left, and also includes allegations about CEO Bobby Kotick's own behaviour and how the company's leadership has historically responded to such issues.

Jen Oneal was promoted to co-head of Blizzard in August 2021, making her the first woman to lead one of Activision's business units. This was widely seen as a positive step for Blizzard amidst these grim allegations and ugliness. A few months later Oneal has come out as someone who has experienced this harassment herself, and announced her intention to leave: This is simply staggering.

In September 2021 Oneal emailed an Activision lawyer to announce her intent to resign, saying "it was clear that the company would never prioritize our people the right way", alleging she had been sexually harassed earlier in her career at Activision, and that she was paid less than her male co-head Mike Ybarra. "I have been tokenized, marginalized, and discriminated against," wrote Oneal.

It was announced on November 2 that Oneal is leaving Blizzard at the end of the year.

The main allegations about Kotick are that, in 2006, he left a threatening voicemail on an assistant's phone in which he threatened to have her killed. The assistant complained and Kotick settled the matter out-of-court. Activision spokesperson Helaine Klasky told the WSJ:  "Mr. Kotick quickly apologized 16 years ago for the obviously hyperbolic and inappropriate voice mail, and he deeply regrets the exaggeration and tone in his voice mail to this day."

Another allegation is that Kotick personally intervened in the case of Dan Bunting, then co-head of Activision's Treyarch studio, a key part of the Call of Duty series. Bunting was accused by a female employee of sexually harassing her in 2017 after a night of drinking. Activision launched an internal investigation in 2019 when this was reported and recommended Bunting be fired but Kotick intervened to keep him. Bunting was instead given counseling and allowed to remain at Activision. However, after the WSJ began enquiring about this incident, Bunting has now left Activision.

The report goes on to detail rape allegations made against Javier Panameno, a Sledgehammer Games supervisor. The accuser's lawyer alleged he also had sexually harassed a second woman at the studio. The employee who accused him of the assaults reported that 2017 incident to the police: No charges were brought. The assaults were reported to Activision in 2018, and Panemeno was fired two months later.

The accuser's lawyer added that, while her client had not reported the incidents to Activision before leaving in November 2017, she had reported them to Sledgehammer's HR department while at the company.

The report also alleges that former Blizzard technology chief Ben Kilgore faced multiple allegations of sexual harassment over several years, and lied in an internal investigation about a relationship with a lower level employee. Kilgore was fired in 2018 with Kotick's approval.

Kotick has been subpoenaed by the Securities and Exchange Commission for an investigation into how the company handled misconduct and disclosed it (thus what Kotick knew and when, and what he told others such as the board, is very important).

Per the WSJ: "The board of directors was blindsided by the California lawsuit's allegations, including that an Activision employee killed herself after a photo of her vagina allegedly was circulated at a company party, according to people familiar with the board."

Activision's board said in a statement it had been "informed at all times with respect to the status of regulatory matters."

At the time an email was circulated around Activision-Blizzard staff by Frances Townsend, one of the company's female executives. Townsend would take an enormous amount of flak for this email, and Kotick backtracked the statement and called it "tone deaf."

Bobby Kotick drafted that statement, and directed Townsend to send it. Townsend had to apologise to a company women's group she led and was asked to resign, which she did. "Ms. Townsend should not be blamed for this mistake," said Activision spokeswoman Helaine Klasky.

These new revelations have to be viewed in the wider context of the allegations against Activision-Blizzard and various ongoing legal actions. The company is in court against the California Department of Fair Employment and Housing, facing allegations that it routinely ignored complaints by female employees of harassment, sexual harassment and discrimination. The WSJ claims that since this action was launched in July Activision has received more than 500 HR complaints from current and former employees alleging "harassment, sexual assault, bullying, pay disparities and other issues."

Shortly after the WSJ article went live, Activision-Blizzard made public a statement that had earlier been circulated among employees. In it Kotick writes:

"There's an article today that paints an inaccurate and misleading view of our company, of me personally, and my leadership.

"I want to say two important things about this: First, we are incredibly fortunate to have the most talented people in our industry all so committed to constant improvement. And I share this commitment. The second thing I want to say is that anyone who doubts my conviction to be the most welcoming, inclusive workplace doesn't really appreciate how important this is to me."

Kotick's statement goes on to say Activision-Blizzard is "moving forward with a new zero tolerance policy for inappropriate behavior—and zero means zero. Any reprehensible conduct is simply unacceptable. Over the last few years our industry has had an uncomfortable spotlight that's been illuminating opportunities for us to change. And we must all, including me, embrace this need for change, so we can bring our very best selves to the very best place to work."

Activision-Blizzard's own, separate response to the story reiterated: "We are disappointed in the Wall Street Journal's report, which presents a misleading view of Activision Blizzard and our CEO. Instances of sexual misconduct that were brought to his attention were acted upon."

The studio remains locked in multiple court battles of harassment allegations dating back years. Kotick has always been a part of this story, inasmuch as it's about an institutional problem at the company he more-or-less built into an institution, but until this point he's been in the typical CEO position of issuing statements and promising change. This report drags his behaviour and decision-making into question, and does so in the context of serious harassment allegations and whether senior employees were ever given preferential treatment.

Activision-Blizzard continues to contest these allegations on multiple fronts but its own board will now be asking the obvious question: Kotick built Activision into what it is, but is he the man that can turn the page on this chapter in its history? We may get the answer to that sooner than you think.

Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: viper37 on November 17, 2021, 09:47:41 AM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on November 09, 2021, 10:20:28 AM
Quote from: viper37 on November 06, 2021, 06:17:33 PM
Of course, and he may realize it, now.

The accuracy of that conclusion depends on how prevalent you think the capacity for honest self-critical evaluation is among corporate leaders.

The alternative is he is just saying whatever the PR guy is telling him to say until the immediate crisis blows over.


I don't think he wants to change things.  But I also don't think he has a choice to change things now.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Razgovory on November 17, 2021, 04:23:51 PM
That does seem to reinforce Jake's "shitheel" hypothesis.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Syt on November 17, 2021, 04:27:32 PM
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-11-17/playstation-chief-criticizes-activision-response-to-allegations

QuotePlayStation Chief Criticizes Activision's Response to Crisis

Sony Group Corp.'s PlayStation Chief Jim Ryan admonished Activision Blizzard Inc. Wednesday for an inadequate response to allegations that Chief Executive Officer Bobby Kotick was aware of sexual misconduct and harassment claims at the game publisher for years and that he had mistreated women.

In an email to employees reviewed by Bloomberg, Ryan linked to the Wall Street Journal's Tuesday report. He wrote that he and his leadership were "disheartened and frankly stunned to read" that Activision "has not done enough to address a deep-seated culture of discrimination and harassment."

"We outreached to Activision immediately after the article was published to express our deep concern and to ask how they plan to address the claims made in the article," he wrote. "We do not believe their statements of response properly address the situation."

As one of the video game industry's biggest console manufacturers, Sony has long had a close relationship with Activision, which produces hits like Call of Duty and World of Warcraft. In addition to publishing most of its games on PlayStation consoles, Activision has worked with Sony on elaborate marketing deals. The last few entries in the Call of Duty series, including this year's Call of Duty: Vanguard, have featured exclusive modes and content for the PlayStation.

Activision is also under fire from its own employees. More than 100 walked out Tuesday and called for Kotick's resignation. The board issued a statement standing by Kotick. Activision shares fell 2.5% in New York on Wednesday afternoon.

This seems unusual. Normally, games companies don't comment much on the shit happening in other companies (though I assume there's contracts between ActiBlizz and Sony for their titles to be on PlayStation so that they felt they had to say something to disassociate themselves from this).
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: viper37 on June 20, 2022, 10:58:17 AM
Activision Blizzard investigated Activision Blizzard and found Activision Blizzard didn't do anything wrong (https://www.theverge.com/2022/6/16/23171447/activision-blizzard-investigation-sec-filing)
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: viper37 on June 20, 2022, 10:59:27 AM
Quote from: viper37 on June 20, 2022, 10:58:17 AMActivision Blizzard investigated Activision Blizzard and found Activision Blizzard didn't do anything wrong (https://www.theverge.com/2022/6/16/23171447/activision-blizzard-investigation-sec-filing)

QuoteOh, and it says the media made them look bad, too

Amid all the news on Overwatch 2 and Diablo Immortal, Activision Blizzard has filed a document with the US Securities and Exchange Commission in which it affirms that, after an internal investigation, it concluded its own board did not fail to act when presented with allegations of harassment.

"Contrary to many of the allegations, the board and its external advisors have determined that there is no evidence to suggest that Activision Blizzard senior executives ever intentionally ignored or attempted to downplay the instances of gender harassment that occurred and were reported," Activision Blizzard wrote in the filing.

The report does acknowledge there were problems within the company and that such a conclusion does little to address the concerns of those harmed. "Indeed, a single instance of someone feeling diminished at Activision Blizzard is one too many," it wrote. However, in a report from one of the consultants Activision Blizzard engaged to review harassment filings and the company's responses, the document said, "based on the volume of reports, the amount of misconduct reflected is comparatively low for a company the size of Activision Blizzard." It's kind of strange to say in one breath "one is too many" and then cite a consultant saying it could have been worse.

The filing continues with the programs the company has implemented to make restitution. It cites the addition of a new diversity and inclusion executive, a program designed to train and attract employees from underrepresented areas, and its $18 million compensation fund established by its settlement with the US Equal Employment Opportunity Commission, or EEOC. (For reference Activision Blizzard reported Call of Duty alone made the company $3 billion in 2020.)

But, in another example of "you could just not say that," the company took a swipe at the California Department of Fair Employment and Housing (DFEH) — which tried to block the EEOC settlement since it might release the company from the state's own case against it — and the media.

"It must be said that the company has been subject to an unrelenting barrage of media criticism that attempts to paint the entire company (and many innocent employees) with the stain of a very small portion of our employee population who engaged in bad behavior and were disciplined for it," the company wrote. "Much of this originated with the highly inflammatory, made-for-press allegations of the DFEH."

I guess when there's a new allegation cropping up almost daily with stories of stolen breast milk, alcohol-fueled "cube crawls," the now-infamous "Cosby suite," the fact that the CEO likely knew about all of it, the board's patent refusal to disavow said CEO despite employee objections, three employee walkouts, a strike and — let's not forget — the persistent instances of union busting for which there are at least two National Labor Relations Board (NLRB) complaints, it can get pretty unrelenting. It's also worth noting that while the DFEH filing did make the public aware about the "cube crawls" and the "Cosby suite," a lot of the other allegations brought forward were from independent reporting and Activision Blizzard's own current and former employees.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Syt on June 20, 2022, 11:06:38 AM
(https://c.tenor.com/pJnatjvzCsoAAAAM/casablanca-shocked.gif)
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Syt on May 12, 2023, 02:30:26 AM
https://www.pcgamer.com/blizzard-developers-say-mandatory-return-to-office-policy-has-cost-us-some-amazing-people/

QuoteBlizzard developers say mandatory return-to-office policy has 'cost us some amazing people'
By Rick Lane published about 16 hours ago

Loss of talent is forcing producers to create "crisis maps" in development planning.

Activision Blizzard's mandatory return-to-office policy is causing an unnecessary loss of talent, to the point where it could affect development of major titles like World of Warcraft and Diablo 4, according to some Blizzard developers.

As reported by Kotaku, the company mandated that Activision employees return to the office for three days a week on April 10 this year, while Blizzard workers would be expected to follow suit on July 10. But several developers have spoken out about the ramifications this has had for employment.

"Being loud about it because I've lost yet *another* person this week," game producer Adam "Glaxigrav" tweeted in April. "Blizzard is losing amazing talent because someone in power doesn't listen to the game directors who make his products." Adam further stated that "We are creating crisis maps of what we can or cannot ship. THAT is the loss of capacity we're facing."

Other Blizzard employees added their own thoughts to Adam's tweet. "Forced RTO has cost us some amazing people and will continue to cost us more in the coming months", wrote senior designer Allison Steele. "It is a terrible, shortsighted, self-destructive policy that is only weakening our ability to deliver the kind of game we want to make." An example of the effect ABK's policy is having can be found in the replies to Steele's tweet. "I've received a job offer for Blizzard, and the move to Irvine was mandatory...which is a no-go for me" wrote Ubisoft AI programmer Stéphane Wantiez.

Kotaku also spoke to an employee on the Diablo 4 team on the condition of anonymity, who said they believed their days at Blizzard "are numbered", that none of their managers are on board with the return-to-office policy, and that several other people on the team had also given notice. The same employee also speculated that Blizzard is "tightening its belt right now and they want people to leave", which may affect Blizzard's plans for Diablo IV's post-release updates.

It's worth noting that the mandatory office attendance doesn't apply to ABK's executives. Recently hired execs like Chief Administrative Officer Brian Bulatao, and Chief Communications Officer Lulu Cheng Meservey, have full-time remote status.

Return to office policies have been a divisive subject in the games industry of late. Recently, a Unity manager was fired(opens in new tab) after referring to an exec's RTO solution as "out of touch" on Twitter. Meanwhile, other companies like Bungie (opens in new tab)and Respawn Entertainment have fully embraced remote-working.


The Unity firing mentioned comes after this tweet by her:

Quotea Unity exec just shared that they rent a secondary apt in SF to make it easier to be in the office- maybe we should all just do this to make it easier to RTO?   This company has lost it. Completely out of touch.

