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#41

Off the Record / Re: Brexit and the waning days...

Last post by Sheilbh - Today at 09:05:32 AM

Yes, GDS used to be brilliant. Not just for government brilliant, but actually brilliant-brilliant. It set a lot of standards which became the norm across the field.
And yup...they decided penny pinching was the way forward and now bring on consultants for thrice the price on isolated projects, not continuously building and being engaged in something.

Yeah but it's not just penny pinching and basically this government.

I think there's too separate trends that are kind of coalescing in this.

One is the way the civil service works - as I say, since at least Harold Wilson's government 60 years ago there have been numerous independent reports highlighting the problem of the civil service preference for generalists and disdain for deep, specialist expertise. That everything is really understood through their own career ladder and structure - so the idea of someone staying in the same area of policy (like energy market regulation) or practice (like procurement, digital services) is just absolutely alien to the civil service and they cannot accommodate it - I think it's striking that the one area I think that does happen is for lawyers, who basically have their own guild privileges. To that I'd add that basically every minister in all parties who either knows their area very well or tries to do something quite big, has found the civil service is a bit of an obstacle (Tony Blair's "scars on my back" speech). I think those two things are possibly linked.

The other big trend that I think has happened around consultancy is similar but a little different which is that the civil service focus is policy not delivery. It's not doing things and I think part of that is also simply because of the peace dividend. I think lots of people would point to neo-liberalism/Thatcher but I'm not so sure - I think the shift was the 90s and in the 80s the British state still did things (and had to), if only because of the Cold War. I think it's in the 90s when it's the other layer of peace dividend that you get more efficiency from outsourcing, from external expertise etc - which is all true (but as all systems contain the seeds of their own end) also means that the internal capacity was diminished over time.

I can't help but wonder about this in Ukraine. Broadly speaking in Europe there is overwhelming public support for Ukraine, strong statements of support from political leaders and I think intent - but we are failing in a war of production. And I can't help but wonder if part of that is fundamentally that we have, in Europe, basically diminished our state capacity from that maximalist version of the mid-20th century with expansive welfare states/social systems and Cold War responsibilities? And that we're now at the stage where it is very difficult to do things if it hasn't already been set up? The industries that existed to support that state, but was subordinate to it (like Europe's multi-billion dollar arms industry) now are primarily export sectors.

I wonder if the combination of the peace dividend, the impact of China and Eastern Europe helping cut inflation in the 90s and 00s (despite energy challenges) but also generally available energy means there's a generation of leaders but also civil servants who simply have no experience of really thinking about the world, the state and their job in material terms of production, supply etc. I think of Rory Stewart's (as a former civil servant and then politician) line about the shock of being back in a "19th century style world" where ownership of raw materials, production capacity etc is really important and politicised - and I just think that it always was, it's just that on the end of benign impacts of that for most of the last 30 years European states (with the partial exceptions of France and Italy) kind of forgot about it/pretended it wasn't and inadvertently hollowed themselves.

#42

Off the Record / Re: Brexit and the waning days...

Last post by Sheilbh - Today at 08:50:11 AM

Quite funny that government for some reason decided to offer a free photo portrait of King Charles to various institutions - some you kind of expect like courts and otherwise it's a bit of a grab-bag.

Anyway the union for university academics have called it "culture war nonsense", while the association representing imams has said that they're frustrated that mosques are not entitled to a free portrait (but CofE churches are) as they would quite like one

#43

Off the Record / Re: Brexit and the waning days...

Last post by Josquius - Today at 06:26:11 AM

Yes, GDS used to be brilliant. Not just for government brilliant, but actually brilliant-brilliant. It set a lot of standards which became the norm across the field.
And yup...they decided penny pinching was the way forward and now bring on consultants for thrice the price on isolated projects, not continuously building and being engaged in something.

[2278]

#44

Off the Record / Re: TV/Movies Megathread

Last post by Syt - Today at 05:51:31 AM

Cheers S9, Ep. 12 (Dec 13, 1990). The B-plot is about Cliff wanting to have his head cryogenically frozen after death. At the start Frasier says, "I don't necessarily believe that Cliff's severed head will be brought back to life in the year 2278 ... but who knows? I mean, who can predict the future?"

