Recent posts

#31

Off the Record / Re: The China Thread

Last post by Sheilbh - May 09, 2024, 08:22:44 PM

Perhaps if China dominates energy generation and storage technology, they might use it to influence the international order in ways we don't like and harm Western economies.

Could be a risk.

Yeah. Generation, storage and end use - and a strategy of establishing control of supply chain including raw materials.

And it makes sense from China's perspective - they're more exposed to climate change than most rich western countries and also don't want their energy security be exposed to others as it is with oil and gas (which is why, at the same time, they're still expanding coal). And why I think the US and EU are starting to respond in a similar way. But also I am quite persuaded by the energy theory of the world and that it's an important part of the countries who dominated the 19th and 20th centuries - and I'm not sure the 21st will be different.

Edit: And - at the same time - it is good for the world overall/net zero. Which I find challenging to think about.

#32

Off the Record / Re: The China Thread

Last post by Jacob - May 09, 2024, 08:12:03 PM

Perhaps if China dominates energy generation and storage technology, they might use it to influence the international order in ways we don't like and harm Western economies.

Could be a risk.

#33

Off the Record / Re: The China Thread

Last post by HVC - May 09, 2024, 08:07:58 PM

Fair enough, and I didn't think you were attacking me personally . My view on China is always "they're lying" so my view on anything related to China is ignore them and do what you have to, be it economics, environment, or political.

Not to say you shouldn't push or try to get them to do the right thing, just don't rely on their response for anything

#34

Off the Record / Re: The China Thread

Last post by Admiral Yi - May 09, 2024, 08:06:48 PM

But at the same time, China is doing it and making genuinely astonishing progress which might be good for the world but also building in dominance in key sectors that is bad for the West and our order.

Are you talking about producing solar panels or something else?  Why would their dominance be bad for the West?

#35

Off the Record / Re: The China Thread

Last post by Sheilbh - May 09, 2024, 08:01:26 PM

Just because I don't trust China doesn't mean I don't think we shouldnt do something. In fact i think relying on the china's of the world is folly. Like you said While we need 3rd world nations to get on board looking to them gives the west an excuse not to do what it needs. On both sides of the coin, as in "they don't reduce emissions so us doing so isn't worth it" and "look, they're reducing emissions so we don't have to". So, from an internal policy prospective it's best to ignore them.

I get that and I didn't mean you specifically or that you think all of them. As I say it's the responses I often get (off here too) to talking about China in the context of climate is: that it's borderline denialist/saying we should do nothing; that it's fatalist, as in China won't do anything so we're all doomed anyway; and, when I actually say I think China is doing stuff, scepticism bordering on disbelief. I think the outlines of those responses are also common responses to a lot of stories out of or about China: does it really matter, we're all doomed anyway and is it real anyway. I think all of those are slight traps or can be misleading.

My view is basically we should keep acting and need to on climate. At the same time, we don't really matter in climate scheme of things that depends on what China does and India's path (obviously given historic emissions we should contribute more on damage and loss/climate reparations). But at the same time, China is doing it and making genuinely astonishing progress which might be good for the world but also building in dominance in key sectors that is bad for the West and our order.

#36

Off the Record / Re: Israel-Hamas War 2023

Last post by HVC - May 09, 2024, 07:57:24 PM

Did a little searching and found this. It's wiki, so you know...

A 2017 LifeWay poll conducted in United States found that 80% of evangelical Christians believed that the creation of Israel in 1948 was a fulfillment of biblical prophecy that would bring about Christ's return and more than 50% of Evangelical Christians believed that they support Israel because it is important for fulfilling the prophecy.[112

Wacky.

#37

Off the Record / Re: The China Thread

Last post by HVC - May 09, 2024, 07:50:19 PM

I don't trust India either, really, but I don't know as much about them in regards to fabricating stats to have an opinion in this area.

#38

Off the Record / Re: The China Thread

Last post by HVC - May 09, 2024, 07:49:17 PM

Just because I don't trust China doesn't mean I don't think we shouldnt do something. In fact i think relying on the china's of the world is folly. Like you said While we need 3rd world nations to get on board looking to them gives the west an excuse not to do what it needs. On both sides of the coin, as in "they don't reduce emissions so us doing so isn't worth it" and "look, they're reducing emissions so we don't have to". So, from an internal policy prospective it's best to ignore them.

#39

Off the Record / Re: The China Thread

Last post by Sheilbh - May 09, 2024, 07:42:59 PM

Maybe. Although as well as thinking it means we don't need to do something/fatalism - I think that sort of view can lead to complacency which I think is the other big risk in thinking about China

#40

Off the Record / Re: The China Thread

Last post by HVC - May 09, 2024, 07:34:32 PM

Promising, but at the same time I don't trust any numbers coming out of china. They're just as likely to paint solar panels on the roof of a new coal power plant to inflate numbers as much as anything else