Story: https://www.pcgamer.com/unity-manager-publicly-states-company-is-out-of-touch-is-fired-within-three-hours/
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Grey Fox on May 13, 2023, 03:41:07 PM
I've held the same job for 15 years. My current employer is now 4 days a week in the office. For the 1st time in 15 years I'm looking for a new job. It won't easy tho since that QA conditions are usually so bad I am not looking into another QA job.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Jacob on May 13, 2023, 10:24:49 PM
While I agree with the Unity manager's opinion, I don't think there's anything unexpected in getting fired for using social media to call out your executive management's hypocrisy... at least if you're not protected by a collective agreement of some sort.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: grumbler on May 13, 2023, 10:36:05 PM
Quote from: Jacob on May 13, 2023, 10:24:49 PMWhile I agree with the Unity manager's opinion, I don't think there's anything unexpected in getting fired for using social media to call out your executive management's hypocrisy... at least if you're not protected by a collective agreement of some sort.

Agreed, and that's one reason why creative companies so often die after reaching a certain size; the very people most valuable to them are the people most likely to piss off the suits.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: HVC on May 13, 2023, 10:40:55 PM
If everyone goes RTO the talent will eventual get reshuffled in the industry. I think WFH as it existed during Covid is a losing battle. For good or for bad.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: The Minsky Moment on May 15, 2023, 10:40:27 AM
Quote from: HVC on May 13, 2023, 10:40:55 PMIf everyone goes RTO the talent will eventual get reshuffled in the industry. I think WFH as it existed during Covid is a losing battle. For good or for bad.

I don't know much about the dynamics of the industry, but it doesn't immediately strike me as having impenetrably high barriers to entry.  If that is so, some player or players are going to try to seize a recruiting advantage by offering more flexible work rules.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Jacob on May 15, 2023, 11:52:20 AM
Yeah, I'm with Minsky here.

My studio is sticking with hybrid on an organizational scale - meaning we have some folks who are fully remote, some who are fully in office, and some who WFH/WIO in some combination. It works for us and is one data point potential candidates evaluate when deciding whether to accept an offer. I don't see any indications that this is going to change in the reasonable future.

My thoughts on the topic:

1. There are definitely attractive hires who will not consider in-office-required positions. Companies that insist on in-office will take a hit there.

2. At the same time, I'm sure large organizations (like Activision) can survive mandating in-office, but there'll be a price (and some advantages too).

3. There will definitely be organizations - small and large - who'll make "we are fully remote" a point of competitive advantage (meaning the people mentioned in point 1. will be able to find work).

4. A significant amount of game dev - especially at the AAA level - is done by distributed teams anyhow. If, say, 75% of your work is collaborating with staff at offices other than your own then the potential advantages of being in the office (vs working remotely) can be signficantly reduced.

5. Microsoft - which may still end up acquiring Activision (I think?) - allows remote work.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Syt on June 01, 2023, 09:46:17 AM
https://www.pcgamer.com/activision-blizzard-ceo-audaciously-claims-that-sexism-and-harassment-problems-were-made-up-by-an-aggressive-labor-movement-trying-to-destabilize-the-company/

QuoteActivision Blizzard CEO audaciously claims that sexism and harassment problems were made up by an 'aggressive labor movement' trying to 'destabilize the company'
Bobby Kotick said in a new interview that there was never any "systemic issue with harassment" at his company.


In a new and frankly embarrassing interview with Variety, Activision Blizzard CEO Bobby Kotick said there's actually never been a problem with "systemic" harassment at the company, and that reports of such things were mainly the result of unions trying to cause trouble.

2021 was a very bad year for Activision Blizzard. In July of that year, California's Department of Fair Employment and Housing—now known as the Civil Rights Department—filed a lawsuit alleging widespread discrimination and sexual harassment at the company; that was followed by other investigations, the departure of numerous high-level employees, apologies, fines, multiple additional lawsuits, and significant pushback from employees, who founded the ABK Workers Alliance to help drive unionization efforts and bring about other meaningful change at the company.

Despite all of that, Activision Blizzard's board of directors said in June 2022 that, after conducting its own internal investigation, there was no evidence of systemic gender-based misconduct at the studio. Now, Kotick is not only sticking to that story, he's taking it a step further by pointing the finger at labor organizers.

"We've had every possible form of investigation done," Kotick said. "And we did not have a systemic issue with harassment—ever. We didn't have any of what were mischaracterizations reported in the media. But what we did have was a very aggressive labor movement working hard to try and destabilize the company."

That's certainly audacious, but it fits a new approach Kotick is apparently taking: He told Variety that his mistake when the allegations about widespread misconduct at Activision Blizzard first came to light was not forcefully defending the company and himself against them. "I wouldn't be sitting here talking to you if any of what you read in the inflammatory narrative was truthful," he said.

Ironically, Kotick also insisted that he is not "anti-union," and in fact claimed that he's "the only Fortune 500 CEO who's a member of a union." That would be SAG-AFTRA, the union representing film and television actors, journalists, and other related industry professionals, which he joined in 2011 after being cast as Oakland A's co-owner Steve Schott in the Brad Pitt film Moneyball.

"If we have employees who want a union to represent them, and they believe that that union is going to be able to provide them with opportunities and enhancements to their work experience, I'm all for it," Kotick said. "I have a mother who was a teacher. I have no aversion to a union. What I do have an aversion to is a union that doesn't play by the rules."

The record would seem to indicate otherwise. In January 2022, for instance, Activision Blizzard refused to voluntarily recognize a union formed by QA testers at Call of Duty studio Raven Software; it wasn't until June of that year that it changed direction, not long after Microsoft—which is in negotiations to acquire Activision—said that it will not oppose the union if and when it takes over
. In October 2022, the US National Labor Relations Board found that Activision Blizzard had withheld pay raises at Raven in retaliation for their roles in union organization; in January 2023, workers at Activision Blizzard studio Proletariat [ :lol: ] announced that they had dropped their request for a union vote because studio CEO Seth Sivak was "making a free and fair election impossible."

The Communications Workers of America, the labor organization that's been leading game industry unionization efforts, rejected Kotick's characterization. "Corporations choose to be disruptive when they run anti-union campaigns," CWA communications director Beth Allen told Variety. "Workers who join together to improve their workplaces intend to make constructive changes for the benefit of all. When employers voluntarily recognize unions and engage in good faith contract bargaining, it builds trust and strengthens companies."

Activision Blizzard has also previously acknowledged that misconduct at the company is in fact a problem. In March 2022, for instance, it paid $18 million to settle a sexual harassment lawsuit filed against it by the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission. Other lawsuits remain in motion, but Activision Blizzard has begun pushing back on that front too. In December 2022, it filed a lawsuit against California's CRD alleging that the agency had moved improperly slowly with the case and withheld information regarding its contact with media and unions.

In late 2021, PC Gamer spoke to three ex-Blizzard employees whose stories also disagree with Kotick's claims: They said among other things that inappropriate workplace behaviour, fuelled in part by an out-of-control drinking culture, was excused by management, and that women in their departments struggled to receive the same recognition as men.

Kotick also touched on Microsoft's in-the-works acquisition of Activision Blizzard, saying that "Microsoft is by far the best place for us to be" and that the deal makes particularly good sense in light of the rising cost of game development, especially "compensation for talent." But he added that the company will probably be okay if the acquisition is ultimately blocked: Activision Blizzard is currently sitting on roughly $12.6 billion in cash, and will gain another $3 billion on top of that from Microsoft as a penalty if the deal falls through.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Valmy on June 01, 2023, 09:57:45 AM
Everybody hates Kotick and he has no credibility. How he has remained CEO is beyond me, sure he is shitty and terrible for both customers and employees and generally hated by anybody in the general public who is aware of his existence.  But maybe he is good for investors somehow? Maybe taking companies with sterling reputations and making them a byword for shitty products and abusive labor practices during your entire tenure is good for business. I don't know. Capitalism makes no sense.

People who are obviously incompetent remain in high paying jobs at the tops of companies they are steering right into an iceberg remain in place for years. I never get it.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Grey Fox on June 01, 2023, 10:16:17 AM
Because Warren still likes him.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: The Brain on June 01, 2023, 11:00:51 AM
QuoteActivision Blizzard has also previously acknowledged that misconduct at the company is in fact a problem. In March 2022, for instance, it paid $18 million to settle a sexual harassment lawsuit filed against it by the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission.

Do settlements always mean that you have acknowledged what they claim you've done (I understand that settling looks like you've done something opticswise)? Or may it do so, and if so does this settlement?

IIRC they have made comments that acknowledge bad stuff (see upthread), my question is about settlements not about Activision Blizzard per se.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Barrister on June 01, 2023, 11:08:56 AM
Quote from: The Brain on June 01, 2023, 11:00:51 AM
QuoteActivision Blizzard has also previously acknowledged that misconduct at the company is in fact a problem. In March 2022, for instance, it paid $18 million to settle a sexual harassment lawsuit filed against it by the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission.

Do settlements always mean that you have acknowledged what they claim you've done (I understand that settling looks like you've done something opticswise)? Or may it do so, and if so does this settlement?

IIRC they have made comments that acknowledge bad stuff (see upthread), my question is about settlements not about Activision Blizzard per se.

In civil litigation it's not uncommon to have a "no admission" settlement, where you pay but specifically state you don't admit to doing anything wrong.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: The Brain on June 01, 2023, 11:53:08 AM
Quote from: Barrister on June 01, 2023, 11:08:56 AM
Quote from: The Brain on June 01, 2023, 11:00:51 AM
QuoteActivision Blizzard has also previously acknowledged that misconduct at the company is in fact a problem. In March 2022, for instance, it paid $18 million to settle a sexual harassment lawsuit filed against it by the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission.

Do settlements always mean that you have acknowledged what they claim you've done (I understand that settling looks like you've done something opticswise)? Or may it do so, and if so does this settlement?

IIRC they have made comments that acknowledge bad stuff (see upthread), my question is about settlements not about Activision Blizzard per se.

In civil litigation it's not uncommon to have a "no admission" settlement, where you pay but specifically state you don't admit to doing anything wrong.

Then I get the feeling that the article may have overstated things.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Valmy on June 01, 2023, 12:02:12 PM
Quote from: The Brain on June 01, 2023, 11:53:08 AMThen I get the feeling that the article may have overstated things.

Sucker. Never believe that guy. Kotick is, at best, dishonest in presenting facts.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: The Brain on June 01, 2023, 12:04:33 PM
Quote from: Valmy on June 01, 2023, 12:02:12 PM
Quote from: The Brain on June 01, 2023, 11:53:08 AMThen I get the feeling that the article may have overstated things.

Sucker. Never believe that guy. Kotick is, at best, dishonest in presenting facts.

:unsure:
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: grumbler on June 01, 2023, 02:16:17 PM
Quote from: The Brain on June 01, 2023, 11:00:51 AM
QuoteActivision Blizzard has also previously acknowledged that misconduct at the company is in fact a problem. In March 2022, for instance, it paid $18 million to settle a sexual harassment lawsuit filed against it by the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission.

Do settlements always mean that you have acknowledged what they claim you've done (I understand that settling looks like you've done something opticswise)? Or may it do so, and if so does this settlement?

IIRC they have made comments that acknowledge bad stuff (see upthread), my question is about settlements not about Activision Blizzard per se.

In the 2018 settlement, Activision Blizzard acknowledged that their procedures for investigating sexual misconduct didn't meet EEOC standards and agreed to revise them to conform to the law.  The SEC is investigating whether or not their failure constituted a failure of their duty to their stockholders.

So, yeah, they have acknowledged at least procedural misconduct.
Title: Re: Activision Blizzard Sued by California DFEH Over ‘Frat Boy’ Culture, Harassment
Post by: Syt on September 29, 2023, 11:20:38 AM
Epic is kicking out 800+ people and also get rid of Bandcamp which they bought in the ancient past of *checks notes* 2022.

https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/epic-lay-off-830-people-thanks-to-unrealistic-metaverse-ambitions

QuoteEpic lay off 830 people thanks to "unrealistic" metaverse ambitions

"For a while now, we've been spending way more money than we earn", concedes CEO


Unreal Engine and Fortnite publisher Epic Games are making an absolutely enormous round of job cuts. As announced by billionaire founder and CEO Tim Sweeney in an email to staff today, the company will lay off approximately 830 people, totalling "around 16%" of their workforce, in order to achieve "financial sustainability" following a period of heavy investment and lower-than-hoped returns from Fortnite.

"For a while now, we've been spending way more money than we earn, investing in the next evolution of Epic and growing Fortnite as a metaverse-inspired ecosystem for creators," Sweeney wrote in the letter. "I had long been optimistic that we could power through this transition without layoffs, but in retrospect I see that this was unrealistic.

"While Fortnite is starting to grow again, the growth is driven primarily by creator content with significant revenue sharing, and this is a lower margin business than we had when Fortnite Battle Royale took off and began funding our expansion. Success with the creator ecosystem is a great achievement, but it means a major structural change to our economics.

"Epic folks around the world have been making ongoing efforts to reduce costs, including moving to net zero hiring and cutting operating spend on things like marketing and events. But we still ended up far short of financial sustainability. We concluded that layoffs are the only way, and that doing them now and on this scale will stabilize our finances."

Two-thirds of the layoffs are in teams "outside of core development", Sweeney added. The company "aren't cutting any core businesses," he wrote, "and are continuing to invest in games with Fortnite first-party development, the Fortnite creator ecosystem and economy, Rocket League and Fall Guys." Epic also hope to avoid delaying any upcoming releases, including the next season of Fortnite and Fortnite Chapter 5, though Sweeney cautioned that "some [products] may not ship when planned because they are under-resourced for the time being."