15 months later, Star Trek TNG's "Cause and Effect" aired, with the crew stuck in a time loop where Enterprise explodes every time colliding with another ship emerging from a time rift. When they finally break the loop, the other ship is the USS Bozeman, captained by Cpt. Bateson:



Captain Jean-Luc Picard: Captain... do you know what year this is?
Captain Bateson: Of course I do. It's 2278.

(Btw, I didn't realize that this TNG episode came out almost a year before Groundhog Day )

#45

Off the Record / Re: Brexit and the waning days...

Last post by Sheilbh - Today at 05:43:25 AM

Yep, much better to be a consultant to government than an employee.

Yeah - again Cummings had a really interesting idea and set up a Crown Consultancy Service (a bit like Government Legal Service, Government Digital Service and Crown Commercial Services).

The idea was set up a separate career path for consultants to government that is owned and funded by government, but not part of the civil service that all government departments could use (like the way they do for legal, digital and procurement). Ultimately, hopefully, reducing the (massive) amount of money government spends on consultancy to do it in house but still get the benefits of consultants - ideally ones who do loads of government and would hopefully be really skilled.

Needless to say it has since been swallowed by the civil service and recently shut down. Similarly I've heard that GDS which was once very good has been pretty serially downgraded. I know that the Crown Commercial Service struggle. The Government Legal Service is still very good. But I think the civil service struggles with metabolising anyone (particularly anyone senior) who is not within their structure and their pyramid with their incentives.

Separately I think the revolving door of government, consultancy and vendors would be where I'd say there's most corruption of a kind.

I have noticed with the civil service a few years ago it seemed like a decent career option, I interviewed for a few positions in my time (recently learned you always need 5 years continuous residence or you fail their security checks and are rejected, something which they never said outright, which makes me feel a bit better about them).
But as I've progressed a bit more I've noticed they've stayed the same, and would now be quite a salary drop if I were to go down that path.

Yeah I think the same. I remember looking at civil service when I graduated and I think it seemed like a decent career option the pay was about the same as other graduate schemes - not top end but solid - and then seemed to progress pretty well.

It doesn't look like it's moved at all and I know there have been pay freezes but at a certain point, especially for an organisation with lots of people renting in London, you need to keep pace with reality.

#46

Off the Record / Re: Hungarian Politics

Last post by Tamas - Today at 05:23:47 AM

I'm shocked Hungary got hacked and the government denied it.

Less surprising to me would be they're wide open with Russia by choice and claim they were hacked.

I was thinking it would not surprise me one bit if the Foreign Minister was asked for some admin credentials and he gave it to them.

#47

Off the Record / Re: Hungarian Politics

Last post by The Brain - Today at 05:20:32 AM

I do very much hope, as much as that pains me, that all NATO states treat the Hungarian government as hostile agents and keep classified stuff well away from them, because clearly they must assume that anything the Hungarian government reads the Russians are reading as well.

Sweden even sold some extra Gripens to Hungary recently. It was probably considered reasonable as it was part of the pricetag for NATO membership, and information on the Gripen C system is already known to Russia since Hungary has had it for years.

#48

Off the Record / Re: Hungarian Politics

Last post by Josquius - Today at 05:16:58 AM

I'm shocked Hungary got hacked and the government denied it.

Less surprising to me would be they're wide open with Russia by choice and claim they were hacked.

#49

Off the Record / Re: Brexit and the waning days...

Last post by crazy canuck - Today at 05:16:27 AM

Yep, much better to be a consultant to government than an employee.

#50

Off the Record / Re: Brexit and the waning days...

Last post by Josquius - Today at 05:13:59 AM

I have noticed with the civil service a few years ago it seemed like a decent career option, I interviewed for a few positions in my time (recently learned you always need 5 years continuous residence or you fail their security checks and are rejected, something which they never said outright, which makes me feel a bit better about them).
But as I've progressed a bit more I've noticed they've stayed the same, and would now be quite a salary drop if I were to go down that path.

I also know they make heavy use of contractors rather than directly employed people...which doubtless costs them a lot more.