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The liberal arts

Started by Ideologue, April 17, 2013, 09:55:59 PM

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Worth a damn?  Obviously not, but U-DECIDE

Still taught in HS and financed as non-teaching college degrees (status quo)
18 (45%)
Still taught in HS, not financed as non-teaching college degrees
4 (10%)
Not taught in HS... then we don't need specialized teaching degrees, now do we?
2 (5%)
I believe that all education is a benefit to hahahaha just kidding who would vote for this option?
11 (27.5%)
Only fund such degrees as offered at JIB University
2 (5%)
Other
3 (7.5%)

Total Members Voted: 40

mongers

Quote from: Iormlund on April 29, 2013, 09:22:24 PM
Quote from: Admiral Yi on April 29, 2013, 08:12:46 PM
The part that confounds me however, is how they insulate their labor market from the external accounts.  Why have they not priced themselves out of all export markets?  Why have their import competers not disappeared?

By focusing on sectors where either labor plays a minor part (petrochemical, energy, pharma) or cost is second is to other concerns like quality or robustness (pumps, actuators, instrumentation). R&D can play a big role here.
That's also how Germany manages to export shit. They are not exactly cheap either.

It's something you can see in traditional sectors as well. We've worked in a few newly-automated vineyards in the area.

Yes, it looks like sectors of the Danish economy have more in common with the German way of doing things than they do with a semi-mythic Nordic socialist paradise.
"We have it in our power to begin the world over again"

OttoVonBismarck

In general most empirical studies in the U.S. won't show a huge impact from upping the minimum wage because historically increases in the minimum wage have mostly just resulted in lots of low income workers having their wages be "closer to the floor" than they already were. Very few people actually get paid minimum wage, so it's an effective raise for such a small portion of the workforce it is not surprising it has little real impact on anyone. By the time the next minimum wage hike goes through, the low income workers whose wages were so low as to be near the "new minimum" have gotten enough adjustments upwards they're just ready to have the new floor come up to meet them.

Phillip V

As Hunger Strike Grows, Guantánamo Adds Staff

JOB OPPORTUNITY: "Medical reinforcements" needed at American prison in Cuba to help carry out force-feedings.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/01/us/guantanamo-adds-medical-staff-amid-hunger-strike.html

The Minsky Moment

Quote from: Admiral Yi on April 29, 2013, 06:50:27 PM
First of all, you chose an hourly wage that's already close to a lot of state minimum wages.  But if you were to really increase the minimum wage, I think the increase would be much more than a dime a purchase.  Cost of labor is the biggest input for a lot of markets.  You can't increase the price of your most significant input by a substantial amount and not expect to see any increase in output price.

Why do you think a Happy Meal costs $8 in the UK?  Why do you think a medium pizza costs $20 in Denmark?

It's not due to labor cost differentials, that's for sure.

Actually looking at the Economist's Big Mac Index, the cost of a Big Mac in the UK is slightly lower than in the US; the cost in Denmark is only slightly higher.  The most expensive Big Mac is in Venezuela by far; Brazil, Uruguay, Colombia and Turkey are also higher than the US price.
The purpose of studying economics is not to acquire a set of ready-made answers to economic questions, but to learn how to avoid being deceived by economists.
--Joan Robinson

The Minsky Moment

Quote from: alfred russel on April 29, 2013, 09:04:41 PM
Norway's service sector is probably comparatively smaller than most wealthy countries because of the oil industry crowding it out. The entire country only has something like 5-6 million people.

Correct.  Also the inflow of oil revenues keeps the kroner high.  Also the country is not connected to the large continental logistics hubs.
The purpose of studying economics is not to acquire a set of ready-made answers to economic questions, but to learn how to avoid being deceived by economists.
--Joan Robinson

MadImmortalMan

Quote from: mongers on April 29, 2013, 08:29:17 PM
I can't see that working as they have much less income inequality as compared to the US, it would more be like quadrupling minimum wage, doubling blue collar/low middle class, leaving the rest of the middle class even and probably halving and halving again the wealthy's income.