As part of their bid to cut costs, Epic will also divest from Bandcamp, the audio distribution platform they acquired in 2022, and are spinning off most of SuperAwesome, a company that builds parental consent management tools for developers making games for kids, which Epic acquired in 2020. Bandcamp will become part of music marketplace Songtradr, while SuperAwesome are going independent, though Epic will retain ownership of SuperAwesome's Kids Web Services.

Sweeney insisted in the letter that "Epic's prospects for the future are strong" thanks to Unreal Engine and Fortnite. He's equally bullish about the future of Project Liberty, Epic's grandiose legal soap opera battle with Apple and Google over whether or not Epic should be able to sell Fortnite stuff via their services. "We've been taking steps to reduce our legal expenses, but are continuing the fight against Apple and Google distribution monopolies and taxes, so the metaverse can thrive and bring opportunity to Epic and all other developers."

Best of luck to all Epic staffers facing the chop today.


Renaming this thread to general games industry stuff, btw.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Jacob on September 29, 2023, 11:57:45 AM
I agree that Epic's future prospects are strong. They are are already the clear market leader when it comes to AAA game engines and their position is only getting stronger. Fortnite is still strong.

The Epic Game store is not going that well, as I understand it, and other initiatives have varying levels of success - but their core businesses are going strong.

Doesn't mean they can't fuck it up with poor executive strategy, but tightening up seems the right move from a corporate perspective - even if it sucks for the people who are laid off :(
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Barrister on September 29, 2023, 12:21:44 PM
Quote from: Jacob on September 29, 2023, 11:57:45 AMI agree that Epic's future prospects are strong. They are are already the clear market leader when it comes to AAA game engines and their position is only getting stronger. Fortnite is still strong.

The Epic Game store is not going that well, as I understand it, and other initiatives have varying levels of success - but their core businesses are going strong.

But that's just it - Epic has only ever had to really huge successes - the Unreal engine, and Fortnite.

I don't really see Unreal engine going away or being supplanted as long as they don't screw it up, but I do wonder how Fortnite can continue to be successful for year after year (though they've done a good job of it so far).  Those two have given Epic such a firehouse of money that they've made numerous investments, but I don't know how well any of them have really paid off for them.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Jacob on September 29, 2023, 12:29:16 PM
Yeah, I don't disagree with you.

Betting on the Metaverse was not a smart move, IMO. I project the Metaverse to not be a success.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Sheilbh on September 29, 2023, 02:45:13 PM
Yeah it's obviously very bad for the people who've been laid off. But if I went to a company all hands or town hall and the boss was saying they're going big on the Metaverse, I'd start preparing my CV.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Syt on October 12, 2023, 02:32:56 AM
Well, I guess Lamplighters League didn't pan out for Harebrained Schemes/Paradox. :(

I guess HS's forte is more with licensed IPs with established fanbases (Shadowrun, Battletch)?

https://www.pcgamer.com/paradox-says-the-lamplighters-league-sales-were-a-big-disappointment-confirms-recent-layoffs-at-developer-harebrained-schemes/

QuoteParadox says The Lamplighters League sales were 'a big disappointment,' confirms recent layoffs at developer Harebrained Schemes

By Andy Chalk published about 13 hours ago

The layoffs at Harebrained Schemes actually occurred a few months before The Lamplighters League was released.

Paradox Interactive is taking a big financial hit on the turn-based tactics game The Lamplighters League, saying that sales of the game have been "a big disappointment." Paradox also confirmed that significant layoffs had been made at developer Harebrained Schemes, but clarified that those layoffs occurred in the summer, a few months before The Lamplighters League was released.

The Lamplighters League, a pulp-inspired tale of a secret society battling an army of the occult in the 1930s, looked potentially interesting when it was revealed in March, in part because it was being developed by Harebrained Schemes, the studio behind the Shadowrun RPGs and the excellent tactics game Battletech. But it never really seemed to gain much traction with gamers in the months leading up to its release in October, and the final product was not great: It's "an over-ambitious and technically flawed tactics game that can't live up to its more accomplished influences," we said in our 62% review.

Just one week after release, publisher Paradox Interactive has decided to throw in the towel, essentially saying that it's eating the cost of making the game as a loss to the tune of 248 million Swedish kronor—roughly $22.8 million. Paradox said the decision to write down the development expense was made after The Lamplighter League's release, when sales failed to reach expectations.

"The Lamplighters League is a fun game with many strengths," Paradox CEO Fredrik Wester said in a press release. "Even though we see cautiously positive player numbers in subscription services, the commercial reception has been too weak, which is frankly a big disappointment. Game projects are by their nature always risky, but at the end of the day we haven't performed at the level we should. It is painful but makes us more eager to roll up our sleeves and do better."

That assessment is borne out on Steam, where The Lamplighters League has a "mostly positive" user rating but dismally low player numbers. According to Steam Charts, the game's all-time peak concurrent player count was just 690, less than half of today's peak concurrent player count for Battletech, which was released in 2018. That doesn't tell the whole tale, as The Lamplighters League is also available on Xbox consoles, and the "cautiously positive player numbers in subscription services"—that is, Game Pass—would presumably give it a bump on that platform. But this quick reaction from Paradox is a pretty clear indication that no one is expecting a meaningful turnaround.

Paradox isn't washing its hands of The Lamplighters League completely at this point: In a statement provided to PC Gamer, a Paradox representative said it is "still working on our post-launch support plan," although no details on that plan were provided.

"The commercial performance of the game is at a level well outside of our expectations," the rep said. "As we have lowered our forecast for revenues, we are also obligated to write down the game's book value to match the lower revenue expectations. This is unusual for us. As a publicly traded company, we are obligated to issue a press release regarding a write-down of this size.

"At present we have no changes to the game's post-launch plan."

The failure of The Lamplighters League also brought to light reports of layoffs at Harebrained Schemes: One person claiming to be a former employee of the studio said on the Resetera forums that roughly 80% of the studio's employees had been laid off in July, and multiple former employees have said on social media that they had been let go by the studio in that time frame.

The Paradox rep declined to provide numbers but confirmed that layoffs had taken place prior to The Lamplighters League's release, saying that "Harebrained Schemes' staff was significantly reduced over the summer as the game entered its last phase of development and launch preparations."


Yikes.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Solmyr on October 12, 2023, 02:35:18 AM
They seem to not have marketed it at all. I only learned about its existence from a Youtuber I follow. The game's premise looked interesting, though not something I'd pay full price for.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Syt on October 12, 2023, 02:39:43 AM
Yes, seems it was seriously underhyped. I thought the premise was interesting, but honestly didn't follow it closely (I generally rarely do anymore, but normally you pick up a few things here and there in the run-up to a game).

Could be various reasons for that - they thought it was so niche, that hype would be wasted. Or that the game would not be a great final product. Or that they thought it would do well based on word of mouth or the reputation of the developer/publisher. But other games don't seem much different - sure, Cities Skylines II has its dev diaries, and some Youtubers have been able to try it out. And similar with Millennia. Maybe they got burnt on the Victoria 3 hype/reception?
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: celedhring on October 12, 2023, 03:22:15 AM
I fear we may be entering the Hollywood phase of the gaming industry where it's either IP, indie, or bust.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: garbon on October 12, 2023, 03:24:39 AM
Quote from: celedhring on October 12, 2023, 03:22:15 AMI fear we may be entering the Hollywood phase of the gaming industry where it's either IP, indie, or bust.

Other links in that chain beyond this subpar game published by paradox?
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: The Minsky Moment on October 12, 2023, 10:56:04 AM
I saw it go onto GamePass on release; seemed like a bad sign for a non-MSFT controlled title.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Syt on October 18, 2023, 12:45:02 AM
https://www.pcgamer.com/harebrained-schemes-is-independent-again-paradox-parts-ways-with-the-studio-less-than-a-week-after-confirming-major-layoffs-earlier-this-year/

QuoteHarebrained Schemes is independent again: Paradox parts ways with the studio less than a week after confirming major layoffs earlier this year

Paradox and Harebrained say the split was a mutual decision.


Less than a week after saying that sales of turn-based tactics game The Lamplighters League were "a big disappointment" and confirming major layoffs at developer Harebrained Schemes, Paradox Interactive has announced that it has "decided to part ways" with the studio. Paradox said the split was a mutual decision, "stemming from each party's strategic and creative priorities," and that HBS will officially be independent again on January 1, 2024.

"Paradox has refocused its strategy towards its core niches within strategy and management games with endless qualities," Paradox COO Charlotta Nilsson said. "We and HBS' leadership have been discussing what would happen after the release of The Lamplighters League, but a new project or sequel in the same genre was not in line with our portfolio plans. Hence, we believe that a separation would be the best way forward."

The separation will leave Paradox with ownership of The Lamplighters League and "other games developed by the studio," although specifics about which games were not provided. Of particular interest on that front are Harebrained's best-known games, Shadowrun and Battletech: Both videogame series are based on tabletop games created by FASA, an RPG and tabletop gaming company co-founded by Jordan Weisman, who is also the co-founder of Harebrained Schemes.

It's something of a long and complicated history but the short version is that FASA launched a videogame studio called FASA Interactive in the mid '90s, which was eventually acquired by Microsoft. FASA Interactive was closed in 2007, but Microsoft licensed the rights to make new FASA-based videogames back to Weisman through his then-new, now-closed venture Smith and Tinker.

Those rights seemingly went with Weisman when he co-founded Harebrained Schemes in 2011 (the studio made three Shadowrun games and was deep into development of Battletech prior to its acquisition by Paradox) and the absence of those titles in the 'parting of ways' announcement makes me think that Harebrained Schemes may have retained them. HBS offered no insight into that possibility in its own comment on the split.

"Harebrained Schemes will support The Lamplighters League through the end of the year while we seek funding and partnerships for an independent future in 2024," studio operations manager Brian Poel said. "Our studio mission remains the same: to make games that challenge your mind and touch your heart."

What sort of resources Harebrained will have to pursue that mission remains to be seen. One person claiming to be a former employee of the studio said roughly 80% of its employees were laid off in June; Paradox didn't provide numbers in its confirmation but acknowledged that the headcount had been "significantly reduced." The one bright spot for the studio is that it has had consistent success with crowdfunding campaigns for its earlier project: Shadowrun Returns, Shadowrun: Hong Kong, and Battletech all far surpassed their goals on Kickstarter, and they all turned out to be pretty good games, too.

Not a huge surprise, but the comment about the portfolio seems weird, considering they have a Sims-like, a Civ-like, and a Factorio-like in the works. I would have thought turn based tactics would be more in their wheelhouse than at least Sims and Factorio. :hmm:



In other news: Bobby Kotick will leave ActiBlizz Dec 31st following the successful buyout by Microsoft.

https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2023/10/ceo-bobby-kotick-will-leave-activision-blizzard-on-january-1-2024/

QuoteCEO Bobby Kotick will leave Activision Blizzard on January 1, 2024

Bobby Kotick, CEO of Activision Blizzard, emailed employees after news of Microsoft's successful $69 billion acquisition to say that he was "fully committed to helping with the transition" and that he would stay on as CEO through the end of 2023.

Kotick's statement left some ambiguity about his plans for 2024, but Bloomberg's Jason Schreier reports that on January 1, Kotick will depart. It's "a massive change for the video game industry," Schreier writes, which seems almost restrained, given Kotick's longevity and recent history. Several employees Schreier spoke to are "very excited for this deal to go through," specifically to see leadership change. :lol:

Kotick, who has led Activision for more than 30 years and orchestrated its merger with Blizzard, had considered stepping down in late 2021. Following a lawsuit from the state of California alleging a "frat boy culture" rife with pay disparity and sexual harassment, a Wall Street Journal report alleged that Kotick failed to act on hundreds of abuse allegations within the company and also kept the company's board of directors in the dark. Activision was also sued by its shareholders and pressured by state treasurers over its secrecy and responses regarding the California lawsuit. All of this led to an employee walkout and calls for Kotick's resignation.

Kotick stood fast through the flurry of criticism in 2021. In early 2022, Microsoft announced its intent to buy Activision, and the timing, according to reports from Bloomberg and The Wall Street Journal, was not a coincidence. Kotick, according to Bloomberg, didn't want to sell but had little leverage with Activision's board to refuse an offer. Microsoft's purchase, at $95 per share, compared to the roughly $65 per share when the deal was announced, offered Kotick both a financial and narrative "graceful exit," according to the Journal's sources.

Kotick told VentureBeat after the Microsoft announcement that he didn't believe the harassment and mismanagement accusations hurt the company's stock. He cited delays in shipping Overwatch and Diablo titles, along with Call of Duty's sales performance.

While CEO of Activision, Kotick's termination without cause, or "Termination by employee for good reason following a change of control," guaranteed him nearly $300 million. Bloomberg reports that Kotick's windfall will likely be $375 million now that Microsoft's acquisition has gone through.


Phew, for a moment I was worried that Bobby would not be adequately compensated at the end of his tenure. :)
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Josquius on October 18, 2023, 07:52:37 AM
Must have been some real boardroom bollockings over Lamplighters.
Shame, it looks potentially interesting, but so many other good games at the moment.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: The Brain on October 18, 2023, 08:03:06 AM
Why didn't they market the game?
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: garbon on October 18, 2023, 08:46:58 AM
Quote from: The Brain on October 18, 2023, 08:03:06 AMWhy didn't they market the game?

Maybe because it was shit?
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: mongers on October 18, 2023, 09:33:02 AM
Quote from: garbon on October 18, 2023, 08:46:58 AM
Quote from: The Brain on October 18, 2023, 08:03:06 AMWhy didn't they market the game?

Maybe because it was shit?

That's not stopped marketeers before.   :D
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Syt on October 18, 2023, 09:50:39 AM
In the Paradoxplaza subreddit there's a thread about this: https://www.reddit.com/r/paradoxplaza/comments/17a59f6/harebrained_schemes_and_paradox_interactive_to/

Someone posted screenshots of Discord messages from supposedly a former HBS employee (so impossible to verify) posting this:

(https://i.imgur.com/tUm2khL.png)
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Jacob on October 18, 2023, 10:09:48 AM
Quote from: The Brain on October 18, 2023, 08:03:06 AMWhy didn't they market the game?

Typically the rough calculation is something like:


There's also the factor of slots on the calendar and resources within the publisher organization. Typically they only have bandwidth / staffing for a given number of releases a year and DLC / missed deadlines / market conditions can cause a release to be pushed back, having knock-on effects on lower priority releases.

That's the general case.

For Paradox specifically I've read that there's been a change in executive management (bringing back earlier executives), and that the incoming leadership wants to refocus on Paradox' core business - grand strategy games. Which Lamplighter is not.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Syt on October 18, 2023, 10:13:26 AM
I've seen comments that it's not so much grand strategy games, necessarily, but "endless" games, i.e. sandboxes with a potentially long life span, like EU4, HOI4  , Cities Skylines, and also now Millennia, Life by You, and their Factorio-like.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: The Minsky Moment on October 18, 2023, 10:46:53 AM
I don't get the discord message.  It says that the former President was ousted "and replaced by a status quo techbro board member."  But the replacement was Fredrik, who owns the company.  This isn't the replacement of one outside CEO by another outside CEO, it is the principal owner retaking over management.  That would also explain the tone of the company meeting.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Solmyr on October 18, 2023, 10:58:53 AM
Quote from: garbon on October 18, 2023, 08:46:58 AM
Quote from: The Brain on October 18, 2023, 08:03:06 AMWhy didn't they market the game?

Maybe because it was shit?

Apparently it wasn't though, according to the reviews I've seen it's pretty good.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Syt on October 18, 2023, 11:10:30 AM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on October 18, 2023, 10:46:53 AMI don't get the discord message.  It says that the former President was ousted "and replaced by a status quo techbro board member."  But the replacement was Fredrik, who owns the company.  This isn't the replacement of one outside CEO by another outside CEO, it is the principal owner retaking over management.  That would also explain the tone of the company meeting.

Yes, it's one of the reasons why I take the comments with a grain of salt. The way I see it is Fred handed over to a new person who wanted to diversify the publishing portfolio with very mixed success and Fred took back over.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Syt on November 10, 2023, 06:45:45 AM
The powers that be fired The Escapist editor in chief Nick Calandra on Nov 6th.

In response all video creators of The Escapist, including Yahtzee and the crew of their D&D campaign "Adventure is Nigh" resigned and they're striking out on their own. It also means that Zero Punctuation is coming to an end after 16 years. :o --- and doing I guess the same under his "Fully Ramblomatic" brand. :P

https://www.bbc.com/news/newsbeat-67348861

Yahtzee/Nick talk about it here: https://youtu.be/KG2ttRgc5Zk
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Josquius on November 10, 2023, 07:05:15 AM
Always wondered how The Escapist made their money.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: jimmy olsen on November 13, 2023, 11:40:11 PM
Quote from: Syt on October 12, 2023, 02:32:56 AMWell, I guess Lamplighters League didn't pan out for Harebrained Schemes/Paradox. :(


Yikes.
This is the first time I'd heard of this game and '30s occult stuff is right up my alley.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Syt on November 20, 2023, 08:29:16 AM
In a few weeks, the industry's auto-fellatio that is the Game Awards take place.

The nominees are online: https://thegameawards.com/nominees

Unsurprisingly, BG3 is nominated in almost every category that is applicable.
(https://i.postimg.cc/K8BS14KR/image.png)

The only one coming close is the new Zelda game with 5 nominations.

Meanwhile, and maybe surprisingly ...

(https://i.postimg.cc/QtMyJMMg/image.png)

Even Cyberpunk 2077 has 4 nominations (best narrative, best performance (Idriss Elba), best ongoing, best community support).

I sure hope Bethesda takes note for TES6.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Tamas on November 20, 2023, 08:45:47 AM
I mean I think that's fair. Starfield's sum of its parts is definitely very good and enjoyable but none of the individual parts stand out in this day and age. Like, really, none of the individual features of functionalities (except maybe number of quests, IDK) have improved on their area, they are all at best very good and often mediocre. The total result is a very nice and enjoyable game IMHO but not exactly rewards material. BG3 is a much more limits-extending products. No wonder it got furious complaints from other game devs.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Syt on November 20, 2023, 08:51:48 AM
I guess this article summarizes it somewhat. That it's mostly "all right" but  not a special standout as Bethesda games used to be. https://www.pcgamer.com/starfields-down-to-mixed-reviews-on-steam-while-the-community-laments-the-magic-is-just-missing-from-starfield/

IMO none of their games have had the staying power of Skyrim and all later attempts may have been making more money, but only Skyrim has stayed a popular touchstone.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: The Minsky Moment on December 08, 2023, 10:33:02 AM
Favorite steam review comment of the season so far:

"I know Blizzard gets a lot of hate, but personally, I don't think it gets enough."
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: crazy canuck on December 08, 2023, 10:55:43 AM
 :lol:
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Valmy on December 08, 2023, 07:46:49 PM
Quote from: Syt on November 20, 2023, 08:29:16 AMI sure hope Bethesda takes note for TES6.

Part of me kind of hopes they don't make it. Every TES game since Morrowind has gotten a little worse. Just IMO.

By TES6 there will probably be no skills or stats, you will just be a superhero, and the plot will just be 'WOW THE DARK BROTHERHOOD IS COOL!!!11"

But we will see.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Syt on December 12, 2023, 01:51:38 AM
Studios are firing people left and right (if not outright closing, Embracer being a main culprit there, it seems), but here's a big one that might alter the landscape on the whole:

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-67688720

QuoteGoogle loses monopoly case to Fortnite maker Epic Games

The maker of popular video game Fortnite has won a US court battle against Google, with a jury deciding that the search giant had operated an illegal monopoly.

Epic Games sued Google in 2020, accusing it of unlawfully making its app store dominant over rivals.

Hundreds of millions of people use the store to install apps for smartphones powered by Google's Android software.

Google has said it would challenge the outcome.

"Android and Google Play provide more choice and openness than any other major mobile platform," Wilson White, vice-president of government affairs and public policy at Google, said.

"The trial made clear that we compete fiercely with Apple and its App Store, as well as app stores on Android devices and gaming consoles," he added.

"We will continue to defend the Android business model and remain deeply committed to our users, partners, and the broader Android ecosystem."

Epic Chief Executive Tim Sweeney said that work on remedies would start in January.

"Victory over Google! After four weeks of detailed court testimony, the California jury found against the Google Play monopoly on all counts," Epic Chief Executive Tim Sweeney wrote in a post on X, formerly known as Twitter.

The lawyers for the two companies made their final arguments on Monday in the trial that lasted more than a month.

Jurors found in favour of Epic on all counts unanimously, according to a court filing.

The case also challenged transaction fees of up to 30% that Google imposes on Android app developers, and how the tech giant ties together its Play Store and billing service, which means developers must use both to have their apps in the store.

The ruling therefore could give developers more agency over how their apps are distributed and how they make money from them.

Google maintains that its commissions are competitive for the industry, and that it provides added bonuses like reach, transaction security and protections against malware.

But if the ruling stands, Google may have to allow more app stores onto Android-powered devices and will lose revenue it makes from any in-app purchases.

Google Play Store is one of the world's largest app stores and competes directly with Apple's App Store.

Android powers roughly 70% of smartphones globally, and according to Epic games, more than 95% of Android apps are distributed through the Play Store.

The store is not as profitable for the tech giant as its profitable search business, but the platform gives Google access to billions of mobile phones and tablets.

Epic said in the lawsuit that Google "suppresses innovation and choice" through a "web of secretive, anti-competitive agreements".

"Over the course of the trial we saw evidence that Google was willing to pay billions of dollars to stifle alternative app stores by paying developers to abandon their own store efforts and direct distribution plans, and offering highly lucrative agreements with device manufacturers in exchange for excluding competing app stores," Epic games said in a statement after the verdict.

Google had countersued for damages against Epic for allegedly violating the company's developer agreement.

The tech giant has faced a number of anti-trust cases, settling similar claims from dating app Match before the Epic trial started.

Epic filed a similar antitrust case against Apple in 2020, but a US judge largely ruled in favour of Apple in 2021.

"The evidence presented in this case demonstrates the urgent need for legislation and regulations that address Apple and Google strangleholds over smartphones," Epic Games said in its statement.


Oh, and there was some drama around the game "The Day Before" - never heard of the title, but apparently it was announced as open world zombie survival game a few years ago with art that immediately drew positive attention. Game launched less than a week ago, turned out to be far from what was promised (essentially a watered down, worse version of The Division with shitty gameplay and bad enemy AI), garnering an "overwhelmingly negative" score on Steam and - according to some social media posts from supposedly devs on Russian social media - almost half of players refunded the game. The devs announced yesterday that they'll close the studio because of the financial failure. Also, the game is now delisted from Steam. Debate seems to be ongoing whether it was a developer biting off more than they could chew, or one mor entry in a series of MMO scams that turn out to be glorifed asset flips where devs grab as much money as they can via the hype machine and then bolt.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Sheilbh on December 12, 2023, 01:56:14 AM
Worth noting there's about three separate challenges to pretty core bits of Google's business underway at the minute (and some of them started under Trump's DoJ and have continued under Biden's).

I feel like seeing them split up or voluntarily shutting down whole wings of their business (like advertising) is not beyond the realm of possiblilities any more.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Syt on December 12, 2023, 02:22:08 AM
Tbh, I'm not quite clear why judges would rule in favor of Apple in one case (with the Apple platform generally being more restrictive than Android), but against Google.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Sheilbh on December 12, 2023, 02:35:15 AM
Quote from: Syt on December 12, 2023, 02:22:08 AMTbh, I'm not quite clear why judges would rule in favor of Apple in one case (with the Apple platform generally being more restrictive than Android), but against Google.
It's a jury - Apple was a judge only.

I'm not sure on the details of this case - but the wider actions against Google's Play store is actually that it has a huge range of contractual relationships in order to preference certain vendors/block others. So it's not a walled garden like Apple, but it's all rigged.

Edit: That's the argument certainly in the Chrome case. But there's a case against Chrome, the Epic case against Play Store and a case against Google's digital advertising business (through search). As I say those seem to me, as an outsider, like Google's three core businesses :ph34r:
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: HVC on December 12, 2023, 03:32:53 AM
Splitting up their core businesses can't be good for shareholder value. All hail the reign of Bing?
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Josquius on December 12, 2023, 04:42:26 AM
I mean, I hate Epic and as mega-corps go I don't hate Google as much as others....
But this does sound positive.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: The Minsky Moment on December 12, 2023, 09:28:13 AM
Quote from: Valmy on December 08, 2023, 07:46:49 PM
Quote from: Syt on November 20, 2023, 08:29:16 AMI sure hope Bethesda takes note for TES6.

Part of me kind of hopes they don't make it. Every TES game since Morrowind has gotten a little worse. Just IMO.


Skyrim>Oblivion IMO.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Grey Fox on December 12, 2023, 09:49:15 AM
Quote from: Sheilbh on December 12, 2023, 01:56:14 AMI feel like seeing them split up or voluntarily shutting down whole wings of their business (like advertising) is not beyond the realm of possiblilities any more.

That would be surprising. Advertising is the only thing they can actually do for a long period of time & how they measure success of the other business endeavours.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: The Minsky Moment on December 12, 2023, 10:01:13 AM
Quote from: Syt on December 12, 2023, 02:22:08 AMTbh, I'm not quite clear why judges would rule in favor of Apple in one case (with the Apple platform generally being more restrictive than Android), but against Google.

Although Google filed legal motions to dispose of the case pre-trial, those motions appear to have been dropped - perhaps because Google was pursuing counterclaims against Epic and was willing to go to trial.  Google did move for judgment as a matter of law at trial and its argument relied heavily on the 2023 appeal's court decision in the Epic v. Apple case. Assuming the district judge does not disturb the verdict, Google may appeal and ask the court of appeals to overturn the verdict as contrary to law, relying on the Apple precedent.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Valmy on December 12, 2023, 10:07:06 AM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on December 12, 2023, 09:28:13 AM
Quote from: Valmy on December 08, 2023, 07:46:49 PM
Quote from: Syt on November 20, 2023, 08:29:16 AMI sure hope Bethesda takes note for TES6.

Part of me kind of hopes they don't make it. Every TES game since Morrowind has gotten a little worse. Just IMO.


Skyrim>Oblivion IMO.

Oblivion did have the most evil and perverse leveling system in gaming history.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Syt on December 12, 2023, 11:30:41 AM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on December 12, 2023, 10:01:13 AM
Quote from: Syt on December 12, 2023, 02:22:08 AMTbh, I'm not quite clear why judges would rule in favor of Apple in one case (with the Apple platform generally being more restrictive than Android), but against Google.