I think it's more likely that the wealthy simply leave. They get that low gini through attrition.
"Stability is destabilizing." --Hyman Minsky

"Complacency can be a self-denying prophecy."
"We have nothing to fear but lack of fear itself." --Larry Summers

Admiral Yi

Quote from: The Minsky Moment on April 30, 2013, 10:30:23 AM

It's not due to labor cost differentials, that's for sure.

Actually looking at the Economist's Big Mac Index, the cost of a Big Mac in the UK is slightly lower than in the US; the cost in Denmark is only slightly higher.  The most expensive Big Mac is in Venezuela by far; Brazil, Uruguay, Colombia and Turkey are also higher than the US price.

You sure you're not looking at Big Mac/average wages?  I have a hard time believing that the nominal price of a Big Mac is slightly lower in the UK than in the US.

Zanza

Quote from: Admiral Yi on April 29, 2013, 08:12:46 PM
The part that confounds me however, is how they insulate their labor market from the external accounts.  Why have they not priced themselves out of all export markets?  Why have their import competers not disappeared?
Here is the list of things they export according to CIA factbook:
machinery and instruments, meat and meat products, dairy products, fish, pharmaceuticals, furniture, windmills

Machinery and instruments is probably high-tech stuff that isn't easily substituted by a lower wage country. Meat, dairy and fish are probably sold locally and most of the poor countries in the world aren't able to compete with a highly efficient western agri-industrial farm anyway. Pharmaceuticals is probably not price sensitive either. Furniture can be automated in production and probably doesn't need much manpower. Windmills is high tech manufacturing and Denmark has one of the world market leaders.

The Minsky Moment

Quote from: Admiral Yi on April 30, 2013, 11:47:00 AM
You sure you're not looking at Big Mac/average wages? 

I was citing to the "raw index" which is just the price of a Big Mac in that country converted to US $.

I suspect based on the comments to the thread that you may be overrating the degree to which per hour labor costs determine final product costs or export competitiveness.
The purpose of studying economics is not to acquire a set of ready-made answers to economic questions, but to learn how to avoid being deceived by economists.
--Joan Robinson

alfred russel

After a meeting, someone had a random note about some form that no one had heard of. I sent out an email to the people in charge of the forms asking whether the form exists. I titled the message, "Existential Question on Forms".

I expected to be stoned when I walked into the office, but apparently no one got the joke. Liberal arts education in this country has gone to hell.
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

There's a fine line between salvation and drinking poison in the jungle.

I'm embarrassed. I've been making the mistake of associating with you. It won't happen again. :)
-garbon, February 23, 2014

The Brain

Quote from: alfred russel on May 01, 2013, 02:10:14 PM

I expected to be stoned when I walked into the office,

OK, FB.
Women want me. Men want to be with me.

alfred russel

They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

There's a fine line between salvation and drinking poison in the jungle.

I'm embarrassed. I've been making the mistake of associating with you. It won't happen again. :)
-garbon, February 23, 2014

Eddie Teach

Quote from: The Brain on May 01, 2013, 02:13:08 PM
Quote from: alfred russel on May 01, 2013, 02:10:14 PM

I expected to be stoned when I walked into the office,

OK, FB.

Most of his time at work he's wasted. Is that the best way to get high on the company ladder?
To sleep, perchance to dream. But in that sleep of death, what dreams may come?

Baron von Schtinkenbutt

Quote from: Jacob on April 19, 2013, 07:56:35 PM
Quote from: MadImmortalMan on April 19, 2013, 07:10:26 PM
How much is $200 a month in your earliest earning years going to be worth if invested and compounded over your career?

Who the fuck invests $200/month of their earliest earnings?

:unsure:

Baron von Schtinkenbutt

Quote from: Caliga on April 29, 2013, 02:33:23 PM
Quote from: MadImmortalMan on April 29, 2013, 02:29:19 PM
63k is about right for a network engineer type I'd say.

Even for a guy straight out of school with no experience? :hmm:

Yes.