Although Google filed legal motions to dispose of the case pre-trial, those motions appear to have been dropped - perhaps because Google was pursuing counterclaims against Epic and was willing to go to trial.  Google did move for judgment as a matter of law at trial and its argument relied heavily on the 2023 appeal's court decision in the Epic v. Apple case. Assuming the district judge does not disturb the verdict, Google may appeal and ask the court of appeals to overturn the verdict as contrary to law, relying on the Apple precedent.

Thanks for the info. :)
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: grumbler on December 12, 2023, 01:35:34 PM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on December 12, 2023, 09:28:13 AM
Quote from: Valmy on December 08, 2023, 07:46:49 PM
Quote from: Syt on November 20, 2023, 08:29:16 AMI sure hope Bethesda takes note for TES6.

Part of me kind of hopes they don't make it. Every TES game since Morrowind has gotten a little worse. Just IMO.


Skyrim>Oblivion IMO.

The perception of the new game being worse is, IMO, created by the fact that we were going from fully-modded older games to unmodded newer games.  Modded Skyrim is better than Oblivion and modded Oblivion is better than Morrowind (in fact, you can play Morrowinfd in modded Oblivion).
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: grumbler on December 12, 2023, 01:38:38 PM
Quote from: Valmy on December 12, 2023, 10:07:06 AMOblivion did have the most evil and perverse leveling system in gaming history.

Mods took care of that.  I agree that, while it lasted, it was ridiculously funny for bandits in 2,000 gold piece armor trying to rob the PC of his 20 gold pieces.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Jacob on December 12, 2023, 01:49:29 PM
Do you think modded Starfield will surpass modded Skyrim?
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Jacob on December 12, 2023, 01:51:09 PM
My perception is that industry wide, there's a strong push to harness and monetize UGC.

My hunch is that it will suck the soul out of the modding scene, generally speaking.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: grumbler on December 12, 2023, 02:18:52 PM
Quote from: Jacob on December 12, 2023, 01:49:29 PMDo you think modded Starfield will surpass modded Skyrim?

I'm not seeing that now, because Starfield's non-quest gameplay just isn't compelling.  There aren't all the curated open world encounters you get with Skyrim.  Maybe there will be enough quest mods to make up for it, though.  It would also help if someone could make the outpost system seem worth bothering, and/or piracy a profitable and interesting activity.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Valmy on December 12, 2023, 02:25:06 PM
Quote from: grumbler on December 12, 2023, 01:35:34 PM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on December 12, 2023, 09:28:13 AM
Quote from: Valmy on December 08, 2023, 07:46:49 PM
Quote from: Syt on November 20, 2023, 08:29:16 AMI sure hope Bethesda takes note for TES6.

Part of me kind of hopes they don't make it. Every TES game since Morrowind has gotten a little worse. Just IMO.


Skyrim>Oblivion IMO.

The perception of the new game being worse is, IMO, created by the fact that we were going from fully-modded older games to unmodded newer games.  Modded Skyrim is better than Oblivion and modded Oblivion is better than Morrowind (in fact, you can play Morrowinfd in modded Oblivion).

Maybe. But I played both unmodded.

I played them for about a hundred hours each and eventually lost interest. Never go to the point of using the mods.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Josquius on December 12, 2023, 02:25:55 PM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on December 12, 2023, 09:28:13 AM
Quote from: Valmy on December 08, 2023, 07:46:49 PM
Quote from: Syt on November 20, 2023, 08:29:16 AMI sure hope Bethesda takes note for TES6.

Part of me kind of hopes they don't make it. Every TES game since Morrowind has gotten a little worse. Just IMO.


Skyrim>Oblivion IMO.

>Morrowind.

Though I will say I've played skyrim a lot less than oblivion despite it being objectively better. I guess it's just less good for it's time.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: The Minsky Moment on December 12, 2023, 02:43:06 PM
Quote from: grumbler on December 12, 2023, 01:38:38 PMMods took care of that.  I agree that, while it lasted, it was ridiculously funny for bandits in 2,000 gold piece armor trying to rob the PC of his 20 gold pieces.

You can't get rich without sweating the little stuff.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: The Minsky Moment on December 12, 2023, 02:47:05 PM
Quote from: Syt on December 12, 2023, 11:30:41 AM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on December 12, 2023, 10:01:13 AM
Quote from: Syt on December 12, 2023, 02:22:08 AMTbh, I'm not quite clear why judges would rule in favor of Apple in one case (with the Apple platform generally being more restrictive than Android), but against Google.

Although Google filed legal motions to dispose of the case pre-trial, those motions appear to have been dropped - perhaps because Google was pursuing counterclaims against Epic and was willing to go to trial.  Google did move for judgment as a matter of law at trial and its argument relied heavily on the 2023 appeal's court decision in the Epic v. Apple case. Assuming the district judge does not disturb the verdict, Google may appeal and ask the court of appeals to overturn the verdict as contrary to law, relying on the Apple precedent.

Thanks for the info. :)

To be clear - Google is in a much tougher spot than Apple was on appeal.  The Apple case was a bench trial and the judge ruled for Apple.  So the appeals court was just deciding if the judge's decision for Apple was justifiable.  Here, a jury gave a verdict for Epic, which means google faces the uphill battle of showing that the verdict is totally inconsistent with the law. Even though it's the same appeals court in both cases, they could reach different results because of the deference given to jury findings.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: The Minsky Moment on December 12, 2023, 02:52:20 PM
Quote from: Jacob on December 12, 2023, 01:51:09 PMMy perception is that industry wide, there's a strong push to harness and monetize UGC.

My hunch is that it will suck the soul out of the modding scene, generally speaking.

Classic example of penny wise, pound foolish, and TES is the perfect case.  They are still earning money selling Super-Duper Mega Complete versions of Skyrim (with hyper-augmentable ultra reality) a decade down the line because the UGC keeps the game fresh.  Kill the scene, kill the golden goose.  Free labor is a gift in itself.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Valmy on December 12, 2023, 03:18:23 PM
Quote from: Josquius on December 12, 2023, 02:25:55 PM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on December 12, 2023, 09:28:13 AM
Quote from: Valmy on December 08, 2023, 07:46:49 PM
Quote from: Syt on November 20, 2023, 08:29:16 AMI sure hope Bethesda takes note for TES6.

Part of me kind of hopes they don't make it. Every TES game since Morrowind has gotten a little worse. Just IMO.


Skyrim>Oblivion IMO.

>Morrowind.

Though I will say I've played skyrim a lot less than oblivion despite it being objectively better. I guess it's just less good for it's time.

Well good for you.

Morrowind had lots of interesting systems and an interesting setting and an interesting plot. Like I actually was curious about Dagoth Ur and actually interested in how the game played and actually wanted to at some point be tough enough to beat that big mean Daedra. And it was cool when I finally could. And you could do cool things like fly around and stuff (and fight cliff racers...).

I won the main game and Tribunal and eventually got bored on the island expansion where there were just too many monsters. Like at one point I entered a tunnel and there was a huge long line of monsters just waiting their turn to get killed by me. At that point I was like "ok I think I am done here".

But, you know, it was a good, interesting, and memorable time.

Oblivion had a lot of the same systems, which I liked, but seemed very determined to make them worse. Level scaling the monsters was so fucking stupid and lame and provided one of many incentives to just not level. It also meant if you leveled a certain way, you were fucked completely. Why did they do that? And then they limited the number of times you can train per level...why the fuck? Just because they took a really interesting leveling system from Morrowind and made it incredibly horrid and took the decent combat and made it very spongey and broken and then wanted to make sure you had to engage with it as much as possible.

Then you had the Daedra which seemed very intriguing in Morrowind and basically made it so "hey these guys are basically demons and Oblivion is basically hell" boring. I understand they fixed this a bit in the shivering Isles expansion but I never got that far. Then they took the jungle romans we were promised in Morrowind and just made Cyrodiil really boring and lame. The plot of Morrowind, which was intriguing and had all these interesting themes about tradition vs modernism, imperialism, religion, propaganda, and probably a few more I am forgetting. The plot of Oblivion has a cult which is evil for no reason, and a big bad who is just a big demon guy, blah blah.

I mean I gave it a shot. I played the shit out of it. But it just never got better and eventually I got bored and quit playing. Never actually finished the main plot.

Oh and the Dark Brotherhood, which the game clearly thought was the COOLEST SHIT EVER. Meh.

Skyrim did fix a lot of Oblivion's issues but did so by mostly just removing the system. So you barely had anything left. Everything was so...fucking...streamlined and dull. And the things that did seem cool at first would end up being kind of cringy and lame. The Civil War was almost comically silly. I did finish that and won it for the Imperials. I just remember thinking "wow that was bad". The Dragons were so lame and so easy to kill and because I knew a little bit about the Dragons in the lore of the series I felt kind of bad about that. And the magic system, which was so cool in Morrowind you could make your own spells and do interesting things, and in Skyrim it is so stripped down and lame and pathetic. If you try to play a mage character in Skyrim you are in for a bad time. The game hates you. And like the Civil War side plot the game disappointed me constantly with the main plot, everything that seemed kind of cool would turn out to be stupid. Oh and fuck that Vampire expansion. Laughable. I don't think I am some kind of snob, I played Dragon Age II a game most people felt was disappointing and I enjoyed it despite its flaws. I gave this game a chance. It just never lived up to its promises.

So yeah I played the shit out of it, always with the promise of something cool about to happen and then never happening.

But I understand that really both Oblivion and Skyrim are really just platforms for player made content and mods and that is great. Minecraft and Roblox are pretty fun according to my kids. I don't have time for that though. If I had finished either Oblivion or Skyrim and wanted to play more I would have tried out the mods, but I never got that far.

And based on what I understand about Fallout 3, Fallout 4, Fallout 76, and Starfield Bethesda is not getting better with the issues I did not like about Oblivion and Skyrim. They are getting worse.

My basic interest in the Elder Scrolls series and the fun I remember having with Morrowind will probably compel me to at least give ES 6 a chance. So we'll see. Maybe they will do something interesting.

Or maybe I won't, I never felt any desire to play ES Online. But a MMORPG is a whole different level of commitment than putting in a few hundred hours in a single player game.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Jacob on December 12, 2023, 03:24:33 PM
Yes, I agree on your take, Minsky.

Rather than trying to add a transaction cost on every mod and then taking a slice, they should upgrade the base game in a way that doesn't undermine mods. I'd happily pay full game price for a new release of Skyrim if it upgraded my game in a significant way while leaving my mods (mostly) intact.

Of course, that requires more investment - and risk taking - than "let's try to turn the modding community into a source of rents for us."
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Valmy on December 12, 2023, 03:35:01 PM
Quote from: Jacob on December 12, 2023, 03:24:33 PMthan "let's try to turn the modding community into a source of rents for us."

But...but...shareholder value
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: frunk on December 12, 2023, 05:16:18 PM
Quote from: Jacob on December 12, 2023, 01:51:09 PMMy perception is that industry wide, there's a strong push to harness and monetize UGC.

My hunch is that it will suck the soul out of the modding scene, generally speaking.

Definitely something I'm worried about.  I'm disappointed there was so much push back on the monetization for mods.  I think if it could have been set up as another potential revenue stream while letting the modders choose if they want to charge (and the company only getting a cut if the modder asked for money), companies would be more receptive to keeping their architectures open.

Personally I like high quality mods, and seeing what some can do I'd like to give them money directly through the mod infrastructure rather than the Patreon end around.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Jacob on December 12, 2023, 05:33:05 PM
I don't know if monetization of mods is going to result in higher quality mods, though.

Will there be an increase in shovelware mods as hucksters chase perceived easy money by putting crap out for unsuspecting fools to buy?

Will we see an increase in people stealing content from other mod authors, pretending it's theirs so they can get free money?

There are large mods that are the result of collaboration between many people pursuing a common goal? How will the potential of revenue influence people's willingness to contribute to mods where they're not the beneficiary?

Similarly, there are mods that have been handed from one author to another over time as individuals burn out but others step up to carry the torch. If there's money on the line, how willing will authors be to pick up their work to continue it?

If you have to pay for mods, how willing will people be to download weird or interesting new mods for a laugh or just to try them out? Lowering uptake in general will potnetially impact the range of mods being made.

What about compatibility? If I pay for a mod and it doesn't play nice with other mods (that I've also paid for), I'll be pretty disappointed - definitely more so than if it was something I downloaded for free. What if the mod is buggy, then what? However this is handled will impact the ecosystem.

I too like high quality mods, and I'm not against rewarding the people who make them. The question is, will monetizing mods incentivize making more of them? All the high quality mods we have now (and the low quality ones too) were made without explicit monetization as an incentive. Is it reasonable to expect that monetizing is going to result in an increase or a decrease?
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Josquius on December 14, 2023, 04:22:18 AM
Quote from: Valmy on December 12, 2023, 03:18:23 PM
Quote from: Josquius on December 12, 2023, 02:25:55 PM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on December 12, 2023, 09:28:13 AM
Quote from: Valmy on December 08, 2023, 07:46:49 PM
Quote from: Syt on November 20, 2023, 08:29:16 AMI sure hope Bethesda takes note for TES6.

Part of me kind of hopes they don't make it. Every TES game since Morrowind has gotten a little worse. Just IMO.


Skyrim>Oblivion IMO.

>Morrowind.

Though I will say I've played skyrim a lot less than oblivion despite it being objectively better. I guess it's just less good for it's time.

Well good for you.

Morrowind had lots of interesting systems and an interesting setting and an interesting plot. Like I actually was curious about Dagoth Ur and actually interested in how the game played and actually wanted to at some point be tough enough to beat that big mean Daedra. And it was cool when I finally could. And you could do cool things like fly around and stuff (and fight cliff racers...).

I won the main game and Tribunal and eventually got bored on the island expansion where there were just too many monsters. Like at one point I entered a tunnel and there was a huge long line of monsters just waiting their turn to get killed by me. At that point I was like "ok I think I am done here".

But, you know, it was a good, interesting, and memorable time.

Oblivion had a lot of the same systems, which I liked, but seemed very determined to make them worse. Level scaling the monsters was so fucking stupid and lame and provided one of many incentives to just not level. It also meant if you leveled a certain way, you were fucked completely. Why did they do that? And then they limited the number of times you can train per level...why the fuck? Just because they took a really interesting leveling system from Morrowind and made it incredibly horrid and took the decent combat and made it very spongey and broken and then wanted to make sure you had to engage with it as much as possible.

Then you had the Daedra which seemed very intriguing in Morrowind and basically made it so "hey these guys are basically demons and Oblivion is basically hell" boring. I understand they fixed this a bit in the shivering Isles expansion but I never got that far. Then they took the jungle romans we were promised in Morrowind and just made Cyrodiil really boring and lame. The plot of Morrowind, which was intriguing and had all these interesting themes about tradition vs modernism, imperialism, religion, propaganda, and probably a few more I am forgetting. The plot of Oblivion has a cult which is evil for no reason, and a big bad who is just a big demon guy, blah blah.

I mean I gave it a shot. I played the shit out of it. But it just never got better and eventually I got bored and quit playing. Never actually finished the main plot.

Oh and the Dark Brotherhood, which the game clearly thought was the COOLEST SHIT EVER. Meh.

Skyrim did fix a lot of Oblivion's issues but did so by mostly just removing the system. So you barely had anything left. Everything was so...fucking...streamlined and dull. And the things that did seem cool at first would end up being kind of cringy and lame. The Civil War was almost comically silly. I did finish that and won it for the Imperials. I just remember thinking "wow that was bad". The Dragons were so lame and so easy to kill and because I knew a little bit about the Dragons in the lore of the series I felt kind of bad about that. And the magic system, which was so cool in Morrowind you could make your own spells and do interesting things, and in Skyrim it is so stripped down and lame and pathetic. If you try to play a mage character in Skyrim you are in for a bad time. The game hates you. And like the Civil War side plot the game disappointed me constantly with the main plot, everything that seemed kind of cool would turn out to be stupid. Oh and fuck that Vampire expansion. Laughable. I don't think I am some kind of snob, I played Dragon Age II a game most people felt was disappointing and I enjoyed it despite its flaws. I gave this game a chance. It just never lived up to its promises.

So yeah I played the shit out of it, always with the promise of something cool about to happen and then never happening.

But I understand that really both Oblivion and Skyrim are really just platforms for player made content and mods and that is great. Minecraft and Roblox are pretty fun according to my kids. I don't have time for that though. If I had finished either Oblivion or Skyrim and wanted to play more I would have tried out the mods, but I never got that far.

And based on what I understand about Fallout 3, Fallout 4, Fallout 76, and Starfield Bethesda is not getting better with the issues I did not like about Oblivion and Skyrim. They are getting worse.

My basic interest in the Elder Scrolls series and the fun I remember having with Morrowind will probably compel me to at least give ES 6 a chance. So we'll see. Maybe they will do something interesting.

Or maybe I won't, I never felt any desire to play ES Online. But a MMORPG is a whole different level of commitment than putting in a few hundred hours in a single player game.


I know Morrowind has its fans and I've heard this argument of it being a special and unique world vs. Oblivion's generic fantasy many times, but it just doesn't sit with me.

1: Oblivion being a generic fantasy world is a GOOD thing. Generic fantasy is something many people (like me) grew up with. We know its rules and standards. In Oblivion you had an amazing immersive version of these. There was nothing like it. An open world fantasy setting. This was brilliant.
Morrowind being different and special...maybe that would be good now after we've had so many generic fantasy open worlds but at its time it just didn't add anything.

2: No matter how great Morrowinds story may have been (I really don't know), I wonder how many people are like me and just never saw it. The gameplay is just...rubbish. Even for its time I'd perhaps say- though I think I played it a few years later. The whole right click menu, left click action, in an action game.... I just couldn't get on with it.
I tried it several times but never got more than an hour or two of play, maybe attempting a basic initial quest or two.


Oblivion was by no means perfect. The level scaling was terrible. The jank was strong. Way too many generic copy and pastola assets and quests.


I remember when I was very young at a cousins' house playing a demo of a game that I now believe to have been Dagerfall and finding it awesome. I wish I had played it when it was fresh. I'd have loved it. But looking at TES these days anything pre Oblivion (at least? Not tried Oblivion lately...) is just too dated to enjoy.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: grumbler on December 15, 2023, 10:49:51 AM
When Open Morrowind came out, I checked out Morrowind again for the first time in many years.  It was a nice nostalgia trip, but also a reminder of how far we have come since its release.  Combat was ridiculous, character leveling was ludicrous, guild quests were boring, and the looks have not aged well.

For anyone interested in a nostalgia trip, Open Morrowind does get rid of the bugginess/crashiness of the original game.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Razgovory on December 15, 2023, 09:54:25 PM
I really liked Skyrim.  I'm glad they ditched the awful leveling system.  I liked Morrowind. alright, but was disappointed by the AI.  The way the monsters often just paced back and forth.  Arx Fatalis came out the same time and I liked it better.  Oblivion was mediocre.  I hated the speech system and the lock picking.  Graphically it was very impressive, but yeah, generic.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: viper37 on December 29, 2023, 10:38:30 PM
Quote from: Jacob on December 12, 2023, 05:33:05 PMI don't know if monetization of mods is going to result in higher quality mods, though.

Will there be an increase in shovelware mods as hucksters chase perceived easy money by putting crap out for unsuspecting fools to buy?

Will we see an increase in people stealing content from other mod authors, pretending it's theirs so they can get free money?

These two scenarios are much more likely to happen.

It's already happening with Patreon, where some mod authors sometime try to steal work from someone else and put it behind a paywall.

Or just a DLSS mod for Starfield that gets put behind a Patreon and the author asks for money after every game patch.

I'm not against the concept of paid mods, but it should be up to the mod author to decide if he wants money or not, and that's why like the donation system on NexusMods.  Granted, they won't survive on that.  Nor on the advertising revenue cut.  But it might help the more popular mods.

I'm more concerned about game devs closing their system (Rockstar) or simply not caring at all like EA where it's a nightmare to get a mod running (thanks EA App!).

I understand why they had to ban mods from online play, but let me play sp however I want dammit.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Josquius on January 25, 2024, 04:39:08 AM
So. What do we make of the Palworld controversy?

This game has seemingly come out of nowhere and is dominating Steam charts, on course to be one of the best selling games ever.
Its basically yet another open world survival game.... but with Pokemon little monster friends that you carry around with you named Pals. "Pokemon with guns" is another description I've heard.

Looking at it, the designs do indeed look extremely like Pokemon.
The Pokemon Company has took note of this and legal action is brewing.

I'm very curious to see how it works out. Seems very convenient the Pokemon Company would suddenly be so upset at this game becoming super succesful when we've had imitators as long as Pokemon has existed- hell, Pokemon itself copied a tonne of stuff in many aspects.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Tamas on January 25, 2024, 04:42:25 AM
Quote from: Josquius on January 25, 2024, 04:39:08 AMSo. What do we make of the Palworld controversy?

This game has seemingly come out of nowhere and is dominating Steam charts, on course to be one of the best selling games ever.
Its basically yet another open world survival game.... but with Pokemon little monster friends that you carry around with you named Pals. "Pokemon with guns" is another description I've heard.

Looking at it, the designs do indeed look extremely like Pokemon.
The Pokemon Company has took note of this and legal action is brewing.

I'm very curious to see how it works out. Seems very convenient the Pokemon Company would suddenly be so upset at this game becoming super succesful when we've had imitators as long as Pokemon has existed- hell, Pokemon itself copied a tonne of stuff in many aspects.

I am not sure what the controversy is. Unsuccessful Pokemon ripoffs do not worth the legal cost to chase, I am sure. Here Pokemon could get some meaningful compensation if the game takes off.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Josquius on January 25, 2024, 04:55:02 AM
Quote from: Tamas on January 25, 2024, 04:42:25 AM
Quote from: Josquius on January 25, 2024, 04:39:08 AMSo. What do we make of the Palworld controversy?

This game has seemingly come out of nowhere and is dominating Steam charts, on course to be one of the best selling games ever.
Its basically yet another open world survival game.... but with Pokemon little monster friends that you carry around with you named Pals. "Pokemon with guns" is another description I've heard.

Looking at it, the designs do indeed look extremely like Pokemon.
The Pokemon Company has took note of this and legal action is brewing.

I'm very curious to see how it works out. Seems very convenient the Pokemon Company would suddenly be so upset at this game becoming super succesful when we've had imitators as long as Pokemon has existed- hell, Pokemon itself copied a tonne of stuff in many aspects.

I am not sure what the controversy is. Unsuccessful Pokemon ripoffs do not worth the legal cost to chase, I am sure. Here Pokemon could get some meaningful compensation if the game takes off.


Wouldn't this affect their case however? That there's so many of these games out there stretching back decades and suddenly they become interested because one is succesful?
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Tamas on January 25, 2024, 05:00:57 AM
Sure, but I don't think its a controversy, per se. The Whatsitsname game's creators if they lose I can't feel too sorry because it seems they were clearly going for a Pokemon vibe. If Pokemon loses, well, whatever.

Especially since I am sure Pokemon will be looking for a slice of the pie, not a cease and desist.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: The Minsky Moment on January 25, 2024, 12:32:12 PM
You can't patent or copyright a concept for a game that has companion animals that you train and fight, Pokemon style.  As long as they aren't using actual Pokemon creatures, I don't see the case here. 
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: garbon on January 25, 2024, 01:01:29 PM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on January 25, 2024, 12:32:12 PMYou can't patent or copyright a concept for a game that has companion animals that you train and fight, Pokemon style.  As long as they aren't using actual Pokemon creatures, I don't see the case here. 

Multiple game sites reach out to lawyers to get their perspectives.

The two places I saw where they said there might be a claim was:
1) It has been suggested that the proportions for many of their creatures match exactly to pokemon creatures and that it would be impossible for that to be the case unless they had directly copied the Nintendo models
2) Reputational harm to Pokemon via the gun angle making people associate that with Pokemon

Here's one link that looked at both of those.

https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/does-palworld-break-pokemons-copyright-we-asked-a-lawyer
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: garbon on January 25, 2024, 01:02:31 PM
What Nintendo did go after (and got modder scared) was modder who put out video saying they had created mod with Pokemon creatures replacing Palworld critters in game.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: The Minsky Moment on January 25, 2024, 01:13:14 PM
Quote from: garbon on January 25, 2024, 01:01:29 PM1) It has been suggested that the proportions for many of their creatures match exactly to pokemon creatures and that it would be impossible for that to be the case unless they had directly copied the Nintendo models

Maybe . . . there was a similar case involving one of the Street Fighter games, where some of the models were copied and the developer docs referenced the SF models, and the claim still wasn't sustained.

The key concept in these cases is the idea/expression dichotomy; you can copy the idea but not a particular expression  of it.  Looking at the games as a whole from the preview images and video I've seen for palworld, the expression as a whole looks different.

I'm not sure what to make of the claim "the proportions for many of their creatures match exactly to pokemon creatures and that it would be impossible for that to be the case unless they had directly copied the Nintendo models".  Admittedly I know nothing about computer graphic design but it's hard to see why copying proportions would be that hard. And I don't think copying proportions alone would be enough in any case if the creatures have other significant difference.  You can't copyright a body proportion of a fictional animal, just the expression of the particular fictional animal as a whole.

Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: garbon on January 25, 2024, 01:21:05 PM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on January 25, 2024, 01:13:14 PM
Quote from: garbon on January 25, 2024, 01:01:29 PM1) It has been suggested that the proportions for many of their creatures match exactly to pokemon creatures and that it would be impossible for that to be the case unless they had directly copied the Nintendo models

Maybe . . . there was a similar case involving one of the Street Fighter games, where some of the models were copied and the developer docs referenced the SF models, and the claim still wasn't sustained.

The key concept in these cases is the idea/expression dichotomy; you can copy the idea but not a particular expression  of it.  Looking at the games as a whole from the preview images and video I've seen for palworld, the expression as a whole looks different.

I'm not sure what to make of the claim "the proportions for many of their creatures match exactly to pokemon creatures and that it would be impossible for that to be the case unless they had directly copied the Nintendo models".  Admittedly I know nothing about computer graphic design but it's hard to see why copying proportions would be that hard. And I don't think copying proportions alone would be enough in any case if the creatures have other significant difference.  You can't copyright a body proportion of a fictional animal, just the expression of the particular fictional animal as a whole.



They cited those graphic designers in there. I guess idea is less about the proportions but that it is evidence of the idea they took pokemon models and then just distorted them...so something akin to issues right now with art and generative AI?
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: The Minsky Moment on January 25, 2024, 01:36:57 PM
Quote from: garbon on January 25, 2024, 01:21:05 PMThey cited those graphic designers in there.

I saw that but it was a lot of this anonymous guy commenting on what some other anonymous guy said. 

QuoteI guess idea is less about the proportions but that it is evidence of the idea they took pokemon models and then just distorted them...so something akin to issues right now with art and generative AI?

If they directly copied the models, that would create two potential issues.  On copyright, the question would be whether what they copied was protectible expression, and that would go back to idea/expression dichotomy.  If all that got copied into the game were the proportions, then we go back to the earlier analysis.  The other issue is that Pokemon's titles are licensed software and if the Palworld people did that, it would certainly be a breach of the license agreement. 
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Syt on January 26, 2024, 09:41:12 AM
https://www.pcgamer.com/blizzard-survival-game-cancellation-news/

QuoteBlizzard's canceled survival game had been in development for over 6 years, was highly praised by employees
By Tyler Wilde published about 15 hours ago
"Many" of the survival game's devs have now been laid off with no shipped game for their resumes, and very little public information about the project.


Blizzard's unnamed survival game had already been in development for over four years when it was announced in early 2022. Its team doubled in size that year with plans to grow even more in 2023. Now, after over six years of total development time and positive responses to the project from current and former Blizzard employees, the game has been canceled by Microsoft and its developers are out of jobs.

"I've been let go from Blizzard, along with many many others on the Survival team," wrote Matt London, the game's former associate narrative director, on X today.

Other Blizzard survival game developers who announced their departures include senior concept artist Marby Kwong, designer Ates Bayrak, senior software engineer Renato Iwashima, gameplay programmer Michael Dale, character technical artist Matheus Lima, VFX artist Rachel Quitevis, and producer Megan Embree, who had worked at Blizzard for 13 years.

The survival game's director, Craig Amai, was also laid off, and says he's now focused on helping the rest of the former survival game team land on their feet. "If you're looking for talent, the crew coming out of the Unannounced Survival Game are abnormally high quality—I cannot recommend them enough," Amai wrote in a post on LinkedIn.

Blizzard's survival game was announced as a new world "different from any Blizzard has created." Two pieces of concept art, the only material that was ever released, showed modern-day humans in a fantasy realm with a floating castle visible through overgrown forests, as well as a hooded forest ranger who wouldn't be out of place on League of Legends' roster. The crossover of this imagery suggested a premise like The Chronicles of Narnia, where ordinary children are drafted into another world inhabited by fantasy creatures.

The game was well liked within Blizzard. When it was announced in January 2022, current and former Blizzard employees publicly praised the survival game team and project—and this was at the height of mistrust and anger over allegations of sexism at the company.

This team is nuts and nice and the project is like... UGH. SO COOL," said Blizzard artist Melissa Kelly at the time.

"All I can say is it's gonna absolutely rock," said novelist and Blizzard writer Christie Golden. "Hella beautiful too. I cannot wait!"

"This is a project that will have a big impact on the industry," said Geoffrey Virtue, executive producer of Teamfight Tactics at Riot, who had formerly co-led the survival game project at Blizzard.

Former Blizzard president Mike Ybarra, who also exited the company this week, said after the 2022 announcement that he'd "played many hours" of the game and was "incredibly excited about the team's vision and the brand-new world it presents for players to immerse themselves in together."

Praise for the project on social media was so enthusiastic after the announcement that some wondered if Blizzard had encouraged its employees to talk it up online. We asked, and Blizzard told us that it had not: "We have a talented team creating this game, and we're happy to see their genuine enthusiasm for their work, and others' excitement to share it," a spokesperson said at the time.

The survival game's cancellation and layoffs are part of 1,900 job cuts across Activision Blizzard and other Microsoft gaming companies.

According to a report from Bloomberg, development of the survival game was slow in part because the team switched from Unreal Engine to an internal engine called Synapse.

"As difficult as making these decisions are, experimentation and risk taking are part of Blizzard's history and the creative process," Blizzard spokesperson Andrew Reynolds told the publication. "Ideas make their way into other games or in some cases become games of their own. Starting something completely new is among the hardest things to do in gaming, and we're immensely grateful to all of the talented people who supported the project."

The former Blizzard survival game developers now face an aspect of working in games that I've heard a number of developers lament before: On top of the threat of being laid off, they face the threat of being laid off before they've been able to release anything.

A requirement often found in game development job listings is some number of "shipped games," meaning games that have been released. A current Blizzard job listing for a lead gameplay engineer requires "at least one shipped title," for example. Not only do the Blizzard survival game developers who've been let go this week get no shipped game for their resumes, they can't even talk openly about what it was they were making.


(https://i.imgur.com/QoSO2B5.png)


https://www.cnbc.com/2024/01/26/tech-layoffs-jump-in-january-as-alphabet-meta-microsoft-reach-high.html

QuoteThe S&P 500 is trading at a record and the Nasdaq is at its highest in two years. Alphabet shares reached a new pinnacle on Thursday, as did Meta and Microsoft, which ran past $3 trillion in market cap.

Don't tell that to the bosses.

While Wall Street cheers on Silicon Valley, tech companies are downsizing at an accelerating clip. So far in January, some 23,670 workers have been laid off from 85 tech companies, according to the website Layoffs.fyi. That's the most since March, when almost 38,000 people in the industry were shown the exits.

Activity picked up this week with SAP announcing job changes or layoffs for 8,000 employees and Microsoft cutting 1,900 positions in its gaming division. Additionally, high-valued fintech startup Brex laid off 20% of its staff and eBay slashed 1,000 jobs, or 9% of its full-time workforce. Jamie Iannone, eBay's CEO, told employees in a memo that, "We need to better organize our teams for speed — allowing us to be more nimble, bring like-work together, and help us make decisions more quickly."

Earlier in the month, Google confirmed that it cut several hundred jobs across the company, and Amazon has eliminated hundreds of positions spanning its Prime Video, MGM Studios, Twitch and Audible divisions. Unity said it's cutting about 25% of its staff, and Discord, which offers a popular messaging service used by gamers, is shedding 17% of its workforce.

The swarm of activity comes ahead of a barrage of tech earnings next week, when Alphabet, Amazon, Apple, Meta and Microsoft are all scheduled to report quarterly results. Investors lauded the cost-cutting measures that companies put in place last year in response to rising inflation, interest rates hikes, recession concerns and a brutal market downturn in 2022. Even with an improving economic outlook, the thriftiness continues.

Layoffs peaked in January of last year, when 277 technology companies cut almost 90,000 jobs, as the tech industry was forced to reckon with the end of a more than decade-long bull market. Most of the rightsizing efforts took place in the first quarter of 2023, and the number of cuts proceeded to decline each month through September, before ticking up toward the end of the year.

One explanation for the January surge as companies budget for the year ahead: They've learned they can do more with less.

At Meta, in CEO Mark Zuckerberg's words, 2023 was the "year of efficiency," and the stock jumped almost 200% alongside 20,000 job cuts. Across the industry, artificial intelligence was the rallying cry as new generative AI technologies showed what was possible in automating customer service, booking travel and creating marketing campaigns.

[...]


Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Josquius on March 05, 2024, 02:26:49 PM
Soooo tonnes of articles being suggested to me lately about mass layoffs in the games industry, how we are on the brink of a complete crash like the US in the 80s and so on.

This sounds... Over the top. The indie scene is doing very well these days.
But are the traditional games companies dying?
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Jacob on March 05, 2024, 03:04:03 PM
Dunno...

I think people will be playing games for a long time, so there's going to be a market.

I think the major publishers have painted themselves into a bit of a corner on their risk and return. Everyone's gone all in on milking established franchises, but established franchises have gotten really tired. However, many of the majors have kind of lost the plot on how to make interesting new IP. Not only that, but they've lost the plot on how to do so without burning piles and piles of cash.

For the majors, the focus is the evergreen blockbuster. Spend hundreds and hundreds of millions on something that is massively popular and generates continual transaction revenue. But it's hard. So layoffs.

Indies can make good content (or fail to make good content), but can only absorb so much talent.

The Chinese majors are spending massive cash to make a play in the Western AAA market as a diversification strategy. That'll pick up some slack for a few years, but I'm ambivalent on whether they'll succeed.

IMO it's definitely the case that the massive organizations - both studios and publishers - have built up a bunch of cruft and lack of imagination. So there's a bit of reckoning happening there, which will suck for people who are directly affected.

... but I think games still have and will continue to have relevance.

IMO it's a good opportunity for indies to take some shots - if they can line up funding, so there's some scrappiness required.

But what the industry seem to be lacking right now is a nice predictable theory of how to profit for major investors. And that's going to involve some pain.

Something will come around at some point, I suppose.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Syt on March 05, 2024, 04:11:06 PM
Quote from: Jacob on March 05, 2024, 03:04:03 PMIMO it's a good opportunity for indies to take some shots - if they can line up funding, so there's some scrappiness required.

Probably a bunch of laid off folks may look at the indie track now. Yahtzee pointed out a few months back that there was a strong indie renaissance in Australia when a number of studios there went under.

Of course there's no dearth of indies these days, and it would be a struggle to stand out/gain visibility, but still. Silver linings and all that.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: The Minsky Moment on March 06, 2024, 09:46:50 AM
Quote from: Jacob on March 05, 2024, 03:04:03 PMI think the major publishers have painted themselves into a bit of a corner on their risk and return. Everyone's gone all in on milking established franchises, but established franchises have gotten really tired. However, many of the majors have kind of lost the plot on how to make interesting new IP. Not only that, but they've lost the plot on how to do so without burning piles and piles of cash.

We've discussed this in the thread; it's a malign feedback loop.  With so much money at stake in each title, the majors seek to control risk by sticking to established franchises; but raising the bar on the franchise to keep fans happy means constantly increasing budgets.

The alternative would be spending less per title on new IP and diversifying across more projects but than you are just trying to replicate being multiple indie studios under a single corporate roof, which is a significant management challenge and sort of defeats the purpose of being a major.

This is how you get to the point where Nintendo bases its holiday push around a new Zelda and Mario game, and Sony's big new release is a remake of a 90s PS1 game.  Even Helldivers is decade old IP.

QuoteBut what the industry seem to be lacking right now is a nice predictable theory of how to profit for major investors.

There isn't any.  If gaming keeps moving towards streaming subscription, which is what has happened in music and movies/TV and seems a logical endpoint, then experience shows that the content creators get squeezed. If it doesn't, tastes are too fickle and cycles to unpredictable to generate reliable investor returns.

MSFT has the right idea just throwing wads of cash to cover every base: publishing, streaming, hardware, OS, AI.  They may not make any money but they will end up with a strategic position somewhere.  It's a tougher choice for the players that don't have 3 trillion in market cap to work with.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Syt on March 06, 2024, 09:51:10 AM
Warner Brothers have said that after the high of Hogwart's Legacy last year and the low of Suicide Squad this year they want to move away from such tentpole releases and rather focus on free to play live service games with their franchises (DC, Harry Potter etc.) with constant steady revenue streams across various platforms (including mobile).
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: The Minsky Moment on March 06, 2024, 10:21:21 AM
Capcom has a steam sale right now and it demonstrates the point. Almost everything is a 20+ year old franchise.

Quote from: Syt on March 06, 2024, 09:51:10 AMWarner Brothers have said that after the high of Hogwart's Legacy last year and the low of Suicide Squad this year they want to move away from such tentpole releases and rather focus on free to play live service games with their franchises (DC, Harry Potter etc.) with constant steady revenue streams across various platforms (including mobile).

Problem with mobile FTP is that you are playing the attention economy game.  As the space gets more saturated, attention is zero sum.  It does probably have cost advantages though.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Josquius on March 06, 2024, 06:14:30 PM
The take I've heard and agree with, and also honestly sounds quite nice, is that the days of AAA games are done.
Budgets and development times are just getting ever more bloated and silly to the point where you get lots of games like Shenmue: a great game but so expensive to develop every dream cast owner would have needed to buy 3 copies or something like so.

It really leads back again to the death of consoles. Which is sad but has been a long time coming.
Ever since the PS3 era new generations of power haven't really given much in the way new generations did in the past.
It's surprisingly really that things stumbled on for another 2 generations.

Quote from: Syt on March 06, 2024, 09:51:10 AMWarner Brothers have said that after the high of Hogwart's Legacy last year and the low of Suicide Squad this year they want to move away from such tentpole releases and rather focus on free to play live service games with their franchises (DC, Harry Potter etc.) with constant steady revenue streams across various platforms (including mobile).

Ugh. This is what happened to so much of the Japanese games industry.
Could it be yet another case where Japan isn't weird and merely ahead of the pack?
I'd like to hope not. Surely the age of crappy mobile games is past?
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Jacob on March 07, 2024, 01:09:28 PM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on March 06, 2024, 09:46:50 AMWe've discussed this in the thread; it's a malign feedback loop.  With so much money at stake in each title, the majors seek to control risk by sticking to established franchises; but raising the bar on the franchise to keep fans happy means constantly increasing budgets.

The alternative would be spending less per title on new IP and diversifying across more projects but than you are just trying to replicate being multiple indie studios under a single corporate roof, which is a significant management challenge and sort of defeats the purpose of being a major.

This is how you get to the point where Nintendo bases its holiday push around a new Zelda and Mario game, and Sony's big new release is a remake of a 90s PS1 game.  Even Helldivers is decade old IP.

What makes sense to me is some sort of funnel:

Invest in multiple indie studios (don't necessarily own them). Take the cream of the crop of those, identify what's good, then invest in bringing them into the AA or lower segment of the AAA space. Select your major AAA bets from whichever IPs succeed in the AA / lower-end AAA segment.

The obvious disadvantage to that strategy is that it's long term, taking probably at least a decade from "indie" to major AAA bet.

The other perhaps less obvious disadvantage is that it requires executive leadership to build an organization that has the ability to identify quality and potential and is able and willing to bet on those.

There may be other disadvantages that could explain why we're not seeing majors attempt to build that type of ecosystem and pipeline... though I do think that's part of the Tencent/ NetEase strategy.

QuoteThere isn't any.  If gaming keeps moving towards streaming subscription, which is what has happened in music and movies/TV and seems a logical endpoint, then experience shows that the content creators get squeezed. If it doesn't, tastes are too fickle and cycles to unpredictable to generate reliable investor returns.

When you say content creators, do you primarily mean the major studios or also smaller players like indie studios and individual production companies?

If tastes are too fickle and cycles too unpredictable to generate reliable investor returns, it makes sense that major investors pull back. That seems very logical. But content is still being produced - and the streaming networks presumably will need some volume of new content in addition to their back catalogues. Where does it come from? How is it funded?

QuoteMSFT has the right idea just throwing wads of cash to cover every base: publishing, streaming, hardware, OS, AI.  They may not make any money but they will end up with a strategic position somewhere.  It's a tougher choice for the players that don't have 3 trillion in market cap to work with.

So I'm not super plugged into the streaming TV/film industry even as a consumer, but my impression is that there are indications that we might be moving back to something like the cable model? Maybe not?

What is the model in general? Obviously audiences still want to consume content, and content is being produced. Some of it even seems innovative and interesting. What are the prevailing models in film/TV? Other than the major streaming networks, who are prospering? And is any of that potentially applicable in game dev, do you think?
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Jacob on March 07, 2024, 01:20:18 PM
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on March 06, 2024, 10:21:21 AMProblem with mobile FTP is that you are playing the attention economy game.  As the space gets more saturated, attention is zero sum.  It does probably have cost advantages though.

Yeah, I think it's a pretty cut-throat field. As long as enough people are in love with your IP, you can continue milking them.

In my eyes the problem facing the industry (or rather the major publishers, but close enough) is:

1) How not to fumble your IPs and keeping them alive.
2) What to do once your IP starts fading.

"Focusing on FTP, live-service" is not a strategy to answer either of those questions, IMO. It's a strategy to efficiently milk your IP before either 1) or 2) becomes too big a problem.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Jacob on March 07, 2024, 01:26:41 PM
Random tidbit: was talking to my boss and he relayed a conversation he'd had with someone quite senior in the industry, who said "if 2023 was the year of major layoffs, 2024 will be the year of studio closures."

Sounds fairly reasonable to me. I guess we'll see.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: The Minsky Moment on March 08, 2024, 11:13:18 AM
Quote from: Jacob on March 07, 2024, 01:09:28 PMThe obvious disadvantage to that strategy is that it's long term, taking probably at least a decade from "indie" to major AAA bet.

The other perhaps less obvious disadvantage is that it requires executive leadership to build an organization that has the ability to identify quality and potential and is able and willing to bet on those.

Right there is why it is going to be close to impossible for a significant publicly traded company to do that.  It's a lot of work and patience for a return that is modest in proportion to the size of the overall company.

QuoteWhen you say content creators, do you primarily mean the major studios or also smaller players like indie studios and individual production companies?

If tastes are too fickle and cycles too unpredictable to generate reliable investor returns, it makes sense that major investors pull back. That seems very logical. But content is still being produced - and the streaming networks presumably will need some volume of new content in addition to their back catalogues. Where does it come from? How is it funded?
. . .
So I'm not super plugged into the streaming TV/film industry even as a consumer, but my impression is that there are indications that we might be moving back to something like the cable model? Maybe not?

If we look at music - where streaming is most advanced - the big labels do OK, but not as well as in the CD golden age of the 80s and 90s.  The individual artists have been squeezed. The platforms ironically are squeezed as well - at least Spotify has proved to be a consistent money loser.  The other big streamers are folded into much bigger groups.  The consumer is getting a great deal, at least as compared to the old model.  But the labels probably felt they had no choice after the napster debacle.

Movies/TV is probably a better comp for games - a AAA game these days is basically an interactive movie with a script, actors etc. and movies these days use a lot of coding one way or another. In movies and TV, content creators initially did very well as competing streamers bid for new content but that dynamic has reversed as the space matures and the appetite for absorbing enormous losses at the platform level has receded. You are right that costs have allowed cable to become more competitive but "cable" is converging to OTT streaming - a cable sub now brings access to individual streaming service options plus VoD.  Gen X is probably the last generation for which scheduled TV programming has real meaning and resonance. 

I don't know what the future will bring, but the big writers-SAG strikes seemed like a pyrrhic victory.  The creatives were given the battle because it is only a matter of time before they lose the war. The studios can't count on blank checks from Netlflix, Amazon and Apple indefinitely; so they will substitute capital for labor to control costs while supplying a steady stream of quantity.  The promise of streaming and "peak TV" was that freed from the need to chase to middle for Nielson ratings, you would free up creative energies for an endless series of Sopranos, Wires, Breaking Bads, etc.  There is a some of that still, but also a lot of milking the hell out of franchises.

Streaming has been slow to take on with gaming, but I think that is because for the moment, MSFT has been ceded a monopoly position and has been content to move gradually.  Gamepass is a ridiculously good value for the consumer. PC game pass is 120 per year at list; if you buy codes gray market, you can get ultimate for that same price. It offers a huge library that can played on a wide variety of platforms.  It's hard to see why people would drop $70 on a single AAA release when gamepass exists. That is due in part to MSFT moving slow to limit losses and FOMO over out of  offerings not available on GP; but MSFT's acquisition of big studios and committing to Day 1 GP releases could shift that dynamic.  [It should be pointed that Sony's offering is also good value even at newly raised prices - however, Sony's awful marketing and implementation seems deliberately intended to push people to the preferred traditional model of consumption]

If streaming does prevail, then the larger studios will trade the big profit potential of hits for more steady income flows and the smaller players will struggle to avoid freeze out.  They will either have to sign bad deals with GP or play the steam discounting game.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Jacob on March 09, 2024, 03:11:30 AM
Thanks for that analysis Minsky. It'll take a bit for me to digest it.

What I'm continually trying to figure out (and I'm obviously not the only one :D ) is what are the most viable paths (i.e. the least shitty paths) for content creators given the state of affairs you outline. I have some ideas, but it's getting late... broadly I guess it's about smaller players taking on more of the risk, and then publishers picking up games once they've been validated more thoroughly... and that's kind of what I'm seeing anecdotally in places.

Though that leaves the publishers in a position where they're at risk of being bypassed - because if a new game has been validated more thoroughly, the developer could potentially take it directly to the consumers or the streaming services.

Fundamentally I think there's still going to be an appetite for good new content. What I'd like to understand better is how that is going to be generated, given current market forces.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: crazy canuck on March 12, 2024, 10:07:06 AM
Why do developers need publishers?  Why can't they just always go direct to the streaming services?

Other words, what value does a publisher give to a developer?
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: celedhring on March 12, 2024, 10:36:19 AM
Quote from: crazy canuck on March 12, 2024, 10:07:06 AMWhy do developers need publishers?  Why can't they just always go direct to the streaming services?

Other words, what value does a publisher give to a developer?

If it's anything like the movie/TV industry (which is the one I'm most familiar), the answer is funding (and risk sharing), industry contacts, and marketing.

There's a reason why most success "direct to consumer" videogame stories are small games with crowfunding of some sort.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: celedhring on March 12, 2024, 10:40:08 AM
And I agree with Misnky's analysis, btw. The vibes we're getting post-strike from the movie/TV industry are pretty dire.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Tamas on March 12, 2024, 10:55:02 AM
Quote from: crazy canuck on March 12, 2024, 10:07:06 AMWhy do developers need publishers?  Why can't they just always go direct to the streaming services?

Other words, what value does a publisher give to a developer?

Steam is absolutely saturated with crap. Unless you have a good game that really, and I mean REALLY, manages to catch the zeitgest of the season, good luck raising attention to it without a publisher's established ways and audience to do that for you. And that's without accounting for the fact that in my experience most lone/small team developers can very much use some professional input on design and whatnot. The latter is much less important if you are coming from an industry background, obvs.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Josquius on March 12, 2024, 02:11:03 PM
The big publishers certainly have hefty clout.
Saw a LinkedIn post from an indie developer the other day lamenting How EA had rereleased 12 games in a day... Which happened to be her release day and pushed her game way down the new and trending chart, which is key to success.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Jacob on March 12, 2024, 05:59:28 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on March 12, 2024, 10:07:06 AMWhy do developers need publishers?  Why can't they just always go direct to the streaming services?

Other words, what value does a publisher give to a developer?

Several reasons, but bottom line IMO is money.

Most developers don't have the cash to fund a full project, or if they do they're typically betting the entire business on that one game.

Beyond that, (good) publishers also provide marketing support, potentially access to better value specialist resources within their network, and quality market research. But money is the real factor.

Right now I have a game that I think would be really good. If I had the budget - say $10 million - I'm pretty confident that I can pull together a team, build a studio, and deliver that game.

My options are:

1) Convince the public that this game is awesome enough that they'll crowdfund it. That's a pretty specialized skill to have, and the odds are fairly low. I don't think I'll succeed there.

2) Convince a publisher that they should fund it. This is a steep hill to climb in various ways, but more realistic than convincing the public. At least I know the route and the challenges.

3) Have personal connections to rich people that allow me to convince them to fund a game studio as a silent partner. I know some folks who are rich, but I don't think I can cajole $10M out of them for something like this.

4) Somehow convince the team to work for essentially free. Also difficult.

As for the Streaming services, from my point of view to the extent that they fund development they're simply a slightly different flavour of publisher.

Basically what the publishers do is provide the funding and take on the majority of the financial risk, in return for the majority of the (potential) financial upside.
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: crazy canuck on March 13, 2024, 09:12:13 AM
Thanks all for your explanations  :)
Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: viper37 on March 13, 2024, 12:10:21 PM
Quote from: Jacob on March 12, 2024, 05:59:28 PM3) Have personal connections to rich people that allow me to convince them to fund a game studio as a silent partner. I know some folks who are rich, but I don't think I can cajole $10M out of them for something like this.
Trust me, you won't.

I've walked around very rich people lately, people who's biggest concern is they're buying a new white pick up at 125 000$ or they grey one for 135 000$ and they'll argue over every penny for an investment they are making.  No problem spending astronomical amounts (relative to their wealth) on leisure, but to spend anything on an investment, for about the same amount, they are misers.

Title: Re: News from the lovely world of the Games Industry.
Post by: Syt on March 27, 2024, 11:58:33 PM
https://www.pcgamer.com/gaming-industry/flagging-megacorp-embracer-group-is-now-selling-off-gearbox-entertainment-to-take-two-for-dollar460-million/

QuoteFlagging megacorp Embracer Group is now selling off Gearbox Entertainment to Take-Two for $460 million

Swedish games behemoth Embracer Group bought Gearbox for $1.3 billion back in 2021. Just over three years later, Embracer Group is divesting Gearbox Entertainment to 2K Games and Rockstar parent company Take-Two Entertainment for $460 million. The acquisition is expected to finalize by the end of June.

Embracer will retain one piece of the Gearbox pie however, in the form of Gearbox Publishing San Francisco, which holds publishing rights to the Remnant series and Hyper Light Breaker, in addition to "other notable unannounced game releases". The remaining arm of the business will be renamed.

Embracer Group has been ruthlessly downsizing to stay afloat, after years of seemingly monthly studio and publisher acquisitions. It sold off Saber Interactive last month to the tune of $247 million, and laid off around 1,400 people in 2023. Last year it shut Saints Row studio Volition and Square Enix Montreal, to name just a small handful of its big contractions. Rumors that Gearbox was on the out started as far back as September last year.

Embracer's recent doom and gloom is in stark contrast to 2021-22: those were the days when the company was making huge acquisitions ranging from Lord of the Rings through to some of Square Enix's former tentpole western studios, and receiving big investments from Saudi Arabia. But following the collapse of a $2 billion deal in 2023, which prompted an immediate and "comprehensive" restructuring of the business, most of the studios brought under the Embracer Group umbrella have suffered to one extent or another. Needless to say, a hell of a lot must have rested on that deal.

"Today's announcement marks the result of the final structured divestment process and is an important step in transforming Embracer into the future with notably lower net debt and improved free cash flow," Embracer CEO Lars Wingefors said in a prepared statement. "Through the transaction, we lower business risk and improve profitability as we transition to becoming a leaner and more focused company."

Gearbox founder and CEO Randy Pitchford had his say as well: "As a significant long-term Embracer Group shareholder, I believe in the strategy for the Embracer Group going forward and am completely convinced that this transaction is the best possible scenario and an obvious net positive arrangement for Embracer Group, for Take-Two and, of course, for Gearbox Entertainment. My primary interest is always Gearbox, especially our talent and our customers. I want to personally assure fans of our games that this arrangement will ensure that the experiences we have in development at Gearbox will be the best they can possibly be."

Take-Two CEO Strauss Zelnick also indicated in his own prepared statement that these corporate machinations are for the greater good. Gearbox will fall under the 2K umbrella as a studio, presumably with a focus on Borderlands games, which 2K has published since the series started in 2009. For its $460 million, Take-Two also gets other Gearbox IP including Homeworld, Risk of Rain, Brothers in Arms, and Duke Nukem.